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Jandar
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
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 Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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In 2007, the Hamas leader said " "The Israelis love life but we love death, and so we will win."
Fathi Hammad: �We desire death like you desire life.�
Osama Bin Laden: �We love death. The U.S. loves life. That is the big difference between us�
Hassan Nasrallah: �We are going to win, because they love life and we love death"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0wJXf2nt4Y |
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bangbayed
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Jandar wrote: |
In 2007, the Hamas leader said " "The Israelis love life but we love death, and so we will win."
Fathi Hammad: �We desire death like you desire life.�
Osama Bin Laden: �We love death. The U.S. loves life. That is the big difference between us�
Hassan Nasrallah: �We are going to win, because they love life and we love death"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0wJXf2nt4Y |
Nice propaganda. How thoughtful of Memri to provide such an accurate translation. As one commenter of the video said:
| Quote: |
The translation is not correct. It's manipulated. He says:
Our children and wives don't fear death [it's logic after 60 years of bombings and massacres] and don't fear being human shields against Zionist attacks [they have nowhere to flee]. He never says "they have formed human shields" but anyway... Israelis are not right and neither are the Palestinians, but it sucks to see how the Israeli media machine works so well to misinform and misinterpret. |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memri#Bias |
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Jandar
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| bangbayed wrote: |
| Jandar wrote: |
In 2007, the Hamas leader said " "The Israelis love life but we love death, and so we will win."
Fathi Hammad: �We desire death like you desire life.�
Osama Bin Laden: �We love death. The U.S. loves life. That is the big difference between us�
Hassan Nasrallah: �We are going to win, because they love life and we love death"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0wJXf2nt4Y |
Nice propaganda. How thoughtful of Memri to provide such an accurate translation. As one commenter of the video said:
| Quote: |
The translation is not correct. It's manipulated. He says:
Our children and wives don't fear death [it's logic after 60 years of bombings and massacres] and don't fear being human shields against Zionist attacks [they have nowhere to flee]. He never says "they have formed human shields" but anyway... Israelis are not right and neither are the Palestinians, but it sucks to see how the Israeli media machine works so well to misinform and misinterpret. |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memri#Bias |
Yes, there are always differences in translations we know.
In the end the message is the same.
The theme continues.
The slogan remains, Hamas: "You love life, but we love death"
That was the point of the clip.
There is no escaping it, Hamas is not the solution. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject: |
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| bangbayed wrote: |
| Jandar wrote: |
In 2007, the Hamas leader said " "The Israelis love life but we love death, and so we will win."
Fathi Hammad: �We desire death like you desire life.�
Osama Bin Laden: �We love death. The U.S. loves life. That is the big difference between us�
Hassan Nasrallah: �We are going to win, because they love life and we love death"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0wJXf2nt4Y |
Nice propaganda. How thoughtful of Memri to provide such an accurate translation. As one commenter of the video said:
| Quote: |
The translation is not correct. It's manipulated. He says:
Our children and wives don't fear death [it's logic after 60 years of bombings and massacres] and don't fear being human shields against Zionist attacks [they have nowhere to flee]. He never says "they have formed human shields" but anyway... Israelis are not right and neither are the Palestinians, but it sucks to see how the Israeli media machine works so well to misinform and misinterpret. |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memri#Bias |
Memri has a good record of translations.
We don't know anything about the commenter.
There are plently of videos on Memri.
The ones who said the stuff in question ought to take the blame. Instead left wing whackos blame Memri for recording what was said. |
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canuckistan
Mod Team
Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Location: Training future GS competitors.....
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:05 am Post subject: |
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| clyde wrote: |
| Actually they are defending themselves against criminal rabble. Let's not forget that the force that they are using is democratically sanctioned, and not based upon the whims of unemployed barbarians. Either inform yourself better or at least admit that you had a German Grandfather or something. |
The democratically sanctioned force is being used against a democratically elected body.
Just wanted to point this out given the use of the term "democratically", I don't believe it "legitimizes" any action from either participant however. |
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samcheokguy
Joined: 02 Nov 2008
Location: Samcheok G-do
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:38 am Post subject: |
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| Why does ANYBODY think shooting model rockets at a country with one of the most insane airforces in the world is a good idea? The IAF is a buch of crazy dudes who would happily bomb North Korea, and get away with it. First rule of fighting Israel...don't put troops in groups bigger than 5. |
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Jandar
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 2:12 am Post subject: |
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| samcheokguy wrote: |
| Why does ANYBODY think shooting model rockets at a country with one of the most insane airforces in the world is a good idea? The IAF is a buch of crazy dudes who would happily bomb North Korea, and get away with it. First rule of fighting Israel...don't put troops in groups bigger than 5. |
Why five? |
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aka Dave
Joined: 02 May 2008
Location: Down by the river
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:55 am Post subject: |
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Okay, cut the crap Trevor.
Hamas is the effective ruler of Gaza. Hamas' explicit goal is the destruction of Israel, and that includes the *deliberate* extermination of civilians.
