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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Butterfly
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait
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 Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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| dulouz wrote: |
The Koreans are not interested in catching and stopping illegal teachers.
They are interested in talking about it. Why do I know? Because I started the first "degree checking" business in Korea. I get no calls. The advertising is good, its here on Dave's but I get no calls. Well, I got one.
Sorry I lied. |
With respect, that wasn't a particularly astute business venture was it? Hakwon owners* aren't interested in losing the teacher they just paid 1.2 million for, and recruiters want as many people on their books as possible. They only care if it isn't going to get through immigration, which they always seem to do.
The only people interested in doing that would be the immigration department, and they seem awfully busy processing visas for Chinese people, in fact, they seem to be very under-staffed and underfunded, like most goverment departments.
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| I agree that the "if you don't like it, then leave" response is immensely ignorant and childish. |
Not always, permanent residents here might have a legitimate gripe, but newbies whining like babies at how noisy the subway vendors are for example I think jeez, go the f home.
*oh, I seeeeee. 'they' means Koreans, and hakwon owners are Korean, and Koreans want illegal teachers out of Korea. Yup, gotcha 
(There is a concept called marketing, and within the framework of this business discipline, a nation, say koreans, are broken up into various groups based on income, affiliation, opinion, taste etc. Check it out, might help you with your future business endeavours)
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/bookSearch/isbnInquiry.asp?sourceid=00376276758385234144&ISBN=1568846991&bfdate=01-31-2005+23:28:53 |
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chronicpride
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Butterfly wrote: |
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| I agree that the "if you don't like it, then leave" response is immensely ignorant and childish. |
Not always, permanent residents here might have a legitimate gripe, but newbies whining like babies at how noisy the subway vendors are for example I think jeez, go the f home. |
I totally 100% agree with this. It is totally valid in many situations, particularly with the accidental teachuh/reluctant traveller crowd. Just in case that I've totally missed the logic somewhere, someone please help me out and explain the labelling of this advice as being immensely ignorant and childish.  |
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hadeshorn
Joined: 30 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Naked chicks pouring milk on each other? When the hell was this? And I missed it? DAMN |
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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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| Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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| hadeshorn wrote: |
| Naked chicks pouring milk on each other? When the hell was this? And I missed it? DAMN |
No, no, no -- you got it all wrong. They were naked Korean chicks with plastic squirt bottles who were SQUIRTING each other with a new watery YOGHURT DRINK in front of a crowd of (primarily) male Korean onlookers. So you see? You missed nothing special. |
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cellphone
Joined: 18 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 3:01 am Post subject: |
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| chronicpride wrote: |
| Butterfly wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I agree that the "if you don't like it, then leave" response is immensely ignorant and childish. |
Not always, permanent residents here might have a legitimate gripe, but newbies whining like babies at how noisy the subway vendors are for example I think jeez, go the f home. |
I totally 100% agree with this. It is totally valid in many situations, particularly with the accidental teachuh/reluctant traveller crowd. Just in case that I've totally missed the logic somewhere, someone please help me out and explain the labelling of this advice as being immensely ignorant and childish. |
I basically disagree with what butterfly said. Long term, married residents would either have their own special forum they could claim as their own, or post on a more specialized site. The very concept of an 'eslcafe' is very much a 'lonely planet' concept, it's bound to - and should - be the place where many new people are going to go and post about all the first things they see, discuss their reactions and adjustments to it all, and what appears to be disrespect to local ways is going to fill in regularly. I actually think longer timers are in the wrong place to be criticizing and hushing them here, save for an occasional bad day. But a website like this is mainly a new or middle person's info board.
Long timers who overwhelmingly favor their host country, and seem to want to be on a site that most others do too, aren't really on the right website for that, it seems to me. Long timers who are open to an array of discussion, jokes, wisecracks, and serious discussion would be more in tune, I would think. |
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Derrek
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 3:06 am Post subject: |
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| JongnoGuru wrote: |
| hadeshorn wrote: |
| Naked chicks pouring milk on each other? When the hell was this? And I missed it? DAMN |
No, no, no -- you got it all wrong. They were naked Korean chicks with plastic squirt bottles who were SQUIRTING each other with a new watery YOGHURT DRINK in front of a crowd of (primarily) male Korean onlookers. So you see? You missed nothing special. |
I posted about this, but it got yanked. We don't want to upset the Koreans by pointing out that they are being Korean, now do we? |
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phaedrus
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
Location: I'm comin' to get ya.
