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Pronoun "you" in Korean Language Question
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Drew345



Joined: 24 May 2005

PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darn, happened again just before class. I'm in the elevator with a Japanese student from another class. She looks at me and says "키가 커요!". She was tall for a Japanese girl, so I wanted to say, "You are tall too." But I was just left standing there thinking "Darn, there's that "you" word again".
So the right (beginner) thing to say would be "도 키가 커요!" (and point?)
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billybrobby



Joined: 09 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

도 never appears by itself. You've really just got to learn her name. That's part of why it's considered polite. It's a terrible thing for people like me who never remember names.
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komtengi



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drew345 wrote:
Darn, happened again just before class. I'm in the elevator with a Japanese student from another class. She looks at me and says "키가 커요!". She was tall for a Japanese girl, so I wanted to say, "You are tall too." But I was just left standing there thinking "Darn, there's that "you" word again".
So the right (beginner) thing to say would be "도 키가 커요!" (and point?)


그쪽도

where are you studying??

I'd love to meet me a tall Japanese girl
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Drew345



Joined: 24 May 2005

PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

She was tall for a Japanese girl anyway.
I study at Ganada
http://www.gkli.co.kr/en/main.htm

They offer each sublevel month by month, so they get mostly Japanese coming over for a month or two to study. I think only 2 westerners in the whole building. Nice thing is almost no English in the classroom.

I guess what I learned from this thread is to just not fight it and use the persons name or title (doesn't work if I never saw them before), or just omit "you" altogether (and follow 누구? with a finger point). OK, I accept it (almost).
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PeteJB



Joined: 06 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In that situation you would never say 'you'. What you would say is 뭐뭐 씨도 키가 커요. You address always by name. Formalities are not relevant to this particular question, but if your interested give me a bell. If you don't know the persons name, then use what you learned in this thread. To me it always seems a bit strange to speak that way when I don't know someone, I tend to play those kind of statements down by nature. Wink
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skindleshanks



Joined: 10 May 2004

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know forthe possessive "your" one can say "네" or "너의," but I often hear (and say) "자기(의)" which, I think, means, "oneself's" and can be used instead of "my" or"your" (or even "his" or "hers") as long as the subject is understood.

The lack of a good second person pronoun drove me crazy for years, but I think practising the proper verb endings comes in handy to indicate who you're talking to or about, especially if you're using honorifics.
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Juregen



Joined: 30 May 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NightSky wrote:
Drew345 wrote:
It just seems like dropping the "you" altogether leads to such ambiguity. So you meet a girl for a date and just say "예뻐요". Could be talking about the girl walking past.


um...if you look at the girl you're with and say "pretty", she probably knows you mean her. if you're gazing off into the sunset, she knows you mean the sunset. Or the other girl walking by.


Indeed.

Koreans solve the problem by assuming you understand the situation in which the question is formed.
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Drew345



Joined: 24 May 2005

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems funny that I can't get through a day without needing to use the word "you"; but in 2000 years, hundreds of millions of Koreans have never had a need to speak this word. Fundamentally different ways of thinking?

Today I took my scooter to the shop, and there were a few people there for service. When I got my turn I wanted to mention how busy he was today. I said "오늘 바빠 요." Then I realized, wait, did I just say he was busy or I am busy. He didn't pay much attention anyway.
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blackjack



Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: anyang

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drew345 wrote:
Seems funny that I can't get through a day without needing to use the word "you"; but in 2000 years, hundreds of millions of Koreans have never had a need to speak this word. Fundamentally different ways of thinking?

Today I took my scooter to the shop, and there were a few people there for service. When I got my turn I wanted to mention how busy he was today. I said "오늘 바빠 요." Then I realized, wait, did I just say he was busy or I am busy. He didn't pay much attention anyway.


Just asked my wife about this one and she said that it is all about intonation. In a situation like that you would make it a question, unlikely that they would say it as a statement. If you were saying that you (the op) are busy you would would say 처 바빠 요
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Thiuda



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Location: Religion ist f�r Sklaven geschaffen, f�r Wesen ohne Geist.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Korean is a pro-drop language.
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i4NI



Joined: 17 May 2008
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 5:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

komtengi wrote:
you've got it wrong..
당신, 당신은, 당신의 is used for someone you've met once, are not considered friends or is of a "higher" level
넌, 너의, 너 is used for someone intimate or of a lower level

Nobody uses 당신 unless they mean 'honey' or 'baby'

OP you is omitted usually unless with close friends. There is no reason to ask in Koren "Did YOU eat?"

너 밥을 먹었어?
vs.
밥을 먹었어?

The 'you' is assumed since you are already talking to him.
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blackjack



Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: anyang

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i4NI wrote:
komtengi wrote:
you've got it wrong..
당신, 당신은, 당신의 is used for someone you've met once, are not considered friends or is of a "higher" level
넌, 너의, 너 is used for someone intimate or of a lower level

Nobody uses 당신 unless they mean 'honey' or 'baby'

OP you is omitted usually unless with close friends. There is no reason to ask in Koren "Did YOU eat?"

너 밥을 먹었어?
vs.
밥을 먹었어?

The 'you' is assumed since you are already talking to him.


Just asked the wife about this again and the old and new generations use
당신 differently.

Old generation uses it like i4NI says. New generation only tends to use it in arguments with strangers, like when you want to say you ... but don't want to use a low form.
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nobbyken



Joined: 07 Jun 2006
Location: Yongin ^^

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drew345 wrote:

Today I took my scooter to the shop, and there were a few people there for service. When I got my turn I wanted to mention how busy he was today. I said "오늘 바빠 요." Then I realized, wait, did I just say he was busy or I am busy. He didn't pay much attention anyway.


If the second word was in asked with rising intonation it was a question.
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komtengi



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i4NI wrote:
komtengi wrote:
you've got it wrong..
당신, 당신은, 당신의 is used for someone you've met once, are not considered friends or is of a "higher" level
넌, 너의, 너 is used for someone intimate or of a lower level

Nobody uses 당신 unless they mean 'honey' or 'baby'


Rolling Eyes
자기, 여보 are more appropriate terms in that instance.

you might want to recheck your sources
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i4NI



Joined: 17 May 2008
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

komtengi wrote:
i4NI wrote:
komtengi wrote:
you've got it wrong..
당신, 당신은, 당신의 is used for someone you've met once, are not considered friends or is of a "higher" level
넌, 너의, 너 is used for someone intimate or of a lower level

Nobody uses 당신 unless they mean 'honey' or 'baby'


Rolling Eyes
자기, 여보 are more appropriate terms in that instance.

you might want to recheck your sources

Who are YOUR sources? Go ask any Korean Mr. Know-It-All. It's a matter of preference on the couple.

Since you probably won't be asking anyone, here is another source:
http://endic.naver.com/endic.nhn?docid=2199590&rd=s

It's like saying, don't say "darling", honey or baby are more appropriate terms in that instance. Rolling Eyes

Know what you're talking about first before you attempt to correct someone next time.
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