Hamas places it's rocket launching sites in civilian neighborhoods to insure that more *Palestinian* civilians are killed. Israel seeks to avoid civilian death as much as possible.
Intent matters. Hamas are murderers. Israel is defending itself. Remember: Hamas belives it is a divine imperative to exterminate the Jews.
I tell you what Trevor. If I come to your house and start shooting rockets at your family, what the heck are you gonna do? Negotiate? But I'd say "Trevor, my entire existence is devoted to wiping your family off the map", what are you going to do? Negotiate?
It's morally vacuous. Yes, the Palestinians have an awful plight. That is the plight of those who choose war, instead of peace, of fighting for land, instead of sharing it.
Ever since 1999, I have absolutely no sympathy for these people. They choose their bed, they deserve to lie in it. |
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Trevor
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 5:04 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for setting me straight on that, Dave, because before I thought it was Israel's fault, but now that you have slapped me into shape I know that it is really the Palestinians who are to blame. Thanks for setting me on the straight and narrow. Maybe if you were around when I was a kid I wouldn'ta had all these troubles getting stuff wrong.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1937048.stm
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/001/218vnicq.asp
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/apr/17/israel2
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51a/index-d.html
| aka Dave wrote: |
Okay, cut the crap Trevor.
Hamas is the effective ruler of Gaza. Hamas' explicit goal is the destruction of Israel, and that includes the *deliberate* extermination of civilians.
Hamas places it's rocket launching sites in civilian neighborhoods to insure that more *Palestinian* civilians are killed. Israel seeks to avoid civilian death as much as possible.
Intent matters. Hamas are murderers. Israel is defending itself. Remember: Hamas belives it is a divine imperative to exterminate the Jews.
I tell you what Trevor. If I come to your house and start shooting rockets at your family, what the heck are you gonna do? Negotiate? But I'd say "Trevor, my entire existence is devoted to wiping your family off the map", what are you going to do? Negotiate?
It's morally vacuous. Yes, the Palestinians have an awful plight. That is the plight of those who choose war, instead of peace, of fighting for land, instead of sharing it.
Ever since 1999, I have absolutely no sympathy for these people. They choose their bed, they deserve to lie in it. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 6:22 am Post subject: |
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| Trevor wrote: |
Thanks for setting me straight on that, Dave, because before I thought it was Israel's fault, but now that you have slapped me into shape I know that it is really the Palestinians who are to blame. Thanks for setting me on the straight and narrow. Maybe if you were around when I was a kid I wouldn'ta had all these troubles getting stuff wrong.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1937048.stm
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/001/218vnicq.asp
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/apr/17/israel2
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51a/index-d.html
| aka Dave wrote: |
Okay, cut the crap Trevor.
Hamas is the effective ruler of Gaza. Hamas' explicit goal is the destruction of Israel, and that includes the *deliberate* extermination of civilians.
Hamas places it's rocket launching sites in civilian neighborhoods to insure that more *Palestinian* civilians are killed. Israel seeks to avoid civilian death as much as possible.
Intent matters. Hamas are murderers. Israel is defending itself. Remember: Hamas belives it is a divine imperative to exterminate the Jews.
I tell you what Trevor. If I come to your house and start shooting rockets at your family, what the heck are you gonna do? Negotiate? But I'd say "Trevor, my entire existence is devoted to wiping your family off the map", what are you going to do? Negotiate?
It's morally vacuous. Yes, the Palestinians have an awful plight. That is the plight of those who choose war, instead of peace, of fighting for land, instead of sharing it.
Ever since 1999, I have absolutely no sympathy for these people. They choose their bed, they deserve to lie in it. |
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There was no Jenin Massacre Trevor. At least according to the UN. Please get your information correct. You are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.
THE day after the deadly Palestinian attack on Hebrew University in
| Quote: |
| Jerusalem, The Guardian, the left-leaning British newspaper, published an editorial criticizing Israel for what the paper called ''random, vengeful acts of terror'' against Palestinian civilians during its reoccupation of the West Bank town of Jenin last spring. This after a United Nations report dismissed Palestinian claims that Israel had massacred civilians there. |
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D06E2D8153BF937A3575BC0A9649C8B63
| Quote: |
U.N. report: No massacre in Jenin
UNITED NATIONS (AP) � A U.N. report released Thursday found no evidence to support Palestinian claims that Israeli forces massacred up to 500 people in the Jenin refugee camp, but it criticized both sides for putting civilian lives at risk. |
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2002-08-01-unreport-jenin_x.htm |
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Kimbop
Joined: 31 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:01 am Post subject: |
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I don't.
I somehow have little sympathy for a 'society' of people who choose to officiate a Malthusian collapse for the sole purpose of fighting a neighbor and laying claim to "holy land".
Gaza has one of the highest population growth rates on earth. Should I feel more sorry for them simply because they choose to reproduce like rabbits? Do I feel sorry for a settlement with half its population under the age of 15? Would they be living in poverty if they closed their legs and lived within their means?
