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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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 Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 4:00 am Post subject: I am 16 yr old girl from Pakistan who needs your help |
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16 yr old girl from Pakistan who needs your help
Sir My Name is xxxx (Please Hide My Name) and I'm sixteen year old girl from xxxx, NWFP (North West Frontier Province) Pakistan. Almost 1 week ago I saw your website from my friend.
Sir I Have one very big trouble which I think you can solve. Sir I think I am Muslim and that's why you hate me but I maybe of your daughter or sister's age. Only a non-Muslim better an ex-Muslim can help me
Sir I live in an extremely conservative society. here in NWFP. Pakistani women don't have any rights. Here in our town there is only 1 girl's school where the dress is to wear a burqa. Sir my trouble is after 2 months (i.e. 1st week of November) my parents are going to marry me with my cousin who is almost twice my age and already has one wife. I am only 16 and according to Pakistani law my wedding is illegal. My going-to-be husband is illiterate and son of a mullah. I DON'T WANT TO MARRY HIM.
My friend married a man who already has 2 wives in advance. He beats her regularly like animal and without any reason. He even rapes my 16 year old friend. Sir in NWFP the practice of polygamy and female torture is considered to be a symbol of mardangi (man hood). I know that my future as an Muslim women is same. Whole life I have to spend in his house. Here women are not allowed to go to market and not allowed to talk with other man. Muslims treat women like an animal
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Testimonials/Sunshine50910.htm
My Journey to Freedom, by Meher Ali Khan
"When on the otherwise fine morning of 9/11, I switched on the TV and witnessed two planes hit the WTC with the building falling apart like a pack of card – I was amazed, stunned and delighted."
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Testimonials/MehrAliKhan.htm
A True Story on the Lives of Saudi Women By Khaled
Readers please do not be shocked at such an appalling treatment of our women—they are just like domestic animals--always owned by some one. They could not subsist on their own as human beings.
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Testimonials/Khaled60130.htm
Got rid of Islam
I am from a staunch American muslim family.
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Testimonials/Sunshine50910.htm
Since 1996, I've read and re-read the Qur'an and the Hadiths (which are even worse than the Qur'an), and I've always reached the same conclusion -- Islam is an absolute disaster for the entire world, for Christians, for Jews, for pagans, for atheists, for women, for children, and, most of all, for Muslims themselves
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Testimonials/ApostateSuccess50226.htm
http://www.faithfreedom.org/testimonials.htm |
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ed4444
Joined: 12 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 6:44 am Post subject: |
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30-ish Year old from Zimbabwe/GB needs help
See above post for details.... |
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patchy
Joined: 26 Apr 2005
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 7:09 am Post subject: |
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16 yr old girl from Pakistan who needs your help
Sir My Name is xxxx (Please Hide My Name) and I'm sixteen year old girl from xxxx, NWFP (North West Frontier Province) Pakistan. Almost 1 week ago I saw your website from my friend.
Sir I Have one very big trouble which I think you can solve. Sir I think I am Muslim and that's why you hate me but I maybe of your daughter or sister's age. Only a non-Muslim better an ex-Muslim can help me
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I agree, the Americans should invade Saudi Arabia.[/quote] |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 2:55 am Post subject: |
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Qoute patchy:
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| I agree, the Americans should invade Saudi Arabia |
At least 50% of the saudi population would secretly welcome them, hiding their feelings of joy and freedom behind their veils.
so big bird. Jaganath, Bucheon bum...any advice for our 16yr old? helloooo?
Mighty quiet around here all of a sudden..... |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
Qoute patchy:
| Quote: |
| I agree, the Americans should invade Saudi Arabia |
At least 50% of the saudi population would secretly welcome them, hiding their feelings of joy and freedom behind their veils.
so big bird. Jaganath, Bucheon bum...any advice for our 16yr old? helloooo?
Mighty quiet around here all of a sudden..... |
 I am the mother of a young child, and also currently undertaking postgraduate studies - that's a hell of a load - sorry if I can't always be around at rapier's beck n call.
