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Finns in Korea
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Zed



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Shakedown Street

PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought maybe you were doing some study of languages related to the Finno-Ugric group and you would be asking about Hungarians next.
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Gwangjuboy



Joined: 08 Jul 2003
Location: England

PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mithridates wrote:
Ah, that's a long story.
Way back in '94 or so I heard a death metal band called Amorphis that I really liked. After buying their CD it turned out they were from Finland. I was in high school then so no chance of jetting off to live there, so later on in '98 after I graduated high school I decided I wanted to go over there for a bit. However, Finland is expensive and I didn't make much money so I decided to go to Estonia instead, neighbouring country, very similar language, and seemed just as cool. So in October I went off to Estonia...I had planned to stay there for a few months but it seemed that a few months before this situation had happened:

Estonia: We give Canadians 3-month visas for free, can you give us the same?
Canada: No, because you might have some holdover Soviet spies. You have to pay for a one month visa.
Estonia: Fine, then so do you!
Canada: We don't really care...

I think that's about what happened. As a result, Canadians like me who want to live for a bit in Estonia (I was probably the only one actually) don't get to stay for over 30 days! I found that out at the border so I paid money for a one month visa and stayed in Tallinn for 30 days. I was thinking about going to school there but the Japanese I had just started to learn was falling out of my head and I felt that it would be best to focus on Japanese first and go back to Estonia later. So in November I took the plane home to Calgary, kept up the Japanese, came to Korea later, and now my Korean is mostly fluent. I looked for a few Estonian books here but since Finnish is a little bit more popular and resources more plenty I decided to work on that instead, and that's the story!



Now for today's story:
Went to the Finnish consulate today, on the 16th floor of the Kyobo building if anyone's curious. It's small but really hi-tech and I had to get buzzed in. After going in I found myself in a small room with a Korean girl on the other side of the window. The conversation was as follows:

"Hi! I'm just stopping by."
"Hi, what do you need?"
"Well, first I was wondering how many Finns live in Seoul."
"I think about 30 or 40. Not too many. Are you Finnish?"
"No, but I was there for two days and Estonia for a month before. I'm studying it again. Do you help people out with that?"
"No we don't."
"I see. Where do these Finnish people in Seoul work?"
"Companies, I think." (?????)
"Ah... do you speak Finnish?"
"No."
"Have you been there before?"
"No."
"Ah. May I ask how you got the job working here then?"
"No..."
"Ah, I mean, it's kind of funny that you're working in the Finnish Consulate of all places isn't it?"
"..."
"Because there's what, about four people working here right?"
"Three."
"Ah. So, you really don't want to tell me how you got the job?"
"No I don't. Do you want some information?"
"....okay." (she goes off and gets some pamphlets)

So I got some pamphlets, maps, and the like. Mostly useless except for one book and the map itself as I like hanging maps on my wall.

Today's 'adventure' made me think about the nature of consulates once again.


That reminds me of an occasion in London. The Korean embassy had only Koreans working for it. Yet in Seoul the British embassy only had Koreans working there. I am sure there must be some Brits working in there but I didn't see any.
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Alias



Joined: 24 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've actually met two Finns in the 15 months that I have been here. One guy worked for a international company here in Seoul. Got to know him a little bit before he left. Like me he was a big hockey fan.
Met a Finnish girl on the DMZ tour of all places. I think she told me that she was starting a stint at the Consulate. That was last summer.
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rapier



Joined: 16 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FINN: I've met many people with this surname. Do you think originally it was a name given to a person who came from Finland, and stuck?

Likewise the surnames "English", "Holland", "French', "Dane", "Alban" (ie albanian), "Turk", "Welsh", "Ireland",etc.
Just wondering.... Razz

Also, in Germany, the surname "Engels" is fairly common, likewise "Anglais" in France, etc etc....
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Uh-oh...

that incident above about the Finnish embassy, I put it up on my home page, but my home page was then selected to the the feature page of the day and I've gotten 10 000 visitors so far. One of them happened to be the girl from the embassy, who wasn't to pleased about it! She writeth in return:



---
"Hi! I'm just stopping by."

"Hi, what do you need?" �� ��How can I help you?��

"Well, first I was wondering how many Finns live in Seoul."

"I think about 30 or 40. Not too many. Are you Finnish?"

"No, but I was there for two days and Estonia for a month before. I'm studying it again. Do you help people out with that?"

"No we don't." (Because there is no HAGWON that teaches Finnish in Korea. AND how many people do you think that they call us and say they want to study Finnish? You can give a suggestion to the Finnish foreign Ministry. I got two phone calls from the Koreans who showed their interest in learning the language over the last t two years.)

"I see. Where do these Finnish people in Seoul work?"

"Companies, I think." (?????) (Don��t remember this question. You asked what the Finns in Seoul do for a living. I said they are mostly businessmen and exchange students.��

"Ah... do you speak Finnish?"

"No." (sorry. I studies Japanese and English.)

"Have you been there before?"

"No." (Just graduated from university and got this job. Sorry.)

"Ah. May I ask how you got the job working here then?"

"No..." (Am I supposed to help our customers with this personal question? Were you looking for a job opening at the Finnish Embassy? I didn��t know. And you did not ask the question with "May I" )

"Ah, I mean, it's kind of funny that you're working in the Finnish Consulate of all places isn't it?""..." (Was I going through an Interview for a mag or somethin��?��

"Because there's what, about four people working here right?"

