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a new low for the Korea Times
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Chaz_Bangalang



Joined: 01 Feb 2004
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hahahahahaha, the Korea Times..... Is it really serious? I mean is it really supposed to be a newspaper? Toilet paper
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nautilus



Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mc_jc wrote:

What's amazing is that AFROK could totally destroy the North's military capabilities on their own without the need for USFK assistance. Yet they afraid of losing foreign investment and their financial rating in the case of a war.


I do find it astounding as well. They are hoping unification will be peaceful and that they will get to keep their economic status (and thus enter unification as the senior partner).

Part of the fear is that the north kicked their butts 60 years ago and they haven't forgotten. But its 2010 and they are now greatly overestimating the capability of the DPRK.
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BoholDiver



Joined: 03 Oct 2009
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see about 1 similarity between these 2 stories and about 1000 differences.

So in one terrorist attack, over 1000 people die and over 100 more die trying to help. Sorry if I don't know the correct numbers, but I know they were high.

In the next one that may or may not be a terrorist attack, 46 or so people die and 1 dies trying to save them. Not to disrespect Diver Han, he was a brave and selfless man, but equating his death equally to several hundred people who died in the aftermath of 9-11 is insulting.

Maybe the K newspaper just doesn't have anything else to write.
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BoholDiver



Joined: 03 Oct 2009
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh yeah. An afterthought.

If N Korea is, in fact, uninvolved in this sinking, I'd be pissed off if I were them. It's best not to jump to conclusions or accuse someone of something before having some facts.
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Smee



Joined: 24 Dec 2004
Location: Jeollanam-do

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A new low? Actually, that looks like business as usual.

And 9/11 was brought out when Namdaemun burned down. 9/11, the Cambodian Killing Fields, Auschwitz, Hiroshima, Katrina all made an appearance back then:

http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2008/02/korean-911.html
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mc_jc



Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Location: C4B- Cp Red Cloud, Area-I

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can equate the sinking of the Cheonan to whatever- the Kirsk, the Louitania, or even the Pennsylvania during the attack on Pearl Harbor- but how could this incident equate to the loss of 3000+ people.


My question is; what is Tae Han Min Guk going to do about it?

If there is not going to be a reprisal attack, then the sailors on board the Cheonan DID die in vain.
Itaewonguy said it best in another thread [paraphasing]; "Many of these young men didn't have a choice to be on that ship at that given time...they were ordered there under Korea's policy of mandatory conscription...".

If I were a Korean and I had a son on that ship and went missing, I would demand that the government do its damnest to bring my son home. Knowing that the K-gov't is just covering up the mess is a disgrace to the families who lost loved ones there-- The irony of that statement is that an office worker who works for an associate of mine, who is Korean, had a boyfriend is one of the missing from the Cheonan. She and his family have been asking for my associate's help in getting more information on the fate of her boyfriend- it hurts him alot to refuse to help her because he is not in that capacity to assist.

Instead of getting to the bottom of the situation, the Korean government is trying to bury it as long as possible in the hopes that it will die down, like it had done before to avert a confrontation with North Korea.
I think the thanks for all this should go to Noh Mu Hyun and his policy of total appeasement to North Korea during his 5-year tenure- he was by far one of the worst excuse for a Korean president I have ever seen- thank god I made an excuse not to meet him while he was still president.
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nautilus



Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mc_jc wrote:

My question is; what is Tae Han Min Guk going to do about it?


What do you suggest? All-out war?

SK is not the same as the US. If someone merely irritates America, they can simply bomb them to smithereens within days without suffering so much as a single casualty. Americans are used to being able to punish their overseas enemies with impunity.

However its quite a different scenario here. NK is only a few km away. Seoul would be buried under a hail of artillery within hours.
Kinda makes sense for the ROK to avoid war as long as they possibly can.
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Moldy Rutabaga



Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
9/11 was brought out when Namdaemun burned down. 9/11, the Cambodian Killing Fields, Auschwitz, Hiroshima, Katrina all made an appearance back then

Good point, I think. It reminds me of how every scandal in the last twenty years has become [something]-gate: Plame-gate, Tiger-gate, Camilla-gate, Clinton-gate, imitating Watergate and cheapening the original event. I can expect that in a generation something will be the 9/11 of monster truck racing or a similar usage. I think we will have to get used to it. I don't think the soldiers who died in 1815 would appreciate Waterloo being the name of an ABBA dance song, but that's what happens.
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On the other hand



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think the thanks for all this should go to Noh Mu Hyun and his policy of total appeasement to North Korea during his 5-year tenure


Funny though, how all this appeasement was supposed to end when the supposedly hardnosed LMB swept into power.

