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djsmnc
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
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 Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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I never had a problem with British, Scottish, Australian, or any other "native" or "original" or whatever English. I do have a problem with Cockney, just as my grandfather has with ghetto slang, and most people have a problem with Caribbean patois, but I like reggae.
When I was younger, I could fake a British accent to the point that (yes, it's true) some kids from the motherland (not my motherland, but certainly the womb that white America oozed out of) thought I was British at one point. I credit that to my interest in history as a young man, and the fact that my first cassette was a Beatles tape that I ragged like Quasimodo's blowup doll. It was this one to be exact:
Anyhow, bottom line of this story is, I'm special, or at least think I am anyway. |
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Qinella
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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Jaganthan et al have caught on to the perfect solution: mock the Americans for not studying or being exposed to different accents.
Well guess what, fellas? We shouldn't have to study it to understand it. You should just learn to stop saying umbreller and fah (far) alumaynium.  |
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kermo
Joined: 01 Sep 2004
Location: Eating eggs, with a comb, out of a shoe.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| ilovebdt wrote: |
| kermo wrote: |
| I grew up with lots of British television, so I had no problem understanding the locals when I visited last summer. However, a bus driver from Glasgow had no idea what I meant when I asked him what the fare was, and started using pidgin English and hand-signals with me. |
Kermo you are not alone. I have visited Glasgow a few times in my life and I don't understand what people say there either.
On a side note, I would say American accents are easier to understand because when Americans speak they use all the letters in a word. Where as English people tend to eat the ends of their words.
ilovebdt |
No, no, I could understand him just fine-- he just didn't hear what I was saying as English, so tried to communicate with me non-verbally! |
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jaganath69
Joined: 17 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Qinella wrote: |
Jaganthan et al have caught on to the perfect solution: mock the Americans for not studying or being exposed to different accents.
Well guess what, fellas? We shouldn't have to study it to understand it. You should just learn to stop saying umbreller and fah (far) alumaynium. |
Again, you miss the point by about, oh, 300 metres (thats about 900 feet in your speak, Bubba). Most of us have no problem understanding others anyhow. Besides, what are you doing on the other side of the world if you want people all to sound the same? |
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Qinella
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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| jaganath69 wrote: |
| Qinella wrote: |
Jaganthan et al have caught on to the perfect solution: mock the Americans for not studying or being exposed to different accents.
Well guess what, fellas? We shouldn't have to study it to understand it. You should just learn to stop saying umbreller and fah (far) alumaynium. |
Again, you miss the point by about, oh, 300 metres (thats about 900 feet in your speak, Bubba). Most of us have no problem understanding others anyhow. Besides, what are you doing on the other side of the world if you want people all to sound the same? |
Teaching them to speak proper-like. |
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Privateer
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Location: Easy Street.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| poker player wrote: |
| Why all the hostility? Brits are sometimes difficult to understand-plain and simple. My partner of 10 years is from London and has been in Canada 20 years yet there are occasions when I really have to pay attention or I don't understand her. We went on vacation with some of her relatives a few years ago and I was lost in their conversation from time to time and so was she. Of course they thought she had lost her accent completely. I think it's all just what you are used to. |
Just like to point out that those two highlighted bits actually contradict each other.
And if it was my post you were referring to with the 'hostility' comment, I was kidding - there's no way I could really believe that. |
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SPINOZA
Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Location: $eoul
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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to the OP,
Some regional accents in England (Britain if you want to venture further, but England is enough) aren't understandable to non-English people. I guarantee that no North American (perhaps beyond) would understand a strong accent from where I'm from. You'd pick out some words, but vowels are pronounced in a way that you've simply never heard before. The very same can be said of - oh God, countless - regions in England. It's strange how the C**kney accent (working class London) is amongst those most difficult, given London is also home to 'Standard' (sometimes called 'BBC') English. Other southern accents are difficult too � Dorset and Bristol spring to mind.
However, very strong accents are confined solely to the lower classes, if I may use that condescending-sounding term, the lowest income-earners, the least educated people in society. It's very unlikely you've come into contact with such people if you're Californian. Nobody, except those intimately familiar with England, can even relate. There's no reason whatsoever why a person from California shouldn't be able to understand 90% - from all regions - of English people perfectly. Therefore, I tend to side with the Jaganaths of the thread who speculate that you're a bit of a twit. You�re so weirded-out ( ) by accents other than your own because you�ve covered yourself with the OC, Friends, Buffy and ventured barely out of your county, let alone state, and much less country. I must say I�ve met one or two English expats whom I have to say �er, y�what mate?� a bit to, but that�s because they�ve had weird voices. Same goes for North Americans. I can understand 90% of them perfectly, but you get the odd buffoon who waffles and rambles all sorts of incomprehensible twaddle. I�ll confess to seconding the �have difficulty with Kiwi speakers� claim. I�ve been to NZ and was surprised (a) how drawly and slurry it is and (b) how Aussies are much easier to understand. |
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Grimalkin
Joined: 22 May 2005
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Qinella wrote: |
Jaganthan et al have caught on to the perfect solution: mock the Americans for not studying or being exposed to different accents.
