Site Search:
 
Speak Korean Now!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Black people 'less intelligent' claims James Watson
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Current Events Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Tony_Balony



Joined: 12 Apr 2007

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Perfect Cup of Coffee wrote:
Tony_Balony wrote:
Tony .... I'm serious. Just shut up. Say nothing. move along. There is nothing here you want. For once in your life, just shut up.


Haha. Knew you couldn't leave this one alone. Nice try though.


Sigh
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bucheon bum



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony_Balony wrote:


BTW, the NYtimes is an unreliable and heavily biased news source.

Are we talking about people of African ancestry, African Brits or African Americans? They are different groups and require different handling.

Your point is ultimately moot. If the reality is that Blacks have to be provided with advancement they then exist at the permission of someone else. Its ultimately an existance of passiveness and permission and willing subjgation. You, they won't let us do this. You, they won't let us do that. You have to introduce self effication somehow. Your aguments assume an environment of absolute global racism. You'll have to eventually lose that whole aspect for credibility.

Asians stopped relying of factory jobs or did they? No they didn't. Now they run the factories. Thats effication.


Yeah yeah, whipping out the ol' "Ny Times is biased" line. In this case, who cares? I was just taking a quote from a black entrepreneur/activist. Where is the bias in this case?


How do my arguments assume an environment of absolute global racism? You lost me there. Have I argued anything about the position of blacks? none whatsoever. All I have done is disprove kingplaya's "theory" about test scores and blacks across the globe.


Last edited by bucheon bum on Fri Oct 19, 2007 6:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SPINOZA



Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Location: $eoul

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The strangest aspect to intellgence and race is that East Asians always score marginally higher than caucasians (+).

If that is the reality, why is it only the Japanese who perform as well as the US, European and Commonwealth countries economically? One thing all humans agree on is that more wealth is better than less wealth and that power is good. Why therefore are the richest countries historically and to this day overwhelmingly ethnically European?

Why did the Chinese economy only recently (2005) take over the British economy with 1300 million Chinese against 60 million Brits?

Why has it always been the Brits and the Americans responsible for major inventions (car, airplane, Concorde, space shuttle, Mars Rover, world wide web, computer, telephone, steam engine......) and discoveries, and not, say, the Chinese?

Why, if the Hong Kong Chinese are the smartest race in the world (why can't I find that link? I saw it only last week!), why did these people mostly yearn to remain under British rule (and not hand over to Chinese rule) during the handover of Hong Kong in 1997?

Why - if South Koreans are the 2nd or 3rd smartest race - does South Korea have only 8 universities in the top 500 compared to, say, Australia with 14 (with twice Australia's population)? Would those of us who live and work with Koreans on a daily basis be happy to conclude that we're amongst the 2nd or 3rd cleverest race on Earth?

Why does South Korea have only one Nobel Laureate in its history, compared to 30 in Sweden?

How are these immigration to the United States statistics reconcilable with indigenous populations of East Asia being marginally more intelligent generally than people of European ethnicity?

And why, finally, do non-western societies come under the influence of Westernization in matters like industry, technology, law, politics, economics, lifestyle, diet, language, religion and values....if Caucasians on average are marginally less intelligent than East Asians?

All this, by the way, is entirely legitimate comment, not an argument for racial supremacy.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jinju



Joined: 22 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what is wrong with what he said? Let's not beat around the bush and act all PC. Anyone who has been to Africa knows that they are not on the level of the west in terms of education and scientific sophistication. face the facts people, whle it may not be a race issue, it sure as hell is a cultural one. And the sad fact is that Africa is unable to take care of itself because it is a land where science loses out to supersition. is it that they are less intelligent because they are black? I dont know. But they ARE less intelligent and the reality of the state of Africa proves it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Nowhere Man



Joined: 08 Feb 2004

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 7:16 pm    Post subject: ... Reply with quote

Quote:
So what is wrong with what he said?


Yeah, look at me!

Quote:
Let's not beat around the bush and act all PC.


Yeah look at me!

Quote:
Anyone who has been to Africa knows that they are not on the level of the west in terms of education and scientific sophistication.


Yeah look at me!


Quote:
face the facts people,


Yeah look at me!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Alyallen



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Read through the thread. Not too surprised by what I read.

Ultimately, who gives a shit? I am not representative of anything but myself and my upbringing, so let him say Blacks are stupid or whatever. I've proved that wrong throughout my life. That's also true of my "white trash" friends, my fresh off the boat Carib friends (Black, White or Hispanic), my Chinese friends, my Korean friends and anyone else who took the opportunities given to them and used them. In the end, there are always lots of examples that disprove any stereotype or generalization.

So in the end, it only made news because of who said it, not necessarily because of what was said.

