Korean Job Discussion Forums

[thepeel]

So, hands up those of you who have actually spent the time to familiarize yourselves with feminist literature. After reading this thread I think there is maybe only one person who has (I forget who, the girl who posts on the feminist web sites).

Surprised, I'm sure some of you will be, I've taken the time to explore the various "waves" throughly. While I agree that some feminists are nuts, the vast majority are concerned with "on the ground" issues such as abortion etc.

That said, whoever was complaining about a "war on boys" in schools is also right. Schools are dominated by women, and hyperactive young boys (which is the norm for a boy) are increasingly being medicated in an attempted to push down their maleness. Indeed, many psychologists have argued that the push towards ADD/ADHD being extremely loosely defined is effectively declaring maleness in young boys a medical disorder worthy of medication. In the UK and USA the rates of boys on Ritalin are astounding and disgusting.

Anyways,

The reason that people think feminism is best represented by the extremists is because extremists stand out in their use/abuse of the word "sexist" (and also racist, classest, homophobe and now "islamophobe"). This style of hijacking a debate with the legacy of cultural baggage is extremly unpopular but also extremely effecitve.

So, you tell a dude he is a sexist and he shuts up. Who wants to be called a sexist? But in his mind, and the minds of all the men who agree with him, "feminism" is about abusing language for political ends. These abusive feminists should be shouted down by all. They suck.

[Butterfly]

Great post.

[peppermint]

And that is exactly why I said radical feminists make me angry. They've made it far too easy for men to dismiss feminism, and it disturbs me to think of how many men, whose opinions I respect, do just that.

The trend towards pathologizing boys seems to have been twisted along the way. It would've died the quiet death it deserved, had school boards not realised that if kids are sedated, a teacher can handle more of them in the classroom, which increases efficiency, leads to more government funding, etc.

Feminists don't spring up independent of male influence, they have male friends, brothers, fathers and most relevant to my point here, in many cases, they have sons.

[The Bobster]

[Bramble]

Thanks for the kind words, BB, but I'm afraid you're talking to a wall. I definitely support the ALF in principle, but I have no time at the moment to go into a detailed explanation of which individual actions I support wholeheartedly and which ones I have mixed feelings about ... or what the ALF is and what "supporting" it really entails. And I'm not about to waste my breath defending my motives for holding the opinions I do. For now, let's just say our hysterical friend is deliberately misleading his readership more than a little ...

What was that thing someone babbled about Baby Jesus a while back?

[Bramble]

To Periwinkle: Don't take the bait. He's not worth your time.

[Butterfly]

double post

[Butterfly]

[Rteacher]

Since I ain't got nothing better to do, I might as well inject some Vedic wisdom into this thread (like I did in one of the other misogynist threads - it's hard to keep track...)

Although I'm gonna post an extended quote on the role of women in India's ancient Vedic culture, I think that the underlying message is that the more materialistic a culture becomes, the more its relationships become degraded, abusive, and unfulfilling.

I think that there arose a need for "women's liberation" due to historical exploitation of women as a class, but it needs to be balenced with a revolution in spiritual values. Materialistic revolution has never made people happy...

In a spiritually progressive culture, both men and women gradually realize that their real identity extends beyond their material bodily designation. They work cooperatively (usually within a "sacred" marriage) to achieve both material and spiritual happiness in this life and the next.

There's a lasting sense of purpose, and relationships are not just based on mutual - but short-lived - sense gratification.

In materially contaminated consciousness we have forgotten our eternal relationship with the Absolute Person who is the reservoir of all pleasure. A spiritually progressive social system can gradually revive our original pure consciousness that leads to never-ending happiness.

India's Vedic culture originally honored the role of women, and relations within the family and society were usually peaceful and harmonious.

However, that culture eventually became corrupted - largely due to outside influences that saw women mainly as objects to be exploited ...

Throughout the many years of Vedic culture, women have always been given the highest level of respect and freedom, but also protection and safety. There is a Vedic saying, "Where women are worshiped, there the gods dwell." Or where the women are happy, there will be prosperity. In fact the direct quotes from the Manu-samhita explains as follows:

"Women must be honored and adorned by their fathers, brothers, husbands, and brothers..., who desire their own welfare. Where women are honored, there the gods are pleased; but where they are not honored, no sacred rite yields rewards. Where the female relations live in grief, the family soon wholly perishes; but that family where they are not unhappy ever prospers. The houses on which female relations, not being duly honored, pronounce a curse, perish completely, as if destroyed by magic. Hence men who seek (their own) welfare, should always honor women on holidays and festivals with (gifts of) ornaments, clothes and (dainty) food." (Manu Smriti III.55-59)

Additional quotes can be found in other portions of the Vedic literature. This is the proper Vedic standard. If this standard is not being followed, then it represents a diversion of the genuine Vedic tradition. Due to this tradition, India's history includes many women who have risen to great heights in spirituality, government, writing, education, science, or even as warriors on the battlefield.


Unfortunately, these standards have declined primarily due to the outside influences that have crept in because of foreign invaders, either militarily or culturally. These foreign invaders who dominated India mostly looked at women as objects of sexual enjoyment and exploitation, and as the spoils of war to be taken like a prize. The oppression of women increased in India because of Moghul rule. As such foreigners gained influence and converts, decay of the spiritual standards also crept into Indian and Vedic culture. The educational criteria of Vedic culture also changed and the teaching of the divinity of motherhood was almost lost. The teaching changed from emphasis on the development of individual self-reliance to dependence on and service to others. Thus, competition replaced the pursuit for truth, and selfishness and possessiveness replaced the spirit of renunciation and detachment. And gradually women were viewed as less divine and more as objects of gratification or property to be possessed and controlled...

In Vedic culture it is taught that every man should view and respect every woman, except his own wife, as his mother, and every girl with the same concern and care as his own daughter. It is only because of the lack of such training and the social distancing from the high morals as this that this teaching is being forgotten, and the respect that society should have for women has been reduced.

Here's an interesting form of powerful demigod, Lord Shiva (who usually is understood to be married to the "Goddess" of material energy ...)

[periwinkle]

[kermo]

It's strange that someone would be keeping track of the gender of who Periwinkle is standing up for or fighting with. There are a few explanations for why she would find herself frequently in conflict with men-- perhaps because the majority of the posters here are men, and the majority of the outspoken jerks on here are men. Tell me I'm wrong.

I don't think Periwinkle tends to clash with people much at all. But never mind what I have to say-- the fact that we both have uterii will cause me to become inevitably biased.

[periwinkle]

P.S. Bobster, I don't remember what anyone said on the dog killer thread (except for a poem that I printed off), and I don't hold grudges against anyone on this site. There are some posters I try to avoid because I don't want to tangle with them, but I assure you, I don't hold a grudge against you. Peace, ok?

[Big_Bird]

[Rteacher]

Well, he's probably a meat-eater - and (as far as I know) they all have mean streaks that are displayed from time to time - perhaps most conveniently directed at vegetarian women who would balk at cooking his steaks...

[The Bobster]