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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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 Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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Kuros wrote:
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Bucheon Bum wrote:
The fact that there is a remote possablity it is true. Thanks to our actions in cuba and iraq, this man's claims aren't a total joke. prior to 9/11, he would have been laughed out of the room by everyone and there would be no doubt that he'd be full of BS
Notice that BB has made up his mind without knowing particular details. And he is dead right. |
Well, all BB has said is that the man's allegations have more credibility now than they would have pre-911. So the only facts he really needs to know in order back up his argument is that America's credibility is at a very low ebb.
Canuckistan, on the other hand, was stating a more specific opinion about the allegations against one individual. |
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The Bobster
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Al Qaida teaches their members to always claim torture. |
Therefore, those who claim torture are probably Al Qaida ... yup, makes perfect sense. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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Is there reason to believe that he is Al Qaida?
Let us forget any of his statements just for a moment
One of the organizers of the September 11 attacks, Mustafa al-Hawsawi, referred to al-Kahtani in intercepted telephone calls as "the last one" to "complete the group". On August 4, 2001, al-Kahtani flew into Orlando, Florida from Dubai. Mohammed Atta, the lead hijacker and pilot, drove to the Orlando International Airport to meet him, but al-Kahtani was being held by immigration officials. The officials were suspicious because al-Kahtani had little money, could speak no English, and used a one-way ticket. He frequently changed his story and could not adequately explain why he was visiting the United States. Thinking he was likely to become an illegal immigrant, al-Kahtani was sent back to Dubai. With the help of Hawsawi, he then travelled to Pakistan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohamed_al-Qahtani
Intercepted phone call. Of course you are against that but since it got an Al Qaidia guy I am all for it.
If he is Al Qaida or even sympathetic to Bin Laden( then there is no reason to believe him in fact there is every reason in the world not to believe him.
The same goes for anyone who is sympathetic to Bathism or Khomeni.
So if a guy who was with Hezzbollah said similar stuff then there would be no reason to believe him either. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| mithridates wrote: |
This thread is dumb. How is it possible that all of you (or most) have already made up your mind? I bet that no one here can even remember both of their names (the guy and the leader) without checking again.
Maybe Joo. |
Meh. This thread isn't as bad as your post. Honestly, because the Bush administration has extended its right to torture individuals whoever they are no matter what evidence they come by, BB's assertions stand true...
| Bucheon Bum wrote: |
| The fact that there is a remote possablity it is true. Thanks to our actions in cuba and iraq, this man's claims aren't a total joke. prior to 9/11, he would have been laughed out of the room by everyone and there would be no doubt that he'd be full of BS |
Notice that BB has made up his mind without knowing particular details. And he is dead right. |
What I meant is that people have made up their minds on whether he was tortured or not, and to what extent. As far as I know we don't have any access to the intelligence ourselves (as Korean expats) so I was wondering where all those comments were coming from.
Of course BB is dead right. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Al Qaida teaches their members to always claim torture. |
And the US military usually conducts itself so as to make such claims look very credible indeed.
Were there ever two organisations who deserved each other more? |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| mithridates wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| mithridates wrote: |
This thread is dumb. How is it possible that all of you (or most) have already made up your mind? I bet that no one here can even remember both of their names (the guy and the leader) without checking again.
Maybe Joo. |
Meh. This thread isn't as bad as your post. Honestly, because the Bush administration has extended its right to torture individuals whoever they are no matter what evidence they come by, BB's assertions stand true...
| Bucheon Bum wrote: |
| The fact that there is a remote possablity it is true. Thanks to our actions in cuba and iraq, this man's claims aren't a total joke. prior to 9/11, he would have been laughed out of the room by everyone and there would be no doubt that he'd be full of BS |
Notice that BB has made up his mind without knowing particular details. And he is dead right. |
What I meant is that people have made up their minds on whether he was tortured or not, and to what extent. As far as I know we don't have any access to the intelligence ourselves (as Korean expats) so I was wondering where all those comments were coming from.
Of course BB is dead right. |
Heh. Sorry, that was a PWI post, Mith. I was also in a bad mood. Ignore the needless criticism.  |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 5:01 am Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Al Qaida teaches their members to always claim torture. |
And the US military usually conducts itself so as to make such claims look very credible indeed.
Were there ever two organisations who deserved each other more? |
Well the US miltary makes mistakes but often it does the right thing too, probably it does the right thing far more often than the bad stuff.
Indeed the US during war behaves no worse than most armies during war time and probably better than most.
Al Qaida is a fascist hate group like the Klan who fights for the Caliphate where those of other relgious groups will be expelled , killed or made into slaves - there is no comparison. They fight for a sinister result.
By the way to an extent the US probably protects you from North Korea , or at least cause of it you pay lower Korean taxes cause w/o US forces S Korean defense spending would be much higher.
You are really desperate aren't you? |
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The Bobster
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| By the way to an extent the US probably protects you from North Korea , or at least cause of it you pay lower Korean taxes cause w/o US forces S Korean defense spending would be much higher. |
Relevance? Is there any? Um, I guess none here in Korea is allowed to criticize any action of the US govt, including torture ... yeah, right.
Being able to criticize our own govts is WHY we fight to remain free - do you really need that spelled out for you?
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| You are really desperate aren't you? |
Actually, that was my first thought about you when I read the comment posted above. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Relevance? Is there any? Um, I guess none here in Korea is allowed to criticize any action of the US govt, including torture ... yeah, right. |
he says the US deserves Al Qaida or something like that and implied that the US usually conducts itself in the worst way.
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| Being able to criticize our own govts is WHY we fight to remain free - do you really need that spelled out for you? |
that goes w/o saying even though he is Canadian. But at any rate his comment was dumb , innaccurate and probably slanderous.
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| Actually, that was my first thought about you when I read the comment posted above. |
Well you are the Bobster. You have always been kind of desperate too. Not effective - just desperate. |
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Wrench
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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USA never ratified any Geneva convention laws that prohibit torture. USA can legaly torture any one but then their own people are subject to the same cruel and unusual punishments.
As far as I am concrened if your and Al-Quada you should be skinned alive then lemon juice should be be dumped on you. |
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Hater Depot
Joined: 29 Mar 2005
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Wrench wrote: |
USA never ratified any Geneva convention laws that prohibit torture. USA can legaly torture any one but then their own people are subject to the same cruel and unusual punishments.
As far as I am concrened if your and Al-Quada you should be skinned alive then lemon juice should be be dumped on you. |
what about cab drivers? Should they be tortured?
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But there was violence in the prison. A man named Habibullah and a cab driver called Dilawar died only days after they had been brought in on suspicion of being Taliban fighters.
"They brought death upon themselves as far as I'm concerned," says Capt. Christopher Beiring, who was Brand's commanding officer as head of the prison guards. Beiring was charged with dereliction of duty, but the charge was later dropped. |
60 Minutes: The Court-Martial of Willie Brand
Your attitude is only slightly better than those you would like to receive lemon juice. |
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