SLOW NEWS DAY.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Cheonmunka



Joined: 04 Jun 2004

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think everybody is a little different. You know the standard deviation of IQ. If I grow from seed a black flower in a pot next to a white flower and feed them the same, I'm sure they will both, within a standard deviation, grow the same.
We are products of our environments, give or take.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
On the other hand



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
If that is the reality, why is it only the Japanese who perform as well as the US, European and Commonwealth countries economically? One thing all humans agree on is that more wealth is better than less wealth and that power is good. Why therefore are the richest countries historically and to this day overwhelmingly ethnically European?


And we can wonder why North American indians, whose immediate ancestors were Asiatic, in many cases lagged behind other places in terms of technology. As far as I know, most of them hadn't even gotten around to the wheel by the time they were conquered.

(And no: I'm not saying that indians were inherently stupid. My point is the opposite: that race is not a binding factor in predicting what a cultural group is going to accomplish.)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mindmetoo



Joined: 02 Feb 2004

PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 5:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually let me withdraw my "confused old man" line of defense. I read more. Watson went on to say something about "anyone who has worked with black people know they're not as intelligent." And then he's earlier slagged women and homosexuals.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dmbfan



Joined: 09 Mar 2006

PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The strangest aspect to intellgence and race is that East Asians always score marginally higher than caucasians (+).

If that is the reality, why is it only the Japanese who perform as well as the US, European and Commonwealth countries economically? One thing all humans agree on is that more wealth is better than less wealth and that power is good. Why therefore are the richest countries historically and to this day overwhelmingly ethnically European?

Why did the Chinese economy only recently (2005) take over the British economy with 1300 million Chinese against 60 million Brits?

Why has it always been the Brits and the Americans responsible for major inventions (car, airplane, Concorde, space shuttle, Mars Rover, world wide web, computer, telephone, steam engine......) and discoveries, and not, say, the Chinese?

Why, if the Hong Kong Chinese are the smartest race in the world (why can't I find that link? I saw it only last week!), why did these people mostly yearn to remain under British rule (and not hand over to Chinese rule) during the handover of Hong Kong in 1997?

Why - if South Koreans are the 2nd or 3rd smartest race - does South Korea have only 8 universities in the top 500 compared to, say, Australia with 14 (with twice Australia's population)? Would those of us who live and work with Koreans on a daily basis be happy to conclude that we're amongst the 2nd or 3rd cleverest race on Earth?

Why does South Korea have only one Nobel Laureate in its history, compared to 30 in Sweden?

How are these immigration to the United States statistics reconcilable with indigenous populations of East Asia being marginally more intelligent generally than people of European ethnicity?

And why, finally, do non-western societies come under the influence of Westernization in matters like industry, technology, law, politics, economics, lifestyle, diet, language, religion and values....if Caucasians on average are marginally less intelligent than East Asians?

All this, by the way, is entirely legitimate comment, not an argument for racial supremacy.
_________________



Some good points have been made, there.

Is it being a racist, placing people in stereotypes.......or just numbers and statistics?


dmbfan
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
agentX



Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Location: Jeolla province

PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Intelligence doesn't necessarily relate to circumstances. That's what Watson is missing with his conclusions.
Having a 200 point IQ doesn't mean you'll make it out of Hell' kitchen, or 21st Street in Oakland or even out of the grinding poverty of Bangladesh.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ED209



Joined: 17 Oct 2006

PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPINOZA wrote:


Why did the Chinese economy only recently (2005) take over the British economy with 1300 million Chinese against 60 million Brits?


Because China only just got an economy, before that thanks to Communism and possibly our dear friend Confucius they were staunchly anti-capitalist. O'yeah and not let's forget the British-China opium wars "keeping the sick men of Asia sick".

Many Brits are not white, also the UK economy is not run by 100% British whites.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bigverne



Joined: 12 May 2004

PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Many Brits are not white, also the UK economy is not run by 100% British whites


For almost its entire history, most Brits have been white, and the economy has been run by white people for that same period, so when talking about long-term economic development, it is entirely accurate to describe the UK as a white, European nation.

As for this race debate, since blacks have been allowed to compete on an equal basis with whites, they have dominated sprint athletics, and there are physiological reasons why blacks, of West African origin, do dominate these events. Now, if we conclude that racial differences can be witnessed on the athletics track, why is it so controversial to state that they are may also be seen when assessing intelligence.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mix1



Joined: 08 May 2007

PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheonmunka wrote:
Where I come from test results differ between Island, Maori and Pakeha (white) in part due to expectations. I have met some really dumb white people, and perhaps the dumbest of any person I've ever met was a white sharemilker's son.
But then, the expectations on him were low. Make him GWB's son and I bet he would have gone to Harvard.


I have met some really dumb people of all colors, and perhaps the dumbest of any person I've ever met was ...oops! I don't want to offend anyone, so I'll just say "white" ...I'm sure nobody will have a problem with that, right? Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mack4289



Joined: 06 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where has the PC backlash come from? I haven't heard anyone get offended just by having intelligence as it relates to race discussed. Hasn't the anti-PC, bracing-yourself-to-get-persecuted-by-the-thought-police stance gotten as tired and irritating as the PC movement itself?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Current Events Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International