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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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 Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:58 am Post subject: Livingstone suspended for Nazi comparison... |
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For those of you wondering why the Muslim world might be a little bit cynical about westerners' teary-eyed genuflections at the altar of free speech...
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London's mayor has been suspended from office for four weeks for comparing a Jewish journalist to a concentration camp guard.
The Adjudication Panel for England ruled Ken Livingstone had brought his office into disrepute when he acted in an "unnecessarily insensitive" manner.
The ban is due to begin on 1 March and the mayor's deputy Nicky Gavron will stand in for Mr Livingstone.
The mayor said: "This decision strikes at the heart of democracy."
He added: "Elected politicians should only be able to be removed by the voters or for breaking the law.
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Okay, Livingstone's not an average person, and maybe he has a special obligation to avoid using an insult that normally gets tossed around in political discussion like confetti at a wedding. And maybe this panel has the legal right to force him from office for making insulting remarks(though I gotta say I don't think I've ever heard of that happening before). But still. If this was a Muslim organization that launched the complaint that got the mayor suspended, does anyone doubt that the usual suspects would be calling it a "Muslim coup d'etat" and furiously quoting the one line from Voltaire that they've ever read?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/4746016.stm
Last edited by On the other hand on Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:25 am; edited 1 time in total |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:10 am Post subject: |
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Much as I despise Livingstone and his adherence to the most ridiculous PC orthodoxies, banning him is a bit silly, and a total waste of time and money.
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| If this was a Muslim organization that launched the complaint that got the mayor suspended, does anyone doubt that the usual suspects would be calling it a "Muslim coup d'etat" |
Livingstone is already a fully paid up Islamic apologist and would never say anything in the least 'Islamophobic'. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:18 am Post subject: |
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If this was a Muslim organization that launched the complaint that got the mayor suspended, does anyone doubt that the usual suspects would be calling it a "Muslim coup d'etat"
Livingstone is already a fully paid up Islamic apologist and would never say anything in the least 'Islamophobic'.
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Well, my question could be about what the reaction would be to some hypothetical non-Livingstone, non-London mayor saying something that offended Muslims.
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Much as I despise Livingstone and his adherence to the most ridiculous PC orthodoxies, banning him is a bit silly, and a total waste of time and money.
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Well, I give you points for consistency. But, just out of curiousity, would you use the word "silly" to describe the editor of the Times Of London getting fired for publishing the Danish cartoons? (hypothetical case, as far as I know) |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:29 am Post subject: |
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| Well, my question could be about what the reaction would be to some hypothetical non-Livingstone, non-London mayor saying something that offended Muslims. |
Public figures rarely say anything to offend muslims because they would be ejected from office, or quite possibly killed.
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| But, just out of curiousity, would you use the word "silly" to describe the editor of the Times Of London getting fired for publishing the Danish cartoons? (hypothetical case, as far as I know) |
No, I would describe it as an affront to freedom of speech. However, the role of a newspaper editor is rather different from that of a public official, and we do have rules about whether officials have brought their offices into disrepute. For example, it isn't illegal to get drunk and make crude jokes in public. However, such actions when committed by a public official, could be seen as bringing their office into disrepute. So, the Livingstone issue is not one of free speech, but a question of whether Livingstone is fit to be major of London. Personally, I don't think he is, but such a decision should be left to the people of London at the next election.
Personally, I think the man brought his office into far more disrepute when he embraced Sheikh 'Let's crush gays under stone walls' Qaradawi, but I still don't think he should have been punished in this way. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| So, the Livingstone issue is not one of free speech, but a question of whether Livingstone is fit to be major of London. |
Point taken. However, if hauling acid-tongued politicians into court became a common practice, I think many people would regard it, if not as an attack on free speech, then at least as a dangerous circumvention of the democratic process.
Andrew Sullivan, the pro-war, "pro-cartoons", Anglo-American conservative polemicist, is up in arms about this decision. And he makes some rather interesting comparisons. From his blog...
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The mayor of London, Ken Livingstone, is suspended for a few weeks because he said something vile and inappropriate to a reporter? Who has that power? I had no idea that in England, democracy is really a veil for a bunch of unelected prissy tut-tutters to pick who can and cannot govern. Here's Sharia law from the Jewish lobby in England:
"The London Jewish Forum welcomed the ruling, with chairman Adrian Cohen calling for the mayor to create a strategy which would ensure London's Jews would be treated with respect."
Screw that and screw them. Just do your job. And if you don't show enough "respect" for the voters, they can always throw you out of office.
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http://time.blogs.com/daily_dish/ |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 5:22 am Post subject: |
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| However, if hauling acid-tongued politicians into court became a common practice, I think many people would regard it, if not as an attack on free speech, then at least as a dangerous circumvention of the democratic process. |
I agree. The Jewish journalist and the newspaper involved should have just let it slide. People are far too sensitive these days. |
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VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
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| Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 6:27 am Post subject: |
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my father always says...
freedom of speech is
the freedom to say what you want, as long as you want, as long as nobody hears it |
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