Whether or not I have sympathy for the fraction of Palestinians who were displaced (aka; chose to oppose, rather than live in harmony) after the Israeli-arab war is a different topic. By octupling their population since that time they are shooting themselves in the foot, all the while praying that the ricochet will hit an Israeli. On the other hand, Gazans have little else to do besides get married, rely on UN handouts, and praise alla by bearing children. Lots of 'em.
but what irks me most is that they expect the world's sympathy while receiving handouts from the US via the UN.
"There are 700,000 of us! And Jews stole our land!" doesn;t quite have the same poignance as "there are 2,000,000 of us, and Jews stole our land!" , does it? But who's fault is that?? |
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Trevor
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:05 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for setting me straight.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/article394547.ece
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Trevor wrote: |
Thanks for setting me straight on that, Dave, because before I thought it was Israel's fault, but now that you have slapped me into shape I know that it is really the Palestinians who are to blame. Thanks for setting me on the straight and narrow. Maybe if you were around when I was a kid I wouldn'ta had all these troubles getting stuff wrong.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1937048.stm
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/001/218vnicq.asp
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/apr/17/israel2
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51a/index-d.html
| aka Dave wrote: |
Okay, cut the crap Trevor.
Hamas is the effective ruler of Gaza. Hamas' explicit goal is the destruction of Israel, and that includes the *deliberate* extermination of civilians.
Hamas places it's rocket launching sites in civilian neighborhoods to insure that more *Palestinian* civilians are killed. Israel seeks to avoid civilian death as much as possible.
Intent matters. Hamas are murderers. Israel is defending itself. Remember: Hamas belives it is a divine imperative to exterminate the Jews.
I tell you what Trevor. If I come to your house and start shooting rockets at your family, what the heck are you gonna do? Negotiate? But I'd say "Trevor, my entire existence is devoted to wiping your family off the map", what are you going to do? Negotiate?
It's morally vacuous. Yes, the Palestinians have an awful plight. That is the plight of those who choose war, instead of peace, of fighting for land, instead of sharing it.
Ever since 1999, I have absolutely no sympathy for these people. They choose their bed, they deserve to lie in it. |
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There was no Jenin Massacre Trevor. At least according to the UN. Please get your information correct. You are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.
THE day after the deadly Palestinian attack on Hebrew University in
| Quote: |
| Jerusalem, The Guardian, the left-leaning British newspaper, published an editorial criticizing Israel for what the paper called ''random, vengeful acts of terror'' against Palestinian civilians during its reoccupation of the West Bank town of Jenin last spring. This after a United Nations report dismissed Palestinian claims that Israel had massacred civilians there. |
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D06E2D8153BF937A3575BC0A9649C8B63
| Quote: |
U.N. report: No massacre in Jenin
UNITED NATIONS (AP) � A U.N. report released Thursday found no evidence to support Palestinian claims that Israeli forces massacred up to 500 people in the Jenin refugee camp, but it criticized both sides for putting civilian lives at risk. |
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2002-08-01-unreport-jenin_x.htm |
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Kimbop
Joined: 31 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:19 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the opinion piece written by a palestinian. It just so happens that she would rather live anywhere but the holy land, and writes op-eds for left-wing newspapers in the first world. There's plenty of oversimplification in her cute little editorial, which I could easily tear apart; but why? I'm sure it would fall on deaf ears. I especially like her conclusive threat; "But the ugly reality behind this myth is showing and people like Julie Burchill will have to take note some day. "
Some day? When fools outnumber smart people on this planet? or when Iran nukes Tel aviv? |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:31 am Post subject: |
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| Kimbop wrote: |
I don't.
I somehow have little sympathy for a 'society' of people who choose to officiate a Malthusian collapse for the sole purpose of fighting a neighbor and laying claim to "holy land".
Gaza has one of the highest population growth rates on earth. Should I feel more sorry for them simply because they choose to reproduce like rabbits? Do I feel sorry for a settlement with half its population under the age of 15? Would they be living in poverty if they closed their legs and lived within their means?
Whether or not I have sympathy for the fraction of Palestinians who were displaced (aka; chose to oppose, rather than live in harmony) after the Israeli-arab war is a different topic. By octupling their population since that time they are shooting themselves in the foot, all the while praying that the ricochet will hit an Israeli. On the other hand, Gazans have little else to do besides get married, rely on UN handouts, and praise alla by bearing children. Lots of 'em.
but what irks me most is that they expect the world's sympathy while receiving handouts from the US via the UN.
"There are 700,000 of us! And Jews stole our land!" doesn;t quite have the same poignance as "there are 2,000,000 of us, and Jews stole our land!" , does it? But who's fault is that?? |
C'mon, man. The kids didn't ask to be born into that f'ed up place and they didn't vote for Hamas. While I'm sure many of them will end up brainwashed and indoctrinated by hate and violence, they started out simply having the misfortune of being born in a shitty place during shitty times.
I don't shed many tears for the general adult population (after Hamas' landslide win). Still, we should keep in mind that we are members of the Lucky Sperm Club. I'm not religious, but I'll use the expression "but for the Grace of God go I." |
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