Well guess what, fellas? We shouldn't have to study it to understand it. You should just learn to stop saying umbreller and fah (far) alumaynium. |
Ok it's a deal...but only if you guys promise to learn how to spell.  |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| SPINOZA wrote: |
| You'd pick out some words, but vowels are pronounced in a way that you've simply never heard before. The very same can be said of - oh God, countless - regions in England. It's strange how the C**kney accent (working class London) is amongst those most difficult, given London is also home to 'Standard' (sometimes called 'BBC') English. Other southern accents are difficult too � Dorset and Bristol spring to mind. |
Yes, it's always the vowels you lot have trouble with. Why is it so difficult for you?
For example, take the word "wave".
From the rules of orthography, it's clear that the "a" in "wave" is a long "a". Yet assorted Aussies, Poms, and other Commonwealth types insist on pronouncing that vowel as a long "i". Why is that? If God had intended for "wave" to be pronounced "wive", the frickin' word would be spelled "wive"!
And, of course there is the queer British insistence on not pronouncing final "r"'s.
| Arrogant Limey wrote: |
| However, very strong accents are confined solely to the lower classes, if I may use that condescending-sounding term, the lowest income-earners, the least educated people in society. It's very unlikely you've come into contact with such people if you're Californian. |
Thank God.
There appear to be no shortage of them on the Sceptered Isle, however.
| Spotted Dick wrote: |
| Nobody, except those intimately familiar with England, can even relate. |
As if anyone would want to.
| Quote: |
| There's no reason whatsoever why a person from California shouldn't be able to understand 90% - from all regions - of English people perfectly. |
I suppose that might have a chance of being true were your (mis)use of vocabulary not completely fscked. "Telly", "arvo", "aggro", "lorry"....it sickens me just to write such abominations.
| Pasty-faced Pommie wrote: |
| Therefore, I tend to side with the Jaganaths of the thread who speculate that you're a bit of a twit. You�re so weirded-out ( ) by accents other than your own because you�ve covered yourself with the OC, Friends, Buffy and ventured barely out of your county, let alone state, and much less country. |
As opposed to the 99% of English who are oh-so-worldly binge-drinking, ruffian, slobbish thugs. I guess all your "cultural excursions" to Spain and Belgium give you quite the veneer of sophistication.
But hey, if the U.S. were as puny in size and miserable in climate as the rock you escaped, we'd travel more outside our borders as well. |
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poker player
Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Location: On the river
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| Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Privateer wrote: |
| poker player wrote: |
| Why all the hostility? Brits are sometimes difficult to understand-plain and simple. My partner of 10 years is from London and has been in Canada 20 years yet there are occasions when I really have to pay attention or I don't understand her. We went on vacation with some of her relatives a few years ago and I was lost in their conversation from time to time and so was she. Of course they thought she had lost her accent completely. I think it's all just what you are used to. |
Just like to point out that those two highlighted bits actually contradict each other.
And if it was my post you were referring to with the 'hostility' comment, I was kidding - there's no way I could really believe that. |
You think so? Or are you just bored and following me around today? |
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safeblad
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 1:11 am Post subject: |
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| i met a mexican in jeju last week. he told me that my (sussex) english accent was: 'beautiful' and 'like music to his ears'. |
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Privateer
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Location: Easy Street.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 1:34 am Post subject: |
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| poker player wrote: |
| Privateer wrote: |
| poker player wrote: |
| Why all the hostility? Brits are sometimes difficult to understand-plain and simple. My partner of 10 years is from London and has been in Canada 20 years yet there are occasions when I really have to pay attention or I don't understand her. We went on vacation with some of her relatives a few years ago and I was lost in their conversation from time to time and so was she. Of course they thought she had lost her accent completely. I think it's all just what you are used to. |
Just like to point out that those two highlighted bits actually contradict each other.
And if it was my post you were referring to with the 'hostility' comment, I was kidding - there's no way I could really believe that. |
You think so? Or are you just bored and following me around today? |
You got me. I am bored and I have followed you around today. Well twice anyway. But I still mean what I said above (and not what I said about North American accents not being 'natural' in my first post).
