Korean Job Discussion Forums

[McSnack]

I'm not sure if this is the right forum or not, but given that it involves the Korean traditional first birthday party, here goes. Apologies for its length.

There's this guy I know, let's call him ... MacSnick. He some questions regarding a co-worker's gift for MacSnick's son's first birthday. First some background -- MacSnick has two kids, the youngest of which turned one a month ago. The other child turned one a year ago, and MacSnick and his wife had a party for her as well. The first party was at a Korean "family restaurant" and given that they were asking their friends to come to yet another party, MacSnick and his wife wanted to feed everybody well and had the second party at Outback Steakhouse. A boxed towel set (how Korean is that?) was also given to each guest.

For those of you who don't know -- Korean first birthday parties are somewhat of a big deal. Parents rent out a hall or something to celebrate the child turning one. Friends and family are invited, and given the fact that Koreans get invited to tons of weddings, funerals and first birthdays, getting invited to a first birthday can often be a burden in both time and money. Like weddings, gifts --- either monetary or actual presents are given. I don't know about others, but MacSnick and his Korean wife weren't looking to make money (although getting some of the party investment back wouldn't have been scorned on) but only to celebrate their son turning one. Anways ....

At MacSnick's daughter's first birthday (last year) the co-worker's gift envelope had the co-worker's name along with another guests'. It contained 30,000 won. After the most recent party, the co-worker told MacSnick that he gave so much money because he didn't give any for the first birthday. MacSnick, not knowing how much the co-worker gave, MacSnick asked and the co-worker responded that he gave 80,000 won. Remembering that the co-worker gave money at the first party and he said as much to the co-worker. Co-worker had forgotten about that and asked MacSnick to check. Having checked, MacSnick reported back to co-worker a couple of days later that co-worker did indeed split a gift of 30,000 won for the other kid��s birthday.

Herein lies my question, co-worker has asked MacSnick to return 45,000 of the gift money. While MacSnick thinks co-worker��s request is pretty bad form and fairly high on the cheese scale (he would not have even considered it a loss --- MacSnick��s other friends of equal standing to co-worker generally gave 30-50,000 for each party and MacSnick would��ve {and has in the past} given the same, i.e – co-worker��s total of 90,000 for the two parties wasn��t excessive and, with the refund, a gift of 50,000 for two parties is pretty cheap), he has no problem returning the money. MacSnick��s wife, however, is insulted. She believes that the gifts (monetary or otherwise) are meant to be a token of friends�� and family members�� sentiments for the child��s good luck in the future and to ask for a return of the gift is the same as reneging on the wishes of good luck. She wants to return all of co-worker��s money from the second party..

Sorry again for how long this is, but here are my questions:
---- What��s your opinion of co-worker��s request?
---- If MacSnick��s wife gives him the full 80,000 to return to co-worker, should he give it all back and deal with future bad mojo with co-worker, or should he just return the 45,000 that co-worker asked for and leave it at that (again, MacSnick isn��t really insulted by co-worker, more disappointed in him --- the money isn��t important, but his impression of co-worker is forever changed for the worse)? This would of course mean MacSnick lying to his wife.
---- MacSnick hasn��t told any mutual friends about this (co-worker doesn��t read this board), should he?
---- MacSnick and co-worker live in the same apt. building and while MacSnick��s wife and co-worker rarely see each other, it does happen from time to time. Should MacSnick tell co-worker how his wife feels?
---- Any other advice is welcome.

If you��ve stuck around for this long, thanks and I��m curious to hear your thoughts.

[FUBAR]

It's not worth the time and the effort to make a big deal about this.

The co-worker could be having alot of financial difficulties, hence the need for the money returned. In that case, I would assume that it shamed the co-worker alot to ask for the money to be returned (especially if he co-worker is a Korean man). Telling others or a causing a scene could further humiliate the guy and make everyone look petty.

I would say that the Husband should return the money, without telling the wife. Have the husband make up some lie about the man rethinking his his position. Then pay the co-worker so that he is happy and things go smoothly. It really isn't worth it to let this small incident become a huge problem.

[the eye]

i agree with FUBAR.
he should give the co-worker back what he asked for.
trying to give the full amount back is bound to be met with resistance and hard feelings.

the difference could be used to buy the wife a nice bouquet of flowers...and the baby a new toy.

[turtlepi1]

Have to agree...the husband caused this problem by opening his yap about the money to start with. It's only right he makes it go away by allowing all parties to save face.

I don't blame the wife for being insulted or the co-worker for feeling ripped-off. (I'll chalk it up to Korean style and not "cheap-ness" that he bothered to tell you though. )

[shawner88]

Keep the money and have a soju party and don't invite anyone.

[hellofaniceguy]

hellofaniceguy....not this case!
How tacky and tackless can anyone be to ask for their money back that they already gave!! Saving face or not.....has nothing to do with it! This saving face business is a bucnh of bull crap with koreans. Just look around you.... the day in and day out things that koreans do. Saving face? I think not.
If you don't return the money that the co-worker gave...so what? What...you lose a friend? He ain't no friend to begin with! And if he needs the what...45,000 Won because of some money problems...let me tell you then...if he needs 45,000 Won...he is really hurting big time!
True...the foreign teacher should have kept his ajuma mouth shut. Ajumas are not just korean women it seems.
Would I return the money even to keep peace, save face, maintain whatever...no. It was for the child's birthday. If you lose this co-worker as a friend over 45,000 Won...no big thing. Gesh...imagine if it were 45 thousand dollars! They would be fighting!

[McSnack]

Co-worker is Canadian and isn't having money problems.

[Bulsajo]

"Here's your money back. By the way, my wife thinks that your request dooms our family to three generations of misfortune. Have a nice day."

[Cedar]

The guy who wants his money back should have said "Oh, I really did give last year?" and then chalked up giving extra as a lesson in life. There is no such thing as a graceful way to ask for a gift back, even if it's a gift of easily divisible money and you are only asking for part of it. The guy is a cheap-o with no class. On the other hand, the husband could weigh the possible bad feelings, give the money back and not mention it to his wife, if he thinks that's better. If he does, he's a good guy. If the co-worker does or does not get the money back, any or all of it, he's an effing doofus.

[turtlepi1]

[Sage Monkey]

[mindmetoo]

The coworker who wants his crummy $45 back is Canadian? Not Korean? How deep is his financial problems that $45 suddenly matters big time to him? God, 3D loser. I would give him the $45 back no problem, make no big deal about it, but spend the next month laughing my ass off at the guy behind his back and simply not invite him to any other party or social gathering.

[helly]

Co-worker is Canadian, not Korean? They are co-workers, not good friends? Give it all back, tell him that asking for it was such poor form that you don't feel right accepting anything. Move on.

[Sooke]

i think he should take the 80,000 won down to a gangster, and have a contract put on the co-worker's life. if he adds about 5 million more, he could have it arranged. Everybody's happy!! one less Canadian in the world.

Actually, we should kill all Canadians.

[hellofaniceguy]