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 3:12 am Post subject: |
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| Derrek wrote: |
| JongnoGuru wrote: |
| hadeshorn wrote: |
| Naked chicks pouring milk on each other? When the hell was this? And I missed it? DAMN |
No, no, no -- you got it all wrong. They were naked Korean chicks with plastic squirt bottles who were SQUIRTING each other with a new watery YOGHURT DRINK in front of a crowd of (primarily) male Korean onlookers. So you see? You missed nothing special. |
I posted about this, but it got yanked. We don't want to upset the Koreans by pointing out that they are being Korean, now do we? |
Well, if we keep talking about naked Korean girls spraying each other with white stuff in this thread....
3, 2, 1... |
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hadeshorn
Joined: 30 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:27 am Post subject: |
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| How did that stunt get approved? And when are they doing it again! More of a heads up next time people. Derrek, Seriously dude. Message me next time! |
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chronicpride
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:53 am Post subject: |
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| cellphone wrote: |
| chronicpride wrote: |
| Butterfly wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I agree that the "if you don't like it, then leave" response is immensely ignorant and childish. |
Not always, permanent residents here might have a legitimate gripe, but newbies whining like babies at how noisy the subway vendors are for example I think jeez, go the f home. |
I totally 100% agree with this. It is totally valid in many situations, particularly with the accidental teachuh/reluctant traveller crowd. Just in case that I've totally missed the logic somewhere, someone please help me out and explain the labelling of this advice as being immensely ignorant and childish. |
I basically disagree with what butterfly said. Long term, married residents would either have their own special forum they could claim as their own, or post on a more specialized site. The very concept of an 'eslcafe' is very much a 'lonely planet' concept, it's bound to - and should - be the place where many new people are going to go and post about all the first things they see, discuss their reactions and adjustments to it all, and what appears to be disrespect to local ways is going to fill in regularly. I actually think longer timers are in the wrong place to be criticizing and hushing them here, save for an occasional bad day. But a website like this is mainly a new or middle person's info board.
Long timers who overwhelmingly favor their host country, and seem to want to be on a site that most others do too, aren't really on the right website for that, it seems to me. Long timers who are open to an array of discussion, jokes, wisecracks, and serious discussion would be more in tune, I would think. |
I see. Thanks for the clarity. I do agree that there are some knee-jerk responses in the form of 'if you don't like it...' But there is a certain demographic here that seethingly hates this place, yet stay here and re-sign contracts. And then get on the cases of the ones that enjoy living here by labelling them 'apologists' (although it seems like eons since that word has been spit out on here, the demographic still lingers.). I think that the 'if you don't like it..' stuff is valid when hurled at the people that come off as hypocrites for loathing this place, but continuing to stay here. But nothing ever comes of it, as in those cases, the issue tends to not really be about Korea, but those individual people, who would probably even gripe in heaven that the clouds are too uneven to walk on in some places. |
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just because
Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Location: Changwon - 4964
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 7:12 am Post subject: |
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To be honest,
Nobody has looked at me any differently, nobody has said anything, in fact this week enrolment went up.
If it wasn't for this board i wouldn't have even knew the show was on.
Don't be so paranoid guys.  |
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Blind Willie
Joined: 05 May 2004
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 9:11 am Post subject: |
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| chronicpride wrote: |
| But there is a certain demographic here that seethingly hates this place, yet stay here and re-sign contracts. And then get on the cases of the ones that enjoy living here by labelling them 'apologists' (although it seems like eons since that word has been spit out on here, the demographic still lingers.). I think that the 'if you don't like it..' stuff is valid when hurled at the people that come off as hypocrites for loathing this place, but continuing to stay here. But nothing ever comes of it, as in those cases, the issue tends to not really be about Korea, but those individual people, who would probably even gripe in heaven that the clouds are too uneven to walk on in some places. |
Ladies and gents, the nail has been hit on the head. |
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Zenpickle
Joined: 06 Jan 2004
Location: Anyang -- Bisan
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Blind Willie wrote: |
| chronicpride wrote: |
| But there is a certain demographic here that seethingly hates this place, yet stay here and re-sign contracts. And then get on the cases of the ones that enjoy living here by labelling them 'apologists' (although it seems like eons since that word has been spit out on here, the demographic still lingers.). I think that the 'if you don't like it..' stuff is valid when hurled at the people that come off as hypocrites for loathing this place, but continuing to stay here. But nothing ever comes of it, as in those cases, the issue tends to not really be about Korea, but those individual people, who would probably even gripe in heaven that the clouds are too uneven to walk on in some places. |
Ladies and gents, the nail has been hit on the head. |
I agree, too, that the comment is valid for the people who just sit and whine about the most trivial of things, for whom the best solution is to return home to Mommy.