"Three."

"Ah. So, you really don't want to tell me how you got the job?"

"No I don't. Do you want some information?"(You said ��If you don��t want to tell me how you got this job, you don��t have to.)
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


If you think they are what you said above in Korean, I have to say your Korean was not all that good. I hope the next time you visit, you can come and ask more proper questions that I can help you with. So, have you visited other embassies and asked the receptionist how they got their job and how you can learn the languag? What did they say?And about the USELESS information, I will tell our cultural attaché and ask what we can do about it.

"Today's 'adventure' made me think about the nature of consulates once again."

You know it really is tiring to hear ��Embassy people are rude and they don��t do anything for their customers. They get paid for doing nothing��. This attitute is really frustrating, but what can I do? People all have their own sides of the story. Whatever. And for the record, Ms. �ڹ̳�, I am not ���ϻ�.I found the wanted ad at the Korea Herald 2 years ago and applied, went through 3 interviews and a test and got hired. I am (along with other Korean staff at the Embassy) trying to get a chance to at least visit Finland so that it can help our job in any way.

Since the Finnish Embassy is very small, we don��t have any seperate Education, Culture, Science section. Never heard that the consulates are made for those who ask questions, ��I want to meet Finns in Seoul. Where can I meet them?��

So I got some pamphlets, maps, and the like. Mostly useless except for one book and the map itself as I like hanging maps on my wall.Today's 'adventure' made me think about the nature of consulates once again.

So wow, you make me sound like a dummy who has some connections to be hired at the Embassy. Did not know you were THAT disappointed with our service. If you have more problems or complaints, can you come again and let me know in person, not putting up a message like this and making me pissed off?
-----



Now I know how she got the job though; we can stop imagining about that.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 4:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah, after a few more messages we seem to have smoothed out out differences somewhat (the girl at the Finnish consulate and I); that's good. I don't like fighting.
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J.B. Clamence



Joined: 15 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rapier wrote:
Likewise the surnames "English", "Holland", "French', "Dane", "Alban" (ie albanian), "Turk", "Welsh", "Ireland",etc.
Just wondering.... Razz


It's possible that some of these names originate as markers of national origin, although I haven't heard of some of them.

However,

Quote:
Also, in Germany, the surname "Engels" is fairly common,


"Engels" is German for "Angel's", not "English".
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Mr. Pink



Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China

PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mithridates wrote:
Ah, after a few more messages we seem to have smoothed out out differences somewhat (the girl at the Finnish consulate and I); that's good. I don't like fighting.


All I gotta say is you got:

BURNED!!!

The girl is right though. Your story does sound like you expected too much.
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Mr. Pink



Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China

PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh and I see ur cyworld has 25000 hits now.

WTF you doing posting that kind of stuff on such a popular site?
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^
Burned!
Actually it only had 12000 or so hits until yesterday when it was featured on the main page and I got an extra 12000 guests for the one day.

Nevertheless, I don't like consulates that try to turn away people with real questions with a few pamphlets. I also don't like consulates that hire people that don't know a thing about the country. I don't blame her for working there as they hired her but the fact that a Finnish consulate can't do anything more than distribute info that can be found anywhere on the net is a bit weak.
Still better than immigration though.
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J.B. Clamence



Joined: 15 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mithridates wrote:
Nevertheless, I don't like consulates that try to turn away people with real questions with a few pamphlets.


In all fairness to her, you have to admit that she was right to refuse to give you the information you wanted. An individual has no right to expect an embassy to provide them with any kind of information about its in-country citizens. If I worked at my embassy in Seoul, and some random guy came in asking nosy questions about Americans in Seoul and wanting to contact them, I'd send them packing, too. I mean, how would you feel if some dude called you up and said, " Hi! I got your number from your embassy! Wanna help me with my English?" What exactly did you want her to tell you?
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tokki



Joined: 26 Jul 2003

PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mith was WAY out of line. How the hell do you post info like that on a site as popular as yours Mith? Also, I agree with JB, what did you expect? She did the right thing blowing you off.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my defence:
Actually my site became twice as popular that day as it was the day before...
before posting the info: 12000 visitors
The next day: 25000

It's an individual home page, and I write pretty much whatever I want on it.
Also, I wasn't looking for phone numbers; I was curious what kinds of companies they worked at and how they came to Korea in the first place.
Lastly, a Canadian living in Seoul asking about Finns in Korea is much different than a Korean living in Seoul asking about Americans.
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J.B. Clamence



Joined: 15 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mithridates wrote:
a Canadian living in Seoul asking about Finns in Korea is much different than a Korean living in Seoul asking about Americans.


Why is it different? If I was in charge of an embassy, I would make it a standard policy not to give out information on resident citizens to anyone, regardless of where they were from. I think a lot of diplomatic missions employ that as a standard security policy. Why should it matter whether you're Canadian or Korean?
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's different (in my opinion) because Finland is a small country, the embassy is small, and no one was there. I suppose it would be the same if a Korean went to the Finnish embassy...my point isn't that I'm special because I'm Canadian but that an embassy with no one in it should take a bit better care of its 'customers'. She was just reading the newspaper by herself when I waslked in.
As for what Finns do in Korea I was looking for an answer like "They usually work in hi-tech / cell phone companies", something general like that, much like how most French people that live here are connected with TGV - that's not classified information.
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