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What's it like for those fluent in the language?
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kangnamdragon



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Location: Kangnam, Seoul, Korea

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mack the knife wrote:


Bottom line: learning the language is EMPOWERING.


I think this is an extremely important point!!
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It took me:
12 months of study in Japan
3 months living in Korea in 2002

to become fluent, but it's easy for Japanese speakers...Japanese took me twice that time to learn it back when I only knew English.
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ohahakehte



Joined: 24 Aug 2003
Location: The State of Denial

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i feel really guilty and frustrated w/ myself that ive lost most of my passion to learn korean since i arrived last october. also my day to day routines dont require that i say much beyond "chamchi chigay chuseyo", etc. though i would like that to change. the guilt is worse because im a languages and linguistics geek but my drive to study korean doesnt match my drive to read chomsky's linguistics books. i speak better mohawk than korean for crying out loud! a language spoken by 2000-4000 people! i bet less than 5 mohawks a year visit korea!

since ive met a korean woman here who speaks better french than english, im more intent on mastering french (im almost there) than korean. i guess because its easier cause ive been learning french since i was 5.
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princess



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just my two cents...but I find it very hard to believe that a person knows Korean fluently in 3 months...
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komtengi



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe he means 12 months of Korean study in Japan.... studying Japanese and then stuying Korean or vice versa is a huge advantage, but from what Ive seen Mithrates grammar and written Korean is great, I'd be surprised if his spoken and listening was an advanced level in that period of time
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Jensen



Joined: 30 Mar 2003
Location: hippie hell

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

komtengi wrote:
I believe he means 12 months of Korean study in Japan.... studying Japanese and then stuying Korean or vice versa is a huge advantage, but from what Ive seen Mithrates grammar and written Korean is great, I'd be surprised if his spoken and listening was an advanced level in that period of time


If he got Japanese down "fluent" in even twice that time he's one of those lucky language spazzes. Mormon missionaries get pretty good in two years, but I haven't seen many that describe themselves as being fluent in that time. Anyway "fluency" is used differently by different people. I don't honestly know how it is used in terms of formal linquistics, but to me being fluent means people can't tell from your language, in a variety of settings, that you aren't a native. Yeah, I got mistaken for being a Korean over the phone once...the guy told me to call back when I was sober.

A friend in college had a tremendous memory, took him a few minutes to master stuff that took me hours. He could flip through a text book and then hand it to you and "read" off the pages like he was holding it in front of him, sometimes would miss a couple of lines because they were "blurry." He had no trouble with languages, spoken or written. Amazing to watch, and a little bit infuriating. Like somebody (Paul DeLay?) said about John Lang's guitar playing, "...he's so good it makes me want to break all his little fingers..."
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shakuhachi



Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is possible to learn a language in that time. It takes lots of effort and a little talent. Japanese to Korean is the easiest way.
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komtengi



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont speak japanese, but I can tell that the pronunciation is incredibly different. Getting the correct pronunciation of Korean is very difficult, and I know people that have studied it for years but still have problems with correct pronunciation.
Personally I studied Korean for 3 years and have lived here for another 2. But I was lucky enough to spend 12 months at the earlier stages of study in Korea. I get comments from people on the phone that they think Im Korean all the time. Even from people that have known me for years dont recognise that its me on occasions.
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Eazy_E



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Location: British Columbia, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Someone please answer the question: how long does it REALLY take for someone with no background in Asian languages to become fully functional in Korean in almost all situations?
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I spent the three months not working, living in Shinchon and studying in coffee shops during the day and hanging out with friends at night. Going Japanese to Korean is like going English to French.

I'm also going to be interviewed on KBS Radio One tomorrow night...it's the 11pm to 1am show so you can hear me speak then.

Sorry, I don't have any tapes of me after the three-month stint, but I was fluent enough to read Dostoevsky's The Devils (I think that's the English title) in Korean during that three-month period.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 4:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, and for a person with no Asian language background, it would take about a year of study at home and then a year or two of living here. The reason why I emphasize the study at home is that when people arrive here with no Korean language skills, they either make friends with English-speaking foreigners or English-speaking Koreans. Almost nobody can go a long time without friends and it's not nice to throw away your English-speaking friends after you've learned Korean either, which is the dilemma that a lot of people go through here.
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komtengi



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 5:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I was fluent enough to read Dostoevsky's The Devils (I think that's the English title) in Korean during that three-month period.

Impressive, very impressive. I have a degree in Korean but I'd never attempt to do that. I can read and write, but spend 99% of my time using spoken Korean so I've ignored my reading and writing of late. I really need to get off my butt and learn chinese characters.

Quote:
it would take about a year of study at home

Unless you are really motivated, I wouldn't reccomend this. Learning from friends isnt a great way to learn either. Enrol in a beginners class, get some basics and go from there.

By the way Mithrates, do you have asian ancestory??
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Eazy_E



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Location: British Columbia, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="komtengi"]
Quote:
friends isnt a great way to learn either.


Any particular reason why this is? I have a Korean friend whom I met through a mutual friend who speaks both Korean and English. So I guess she's my only hope for learning the language. She seems pretty patient with me so far, and she speaks NO English which means I don't have that for a life preserver.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah, sorry - when I said home I meant in one's home country, so taking a class would be recommended. Let's change that phrase to:
-A year of study before coming to Korea

My ancestry's all English/Scottish/Belgian/bit o' Spanish/5% unknown, but I do love RPG games; that's why I first started studying Japanese.

Because Dragon Warrior only goes up to #4 in the English version!
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komtengi



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eazy E.... learning from friends means you tend to pick up bad habits. Which will be a bigger pain in the long run. Iv'e found that people that learn from friends often dont understand the formality of the language. Learning from a woman will also tend to have you sounding like a woman when you speak in Korean.
If its the only way to go, you have to do it like that I guess. Just try not to pick up any bad habits. Smile

In your photos that I've seen Mithrates I presumed you had an Asian parent.... my bad Embarassed
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