Right now, I shouldn't even be browsing this time-eating forum. I might look at your thread again next week when I've handed in my assignment.
In the meantime, send me a list of things you want me to say, and that might save me some time! 
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out of context
Joined: 08 Jan 2006
Location: Daejeon
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| Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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Personally, I am heartened to see an organization with the mission of helping people throw off the yoke of a repressive and antiquated religion.
Frankly, I'm a bit surprised to see the OP of all people linking to such a website, which offers pearls such as the following:
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| In conclusion the concept of God did not descend from religions. Both religion and god are the inventions of man. They both evolved as human intellect kept growing. But today we have advanced to a stage that we no more can accept those antiquated and unverifiable dogmas of our forefathers. We can easily and logically disprove the existence of the god given to us by our ancestors and then enforced by the religions, but there is not a shred of evidence that can prove the existence of such deity. |
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina/origingod.htm
And:
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| When we use our knowledge and understanding we realize that to define god as a creator and to think that god has feelings is absurd. |
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/aliz/need_for_god.htm
I agree that if logic and reason are allowed to flourish, the brutal repression cited in the testimonials can be diminished and even, possibly, become a thing of a past. A cursory inspection of the site's content will show that what the designers have in mind begins and ends with the rejection of Islam and does not extend to (in fact, as the above quotes show, often summarily rejects) the acceptance of other monotheistic belief systems such as Christianity.
If only it were as easy as invading a country to save them from their own religious beliefs. But if it makes people feel like they're somehow helping, then I suppose it's the least they can do... |
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jaganath69
Joined: 17 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Big_Bird wrote: |
| rapier wrote: |
Qoute patchy:
| Quote: |
| I agree, the Americans should invade Saudi Arabia |
At least 50% of the saudi population would secretly welcome them, hiding their feelings of joy and freedom behind their veils.
so big bird. Jaganath, Bucheon bum...any advice for our 16yr old? helloooo?
Mighty quiet around here all of a sudden..... |
I am the mother of a young child, and also currently undertaking postgraduate studies - that's a hell of a load - sorry if I can't always be around at rapier's beck n call.
Right now, I shouldn't even be browsing this time-eating forum. I might look at your thread again next week when I've handed in my assignment.
In the meantime, send me a list of things you want me to say, and that might save me some time!
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I'm in the same boat, sans kid which I hope to be changing very soon. Too busy with assignments and plotting with other evil Muslim patriarchs to opress my future daughter/s and writing papers for postgrad studies. You can save me the stress and tell me what would your one true God do in this situation. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 5:26 am Post subject: |
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Not good enough, either of you.
but then I've always sensed that you both weren't aware of the reality.
The silence is very telling. Must be hard to argue the virtues of islam in the face of 100 ex muslims disagreeing with you.
Ah well sleep tight in your warm beds tonight eh? Who cares if millions of girls and women are trapped in brutal slavery- that you support. |
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jaganath69
Joined: 17 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 5:42 am Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
Not good enough, either of you.
but then I've always sensed that you both weren't aware of the reality.
The silence is very telling. Must be hard to argue the virtues of islam in the face of 100 ex muslims disagreeing with you.