Now if you want to see real hostility just take a look at dogbert's post. There's vitriol for you. |
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ez2engage2
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 2:33 am Post subject: |
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| SPINOZA wrote: |
to the OP,
Some regional accents in England (Britain if you want to venture further, but England is enough) aren't understandable to non-English people. I guarantee that no North American (perhaps beyond) would understand a strong accent from where I'm from. You'd pick out some words, but vowels are pronounced in a way that you've simply never heard before. The very same can be said of - oh God, countless - regions in England. It's strange how the C**kney accent (working class London) is amongst those most difficult, given London is also home to 'Standard' (sometimes called 'BBC') English. Other southern accents are difficult too � Dorset and Bristol spring to mind.
However, very strong accents are confined solely to the lower classes, if I may use that condescending-sounding term, the lowest income-earners, the least educated people in society. It's very unlikely you've come into contact with such people if you're Californian. Nobody, except those intimately familiar with England, can even relate. There's no reason whatsoever why a person from California shouldn't be able to understand 90% - from all regions - of English people perfectly. Therefore, I tend to side with the Jaganaths of the thread who speculate that you're a bit of a twit. You�re so weirded-out ( ) by accents other than your own because you�ve covered yourself with the OC, Friends, Buffy and ventured barely out of your county, let alone state, and much less country. I must say I�ve met one or two English expats whom I have to say �er, y�what mate?� a bit to, but that�s because they�ve had weird voices. Same goes for North Americans. I can understand 90% of them perfectly, but you get the odd buffoon who waffles and rambles all sorts of incomprehensible twaddle. I�ll confess to seconding the �have difficulty with Kiwi speakers� claim. I�ve been to NZ and was surprised (a) how drawly and slurry it is and (b) how Aussies are much easier to understand. |
I don't think it's fair to sterotype me as an American that never left home town. I've been to over 20 countries (Asia, SAmerica, parts of Europe) and over 40 States. But never been to the United Kingdom.
I did not complain about the way they talked or not using proper English. I do understand most of what they're saying but like my co-workers, sometimes we get the gest of what they said. It does sound a bit like mumbling as someone mentioned.
I was wondering more of why they didn't have any trouble with 'NAmerican' English and Big_Bird pointed out England was more exposed to this accent since they turned on the TV.
Hence, I said is it because of Hollywood and it's influence? I guess I got that answer!
Or is it because 'UK' people are so much more worldly, not as ignorant, lazy, or retarded like me. |
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Sleepy in Seoul
Joined: 15 May 2004
Location: Going in ever decreasing circles until I eventually disappear up my own fundament - in NZ
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| Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| dogbert wrote: |
| SPINOZA wrote: |
| You'd pick out some words, but vowels are pronounced in a way that you've simply never heard before. The very same can be said of - oh God, countless - regions in England. It's strange how the C**kney accent (working class London) is amongst those most difficult, given London is also home to 'Standard' (sometimes called 'BBC') English. Other southern accents are difficult too – Dorset and Bristol spring to mind. |
Yes, it's always the vowels you lot have trouble with. Why is it so difficult for you?
For example, take the word "wave".
From the rules of orthography, it's clear that the "a" in "wave" is a long "a". Yet assorted Aussies, Poms, and other Commonwealth types insist on pronouncing that vowel as a long "i". Why is that? If God had intended for "wave" to be pronounced "wive", the frickin' word would be spelled "wive"!
And, of course there is the *beep* British insistence on not pronouncing final "r"'s.
| Arrogant Limey wrote: |
| However, very strong accents are confined solely to the lower classes, if I may use that condescending-sounding term, the lowest income-earners, the least educated people in society. It's very unlikely you've come into contact with such people if you're Californian. |
Thank God.
There appear to be no shortage of them on the Sceptered Isle, however.
| Spotted *beep* wrote: |
| Nobody, except those intimately familiar with England, can even relate. |
As if anyone would want to.
| Quote: |
There's no reason whatsoever why a person from California shouldn't be able to understand 90% - from all regions - of English people perfectly. |
I suppose that might have a chance of being true were your (mis)use of vocabulary not completely fscked. "Telly", "arvo", "aggro", "lorry"....it sickens me just to write such abominations.
| Pasty-faced Pommie wrote: |
| Therefore, I tend to side with the Jaganaths of the thread who speculate that you're a bit of a twit. You’re so weirded-out ( ) by accents other than your own because you’ve covered yourself with the OC, Friends, Buffy and ventured barely out of your county, let alone state, and much less country. |
As opposed to the 99% of English who are oh-so-worldly binge-drinking, ruffian, slobbish thugs. I guess all your "cultural excursions" to Spain and Belgium give you quite the veneer of sophistication.