Of course, I've always thought that the differences in policy between 우리당 and 한나라당 would prove to be more rhetorical than anything else. Roh talked tough against the Americans, and sent warm fuzzies to North Korea, but never got around to making changes to the SOFA, much less asking the Yankee imperialists to leave. And Megabyte was supposed to be all about getting tough with the North, but as far as I can tell, it's still more or less business as usual on the Sunshine front.

At the end of the day, pragmatic geopolitics win out against ideological bluster. NK is still a military wild card, hence the USFK. But it's also a place vulnerable to regime collapse, and where China is making some significant inroads, with South Korea not wanting to be left out of any future developments. Hence, Sunshine.
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mc_jc



Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Location: C4B- Cp Red Cloud, Area-I

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
What do you suggest? All-out war?


Simply, word for word. When North Korea threatens to attack, the south should respond in kind. I believe this will throw them off-guard.
Back during the days of the military junta (I was here for the last 2 years of it), whenever North Korea threatened to attack the south in any way, the south would respond with harsh rhetoric of its own, shutting them up instantly.
The 1.2 million-man army of the KPLA is malnourished, undertrained and underequipped. The only thing they have on their side is numbers. The in-mountain artillery batteries could easily be neutralized by bunker-buster bombs.
The only thing the north has is the threat to destroy the south, but they can't even get their air force off the ground but 3 times a year because of fuel.
Had Korea spent some of its wealth on bomb shelters and cavern networks to evacuate its citizens from Seoul in case of war, they wouldn't be so vulnerable to North Korea's threats.
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On the other hand



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Back during the days of the military junta (I was here for the last 2 years of it), whenever North Korea threatened to attack the south in any way, the south would respond with harsh rhetoric of its own, shutting them up instantly.


So, you were here in 1986? Or are you counting the Roh Tae Woo government as a military junta?
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Reggie



Joined: 21 Sep 2009

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the way that so many fellow Americans act like 9/11 was the Biggest Day in the History of the Universe, it's kind of hard to fault the Koreans for also blowing a big sad tragedy out of proportion.
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BoholDiver



Joined: 03 Oct 2009
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It wasn't far off.

I wish the government here would grow a spine.

On the other hand wrote:
Quote:
Back during the days of the military junta (I was here for the last 2 years of it), whenever North Korea threatened to attack the south in any way, the south would respond with harsh rhetoric of its own, shutting them up instantly.


So, you were here in 1986? Or are you counting the Roh Tae Woo government as a military junta?
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mc_jc



Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Location: C4B- Cp Red Cloud, Area-I

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was counting Roh Tae Woo, since he was the transitional president between the junta and the free elections held in '92.

Quote:
With the way that so many fellow Americans act like 9/11 was the Biggest Day in the History of the Universe, it's kind of hard to fault the Koreans for also blowing a big sad tragedy out of proportion.


Obviously you're not from the US or the UK, are you?
I wonder what would happen if a terror attack happened in Canada or Australia?
The situation is ripe in both places for it to happen.
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Konglishman



Joined: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Nanjing

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the other hand wrote:
Quote:
I think the thanks for all this should go to Noh Mu Hyun and his policy of total appeasement to North Korea during his 5-year tenure


Funny though, how all this appeasement was supposed to end when the supposedly hardnosed LMB swept into power.

Of course, I've always thought that the differences in policy between 우리당 and 한나라당 would prove to be more rhetorical than anything else. Roh talked tough against the Americans, and sent warm fuzzies to North Korea, but never got around to making changes to the SOFA, much less asking the Yankee imperialists to leave. And Megabyte was supposed to be all about getting tough with the North, but as far as I can tell, it's still more or less business as usual on the Sunshine front.

At the end of the day, pragmatic geopolitics win out against ideological bluster. NK is still a military wild card, hence the USFK. But it's also a place vulnerable to regime collapse, and where China is making some significant inroads, with South Korea not wanting to be left out of any future developments. Hence, Sunshine.


I assume that you meant to type 2Megabyte.


Anyways, I do agree with the other posters that comparing this tragedy to 9/11 is completely absurd.


However, I do think that the comparison of the Namdaemoon Gate burning to 9/11, had a limited amount of validity. Certainly, no life was lost in the Namdaemoon burning. However, an important symbol was irreparably damaged which I suppose was somewhat comparable to the US losing the World Trade Center in 9/11. But of course, in terms of human tragedy, there was absolutely no comparison.
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