Ah well sleep tight in your warm beds tonight eh? Who cares if millions of girls and women are trapped in brutal slavery- that you support. |
Why should I have to repeat myself when it's plain to see you are on a charm offensive and have obviously upped your meds? You're a Christian fundamentalist, a supporter of terrorism and someone who makes gross overstatements on this forum with little or no backup. You constantly quote from sources whose dubious worth are repeatedly exposed, yet continue to come up with all forms of lunacy. Why do you feel the need to hold me to account for all that is wrong with the Islamic world? I have repeatedly condemned the excesses of therein, but talking with you is like blowing out a lightbulb. Maybe, just maybe, I should hold you accountable for the behaviour of white Africans towards blacks there in the past. Maybe I should demand you explain the viscious religious wars over the centuries in the name of Christ, or better still ask you to appologise for Europeans slaughtering Jews since year dot. Better still, maybe I should just refuse to descend to the level of a person who has already suggested that myself, my wife and my family are of a seperate species to the rest of humanity, in short, a biggotted, unbalanced, narrowminded piece of fundamentalist waste who needs to take a look in the mirror before he goes using the kinds of labels on others that actually fit him so aptly. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| jaganath69 wrote: |
| Why do you feel the need to hold me to account for all that is wrong with the Islamic world? I have repeatedly condemned the excesses of therein |
Good. really encouraging to see you admit you were wrong. |
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jaganath69
Joined: 17 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
| jaganath69 wrote: |
| Why do you feel the need to hold me to account for all that is wrong with the Islamic world? I have repeatedly condemned the excesses of therein |
Good. really encouraging to see you admit you were wrong. |
Wrong, on what counts? I've always condemned stuff like this, its just that you are too busy being a sanctamonious twit to notice. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
Qoute patchy:
| Quote: |
| I agree, the Americans should invade Saudi Arabia |
At least 50% of the saudi population would secretly welcome them, hiding their feelings of joy and freedom behind their veils. |
That's what they said about the Iraqis. Well, good luck with that. |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
so big bird. Jaganath, Bucheon bum...any advice for our 16yr old? helloooo?
Mighty quiet around here all of a sudden..... |
I've read some of the website, and laughed. I'm not entirely convinced of the authenticity of some of the letters either - they seem a little...well....contrived? But we can't be sure. I particulary laughed at the this:
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| It was a Pakistani girl of your age that inspired me to undertake this mission. I saw her on TV. She was in hospital because she was burned by her jealous and possessive husband who was twice her age. She was in pain and was moaning like an animal. Yes, the sound that she made was not human, it was the sound of an animal in pain. She looked right into the camera and lifted up her hand towards it but only moaned like an animal. I thought she is looking at me trying to tell me something. I heard what she said at once and I knew what to do with the rest of my life. She died three days after she was videoed, an excruciating death. Those eyes, that groan, and that innocent face in pain, haunt me ever since. I can't forget them, I can't stop anymore. I made a vow to her to help other girls like her. I think she is watching me to see if I keep my word. I can't fail her. I will do everything in my power to slay this beast called Islam and free people from its clutches of death. I made this promise to her, and I will keep it until the day I meet her in heaven. In my fantasy I will hug her, press her head to my chest and ask her if she is content with my work. |
Now, exactly why did I laugh at this? I certainly wasn't laughing at the horrific plight of this girl and so many of her contemporaries. Not at all. I was laughing at a HINDU MAN (presumably from India?) using an example of a woman being torched as a reason for dedicating his time to converting muslims from their faith. Isn't HINDU INDIA the home of burning brides? Traditionally they were thrown (alive and kicking) onto their husband's funeral pyre. Nowadays, hindu brides are regularly doused with petrol and then set alight be disgruntled in-laws, resentful that the bride didn't bring along a big enough dowry.
Now, rapier, what exactly is it that you want me to discuss? Is this a "Ha - see what muslims do to women?" kind of trumpcard thingamy? Do you think I don't already know about the plight of women in many foreign corners of the world? I was signing petitions and joining women's rights campaigns about things like this more than a decade ago. I remember that the protests of people like me, concerning the dreadful ordeal of women in Afghanistan, fell on death ears 5 years ago. The general public and the Bush and Blair governments had no interest....until late 2001 when they needed to conjure up some good excuses to invade Afghanistan that is.
Did the invasion of Afghanistan do the women any good. No. If anything, their plight became worse, not better, except in the showcase of Kabul. Our intervention seems to make things worse.
Is your position that we should invade all those countries that practice gender apartheid? Is that your position? Or that women's issues are a purely western invention?