But hey, if the U.S. were as puny in size and miserable in climate as the rock you escaped, we'd travel more outside our borders as well. |
Thank God most of you don't if that's the drivel everyone else would have to put up with. |
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SPINOZA
Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Location: $eoul
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| Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Life-threateningly obese, Bush-voting, ranky-stanky-yanky arsehole wrote: |
| SPINOZA wrote: |
| You'd pick out some words, but vowels are pronounced in a way that you've simply never heard before. The very same can be said of - oh God, countless - regions in England. It's strange how the C**kney accent (working class London) is amongst those most difficult, given London is also home to 'Standard' (sometimes called 'BBC') English. Other southern accents are difficult too � Dorset and Bristol spring to mind. |
Yes, it's always the vowels you lot have trouble with. Why is it so difficult for you?
For example, take the word "wave".
From the rules of orthography, it's clear that the "a" in "wave" is a long "a". Yet assorted Aussies, Poms, and other Commonwealth types insist on pronouncing that vowel as a long "i". Why is that? If God had intended for "wave" to be pronounced "wive", the frickin' word would be spelled "wive"!
And, of course there is the *beep* British insistence on not pronouncing final "r"'s.
| Arrogant Limey wrote: |
| However, very strong accents are confined solely to the lower classes, if I may use that condescending-sounding term, the lowest income-earners, the least educated people in society. It's very unlikely you've come into contact with such people if you're Californian. |
Thank God.
There appear to be no shortage of them on the Sceptered Isle, however.
| Spotted *beep* wrote: |
| Nobody, except those intimately familiar with England, can even relate. |
As if anyone would want to.
| Quote: |
| There's no reason whatsoever why a person from California shouldn't be able to understand 90% - from all regions - of English people perfectly. |
I suppose that might have a chance of being true were your (mis)use of vocabulary not completely fscked. "Telly", "arvo", "aggro", "lorry"....it sickens me just to write such abominations.
| Pasty-faced Pommie wrote: |
| Therefore, I tend to side with the Jaganaths of the thread who speculate that you're a bit of a twit. You�re so weirded-out ( ) by accents other than your own because you�ve covered yourself with the OC, Friends, Buffy and ventured barely out of your county, let alone state, and much less country. |
As opposed to the 99% of English who are oh-so-worldly binge-drinking, ruffian, slobbish thugs. I guess all your "cultural excursions" to Spain and Belgium give you quite the veneer of sophistication.
But hey, if the U.S. were as puny in size and miserable in climate as the rock you escaped, we'd travel more outside our borders as well. |
Why the anti-Englandness, you silly man? Why�s it always Americans with a hate on for England and never the reverse? I would�ve thought it�d be English people that had the inferiority complex, not Americans. Oh well.
Been there, had your head kicked in, waited an hour for the bus in the freezing English rain, and then been charged 50 quid per night in a crumby dump run by some snotty old twit who assumes that because you're American you're arrogant, vulgar trash? Jolly good, home sweet home. My guess is you thoroughly deserved it, as you sound like a complete tosser. I hope they refunded your money if you were unsatisfied - I know how important money is to you Americans. Our country makes billions out of the Yanks from tourism � unsightly, loud, new money, pathetic trash that many are - and a good majority go home satisfied customers.
Maybe you spent a vacation on God's Hallow'd Isle knocking them back in some grotty back street boozer, as the things you mention are well off the tourist trail. Most people go the theatre in London's West End, visit Norman castles, but each to their own. England has cultural opportunities that no other country can ever hope to rival and has a great history of crushing Indians, Catholics, Africans, Frenchies, Spicks and Huns....you don't fookin' like it, stuff it up yer arse! You're like the spoilt, snotty, vile little child, fortunate enough to inherit everything his mother has done for him - could've been born into poverty and slave labour, or inherit Latin culture (see South and Central America vis-a-vis English-speaking countries) - only to spit in the face of everything the good parent has done and discredit her name and efforts.
Your views on English pronunciation are twaddle of course. The English language is not only great because it�s an international language. So are other languages. English is unique in that it has reached all four corners of the planet and - unlike Chinese, unlike Italian - whilst we all speak differently, English is English and we all understand each other. You might not like �wave� sounding like wive in southern England and Australasia, or �today� sounding like �to die� and �hi� sounding like �hoy�, and nor do I like North Americans saying the word �like� incessantly, or the generally loud, warbly screechers that are American women ubiquitous on TV. I'd rather hear a building site. I also don�t appreciate abominations like �motherf____ker� and �c__ksucker� and other delightful American contributions to English. But many Koreans aspire to study in Australia and London. Teaching them only Buffy Simpsons English won�t do them much good. They need to learn that �wive� means wave in those parts of the world. I teach diversity of pronunciation where possible, including NA English. That�s the way it should be. The alternative makes my skin crawl, as does the image of you sat at your PC in your 5 pyeong tip in your undies fiddling with your bits, you insignificant cretin. |
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