Korean Job Discussion Forums

morrisonhotel · Joined: 18 Jul 2009 Location: Gyeonggi-do

To prove the point: if anyone would like to undertake a distance learning course from an accredited and established U.K. university for free then PM me (the university may not be a top university but it's perfectly reputable). No lies, it's completely free. It is not a degree, but 2 modules from a B.A.(which can be credit transferred to their degree program). You even get a certificate acknowledging what you have studied. It's not from a Mickey Mouse degree either (though some wisecracks may think otherwise). It'll give all you naysayers a chance to experience accredited online learning for free (though it does have a waiting list at the moment so you'll have to wait a bit to undertake the course).

morrisonhotel · Joined: 18 Jul 2009 Location: Gyeonggi-do

Craven Moorehead · Joined: 14 Jan 2006

tacitus14 · Joined: 10 Nov 2008

...and it's the sheer ignorance of posters such as yourself that makes me wonder how on Earth people can live a life of such complete, close-minded views and opinionated points.

I guess degrees from Harvard have no credibility.

http://www.extension.harvard.edu/2009-10/programs/

Shocked

You should really know the now and be informed before drawing such assinine conclusions.[/quote]

I love these debates. They are hilarious. My favorite: people who post websites and can't even read them.

Person 1: Where did you go to university?

Person 2: I went to Harvard.

Person 1: Whoa! That's really impressive.

Person 2: Yes, yes it is. I completed my "master's of liberal arts in extension studies"(!!!!!!!)

Person 1: Oh so you didn't go to Harvard at all. And your degree has no academic value. I understand now.

The Gipkik · Joined: 30 Mar 2009

delete

The Gipkik · Joined: 30 Mar 2009

makemehavefun · Joined: 12 Sep 2009

ThePoet · Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:20 am Post subject:

Hmmmm, sorry, I thought recivitism meant drop-out rates. That was how I interpreted it. The Mieriam Webster online dictionary defines it as a falling back into past behaviours and then further says usually into criminal behaviours, but I hadf always thought it meant to fall back away from higher learning. So, there's my lesson; use "drop-out rates" from now on.

And I had mis-typed it to boot! Recividism.

Poet

Craven Moorehead · Joined: 14 Jan 2006

maingman · Joined: 26 Jan 2008 Location: left Korea

http://blog.cathy-moore.com/2008/04/which-verb-will-keep-your-learners-interest/#SlideFrame_1

Nowhere Man · Joined: 08 Feb 2004

I knew a thread of this sort would inevitably emerge sooner or later.

I'll preface by saying I'm talking about TESOL.

My $.02 on the issue goes like this:

98% of the MATESOLs/MA Applied Linguistics/M.Eds on offer, distance or on-site, have as their primary aim to familiarize and teach you how to do academic research in the field. In this sense, the goal skews away from commonly accepted notions that an MA of either sort makes you a better teacher. To be more precise, what you're primarily graded on is ability to critically analyze literature and/or research and write for professional publications like ELTJ.

Some on-site as well as distance MAs include teaching practicums. Distance practicum typically involves videotaped classes. In one sense, I thought this made on-site learning superior. On the other hand, lessons differ quite greatly between ESL and EFL. I'd rather teach in a monocultural classroom that my experience in Asia has provided than be back home teaching a Mexican, a Japanese, two Germans, and a refugee from Darfur. Sure, teaching them is a good experience, but the dynamic drastically shifts from my base experience. In this way, filming me with a class of Koreans allows me much more to conduct a "master class" than suddenly have to adjust to a setting inconsistent with my experience.

So, what do we have now? We have MA's both on-site and distance with goals of research and teaching all mixed together.

Herein lies the problem:
Suppose you are hiring a teacher with an MATESOL/Linguistics/Applied Linguistics/M.Ed

What skills/knowledge does having this degree indicate?

Answer: It's all pretty vague.

Before anyone gets hopping mad and jumps on me, saying, "Well, you know what!? My MA___________ taught me X,Y, and Z..."

That's not my point. My point is that there is no standardization in terms of what these degrees confer. Good for you. I guess you found a good program or are just very defensive.

This whole position emerged from discussions I've seen on the main ESLcafe Training Forum.

Specifically, there are/were MA people denouncing CELTA as a "bag of tricks" as compared to their MA. As someone holding both now, I'd have to say that, in terms of hiring, CELTA (or equivalent) courses are more indicative of teaching skill. DELTA even moreso.

MA? An MA opens doors. It demonstrates the perseverance to get one, but I have no idea what your MA means in terms of classroom ability.

Is it distance or on-site? Well, holders of an on-site Master's might think so. BUT, the nature of teaching abroad justifies distance learning to a significant degree, and there are a notable number of MA-holders out there lecturing with little inkling that blabbering afternoons away does little to improve what is a skill-based subject.

To sum up, there are probably some prejudiced managers out there, but whether your degree was on-site or distance is kind of secondary to your classroom ability. Accordingly, MA programs in our field would serve everyone better if they were more standardized. Furthermore, training is good. In all forms. The time you spend on a web forum trying to poo-poo someone else's qualifications could have been better spent earning both theirs and the ones you have.

Nowhere Man · Joined: 08 Feb 2004

and I forgot

The 2% of MAs that consistently produce better teachers are Monterrey and SIT.

The Gipkik · Joined: 30 Mar 2009

peemil · Joined: 09 Feb 2003 Location: Koowoompa

I have always studied externally and have completed two degrees this way. In Australia, a lot of undergraduate and post-graduate courses are offered externally through Universities. You do exactly the same course work as those on-campus, use the same text books, get the same lecture notes, do the same exam, contact the same tutors and lectures for help, and at the end of it all, get the same degree or qualification, without "acquired externally" or some other nonsense on it.

The only difference is, there are no tutorial or lectures to attend. If you feel like it, and you live close by, you can attend lectures. Some courses offer residential schools during mid-semester breaks that you can attend.

In this context, I can't see what the hoopla is all about. Maybe, in the American context, where I have been told, residency on campus is compulsory? Therefore, anything outside of the brilliant undergraduate experience of getting off your chops with some newly acquired quasi-intellectual waster friends, is just not learning?

I'm currently doing my post-graduate work in Clinical Psychology externally, and love the fact that I don't have to make "compulsory" tutorials and that I can get most of a university course done in half the time of the grinding slow pace that exists on most campuses.