If so here is some interesting reading for you:
| MADRE wrote: |
Consider Iraq, where US actions have caused a sharp rise in "honor crimes." The US destroyed the Iraqi state, leaving people more reliant on conservative tribal authorities to settle disputes and mete out "justice," including "honor killings." The occupation has empowered extreme social conservatives, who exploited both the power vacuum created by the invasion and a climate of rising poverty, violence, and insecurity to impose a reactionary social agenda, including support for "honor crimes." Although the US is obligated as the occupying power to protect Iraqis�� human rights, including the prevention and prosecution of "honor crimes," it has not done so. In fact, the US appointed reactionary leaders who condone "honor crimes" to the Iraqi Governing Council in 2003. Meanwhile, the US has refused to protect or support progressive Iraqi political currents working to combat "honor crimes" (such as MADRE��s partner, the Organization for Women��s Freedom in Iraq) because these women also oppose US occupation.
Since the US bombing of Afghanistan in 2001, the Bush Administration has resurrected the hackneyed colonial notion that Western intervention is intended to "save" Muslim women from their oppressive societies. Few Muslim women believe this (the line is really intended for people in the US). Women in Muslim countries know that their work against "honor crimes"—and for women��s rights generally—has always been undermined by European colonialism and, more recently, by US intervention. That��s because foreign rulers prefer to see conservative, repressive local leaders for whom "honor crimes" are a facet of the status quo that maintains their power. These people have proven to be reliable junior partners in the project of controlling colonized and occupied peoples.
The fact that the US has used women��s rights as a rallying point for its wars is sometimes used to fuel the claim that women��s rights is "foreign" to the Middle East and a tool of Western domination. We hear that claim from conservatives in Muslim countries who oppose women��s rights. We also hear it from some in the US who worry that advocating Middle Eastern women��s rights imposes "American values" on those countries. But that view ignores more than a century of Arab women��s political struggle, organizing, jurisprudence, and scholarship aimed at securing rights within their societies.
The assumption that women��s rights is a "Western" concern is not only historically untrue, it��s also overblown. After all, the intellectual foundations of civilization—writing, mathematics, and science—are "Eastern." Are these pursuits therefore "foreign" and inappropriate in the West? Human rights, feminism, literature, and science are all aspects of our common human heritage. We should be suspicious whenever one is said to "belong"—or not belong—to a given people, especially when that designation is used to maintain abusive power structures and deny people rights.
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To see full article, check here: http://www.madre.org/
As for the silly muslim (if indeed the letter was authentic) who enjoyed seeing the 911 attack on New York, he was certainly not alone. I was in Hong Kong when that happened, and a TEXAN guy was delighted! "That'll teach the US" he said, much to my surprise. Some of my Israeli friends danced with glee - "It's great for them to get a taste" explained one of my friends from Tel Aviv. ["What - your best and most loyal ally in the world?" I didn't say...] Arriving back in mainland China, scores of Chinese expressed their delight at America's misfortune, and many expressed deep admiration for Osama Bin Laden. Arriving in Korea a few month later, several Koreans also expressed their admiration for this great 'warrior.' The kids in my first winter camp regarded Bin Laden as a real live Darth Vader type character and made a play in tribute to their hero! So this unfortunate sentiment is not the preserve of muslims I'm afraid. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Big bird,
Thanks for a decent reply. I posted those up because the first hand stories of ex muslims make for interesting reading..
Interesting that you think western intervention has made things worse as regards womens rights abuses.
What would you recommend then, to try and change attitudes in the long run? continued educational work by charities in places like Pakistan and Palestine? It just seems like a mountain to climb when you consider that the local society encourages and condones such abuses. I'm not saying its exclusive to the Muslim world, but it just seems to me they have the most widespread, institutionalised and cruellest forms of it.
Not sure if you've read "Burned alive", the first hand account of a palestinian woman who got set on fire by her brother. Fascinating account: -pm me if you want this book, I just finished reading it... |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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| The general public and the Bush and Blair governments had no interest....until late 2001 when they needed to conjure up some good excuses to invade Afghanistan that is. |
You mean like 9-11? They certainly did a good job of 'conjuring' that one up. |
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