Where I think the comment "If you don't like it, then leave" is apathetic and childish is when it is used against someone who wants to do something about a problem. Running away from a problem is not very far from just sitting there and whining about it. |
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Badmojo
Joined: 07 Mar 2004
Location: I'm just sitting here watching the wheels go round and round
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Zenpickle wrote: |
| Blind Willie wrote: |
| chronicpride wrote: |
| But there is a certain demographic here that seethingly hates this place, yet stay here and re-sign contracts. And then get on the cases of the ones that enjoy living here by labelling them 'apologists' (although it seems like eons since that word has been spit out on here, the demographic still lingers.). I think that the 'if you don't like it..' stuff is valid when hurled at the people that come off as hypocrites for loathing this place, but continuing to stay here. But nothing ever comes of it, as in those cases, the issue tends to not really be about Korea, but those individual people, who would probably even gripe in heaven that the clouds are too uneven to walk on in some places. |
Ladies and gents, the nail has been hit on the head. |
I agree, too, that the comment is valid for the people who just sit and whine about the most trivial of things, for whom the best solution is to return home to Mommy.
Where I think the comment "If you don't like it, then leave" is apathetic and childish is when it is used against someone who wants to do something about a problem. Running away from a problem is not very far from just sitting there and whining about it. |
You're going to "do something" about this problem? You're going to somehow unify all the foreign teachers in Korea to improve our image? What is that collective yawn I just heard? For some reason, the word "apathy" just popped into my head.
Someone else called me a defeatist, I think it's being a realist.
This "if you don't like it, then leave" comment originated from me. Basically my thought process went like this.
You're outraged, angered, miffed off at this unfair portrayal. Well then do something about it. I haven't seen anything been done yet, but that's beside the point. Say you try to do something about it. You probably don't succeed. Remember where you are, we are the outsiders here. It doesn't matter what we think, or how we feel. Korea IS for Koreans.
That's something that's only going to change through time, the longer we're here and the more mixed marriages that produce children etc. as Blind Willie (I think) already pointed out.
What are you left with right now? You did something, you tried to change it, you couldn't. Well then it comes down to a simple choice - Accept it or leave. Either it angers you to the point where you can't take Korea anymore, or it doesn't. Either you get used to it, or you don't. I think it is that black and white if you want to be honest with yourself.
Last edited by Badmojo on Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Butterfly
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait
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| Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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| cellphone wrote: |
| I basically disagree with what butterfly said. |
Well Cellphone, I am not particularly referring to this board, in part of course, but generally for foreigners in Korea (those that post here and those that don't) I can separate them in terms of those who look at the country with rose colored spectacles, those who are pragmatic (same sh**, different pile) and those that pathalogically whine about the tiniest little cultural difference that Korea presents, and as Chronic Pride accurately asserts, this rarely has anything to do with time served in Korea, more, it is to do with the basic attitide of the person in question. I realize I referred to newbies originally, which was silly in the light of his post and my experiences with many.
And defending Korea, when unfounded, or misperceived criticisms rage, I used to perceive as a duty, not to Korea, Korea will do fine, but to those new people who want to experience Korea with an open mind and a balanced set of views from others. I seldom get involved in it any more, I find it dull and besides, it was a waste of time, sunshine people don't need my help.
Naturally, I, and most of my peers went through a period of loathing Korea in my first year, every last inch of it; for most, it lasted about three months I suppose.
You'll notice that in my post also, I wrote "I think, go the f home." I rarely say it, because life is to short for dealing with other people's pathetic whining lives. I'll hang out with the sunshine people. |
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paperbag princess
Joined: 07 Mar 2004
Location: veggie hell
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| Posted: Wed Feb 02, 2005 1:18 am Post subject: |
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| i don't hate korea, but i hate some things about it (the racism, sexism and the homophobia are the three biggest things). if they don't want foreigners here, than why bother hiring us? |
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