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Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:02 am Post subject: |
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soon enough china will equally the quality and best the price..
then the chinese brand will start to advertise, sponsor teams etc and then it's buy buy.. still comes down to patents really.. |
Too true.
I'd buy neither an Apple nor a Samsung.
I'd buy some Chinese knock off for 1/4 the price that will last 1/2 as long. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:14 am Post subject: |
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It's not just the copying the writer is warning about. It's that there's no room in the Korean marketplace for small and mid-size companies. This makes it harder to grow the economy-newer companies make more new hires--and puts all of Korea's eggs into one basket--Samsung's. That's a very risky proposition.
Samsung is as much a commodities producer than an electronics manufacturer. Memory chip prices swing greatly with demand.
As for Hyundai, they are still a bit behind the other auto manufacturers and sell mostly on price and perceived value. I drive a Hyundai but would take a Honda or a Nissan over it in a heartbeat if I were living in the U.S.
You may start seeing Korean companies buy more foreign concerns. STX, whoever that actually is, bought a foreign shipbuilder to get in on the cruise ship business. They bought the shipyards which produced the world's largest cruise ship.
Also, the FTA with Europe should force Korean companies to be more competitive. For one, pharmaceuticals are going to come under pressure from European drug manufacturers. |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:34 am Post subject: |
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| maladict23 wrote: |
| Triban wrote: |
| It is people like this who should be running the country and chaebol if Korea wants to succeed as a wealthy nation. He voiced what I have thought (and been chastised by Korean for saying) for years. Lack of experimentation and originality, blatant copyright infringement, etc. leads to stagnation and ineptitude. |
Bollocks. Japan copied everything they made for years off the UK and the USA. Triumph motorcycles died a death after Japan 'borrowed the idea'. It's the first rung on the ladder before moving on to an original market of your own. |
And look at Sony now. A shell of its former self . |
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komerican

Joined: 17 Dec 2006
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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"Necessity is the mother of invention and copying"
Plato Komerican, 2011 (Seoul)
| radcon wrote: |
| maladict23 wrote: |
| Triban wrote: |
| It is people like this who should be running the country and chaebol if Korea wants to succeed as a wealthy nation. He voiced what I have thought (and been chastised by Korean for saying) for years. Lack of experimentation and originality, blatant copyright infringement, etc. leads to stagnation and ineptitude. |
Bollocks. Japan copied everything they made for years off the UK and the USA. Triumph motorcycles died a death after Japan 'borrowed the idea'. It's the first rung on the ladder before moving on to an original market of your own. |
And look at Sony now. A shell of its former self . |
Look at Zenith Electronics, now owned by LG Electronics (wikipedia)
| Quote: |
The company was co-founded by Ralph Matthews and Karl Hassel[1] in Chicago, Illinois ...in 1923. Zenith introduced the first ...in 1924,the first mass-produced ...in 1926,[2] and ... in 1927. It added ...in the 1930s. The company would eventually go on to invent such things ...........Zenith was also one of the first companies to introduce.....HDTV...
In the 1980s, Zenith encountered increasing financial difficulty as their market share progressively went to Japanese companies who had lower overhead, and could sell their sets cheaper.
By 1990, Zenith was in trouble and looking more attractive to a hostile takeover. ... With their analog line aging ...Zenith's prospects were dim. Eventually, LG would raise its stake in Zenith to 55%, enough to assume a controlling interest. Zenith filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 1999, and in exchange for its debts, LG offered to buy the part of Zenith it didn't already own. |
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Modernist
Joined: 23 Mar 2011 Location: The 90s
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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It seems to me that Korean companies compete to a great extent on style. For Samsung, their technology is not quite as cutting-edge as Sony or Panasonic, but if you are looking at flat-screens, Samsung's are always leading the pack in terms of looks. They have been the ones slimming down monitor thickness and brightening the displays [now they are even getting close to eliminating the screen frame]. They seem excellent at evolving existing tech.
But rarely do they INVENT something totally new. They didn't start Blu-Ray, or LED screen tech, or haptic controls. Their R&D is focused on enhancing, not radical innovation like Apple often manages.
As for Hyundai, I would argue they have the most stylish line of any Asian carmaker. A Sonata is 10x more interesting and sleek than an Altima, let alone a Camry. The Japanese carmakers have gotten meek and risk-adverse in their body design. They are coasting on their reputations.
| Quote: |
| and sell mostly on price and perceived value. |
That's Toyota, not Hyundai. People buying Camrys and Siennas are thinking about the supposed durability and resale value, not the looks or performance. |
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fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 1:31 am Post subject: |
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This can be expanded into other realms of academics and science. For example, the ROK defense industry and the military are boasting how great their new K-9 SP artillery is or how great the K-21 and K-2 tank are going to be. While these are probably going to be great weapon systems on paper (since they'll most likely never be tested in combat), Korean develops on military science are just advances on already existing concepts and platforms. They're starting to make tanks and IFVs that are a bit better than the ones already operated by other countries. The korean propanda machine is already going on about how freaking awesome the Korean military is now. According to Korean military "experts" the K-9 is already the best SP artillery in the world, despite failing the only real test it has had in combat.
But the US defense industry and American military thinkers don't just stop at enhancing already existing weapons, they invent completely new concepts and ways of fighting. Almost every paper I've read on ROK military doctrine either explains concepts in American doctrine or explores ways to implement American doctrine into Korean operational thinking. Concepts like EBO and Design are American concepts and mentioned heavily in Korean doctine. The Koreans are boasting their new rifle that can fire airburst grenades? The US AF is developing guns that fire microwaves to heat up the moisture in people's skin! This is the difference between American military thinkers and Korean military thinkers (and the two cultures in general). In the realm of innovation and creativity, Korea is a step behind. |
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NohopeSeriously
Joined: 17 Jan 2011 Location: The Christian Right-Wing Educational Republic of Korea
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:10 am Post subject: |
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| I'm surprised that nobody mentioned about Samsung's involvement in the domestic auto industry with a help from Renault. A good chunk of profits made by Samsung is from selling cars around the Seoul Metropolitan Area. |
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isisaredead
Joined: 18 May 2010
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:59 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Quote: |
soon enough china will equally the quality and best the price..
then the chinese brand will start to advertise, sponsor teams etc and then it's buy buy.. still comes down to patents really.. |
Too true.
I'd buy neither an Apple nor a Samsung.
I'd buy some Chinese knock off for 1/4 the price that will last 1/2 as long. |
that's what i did when i bought my tablet.
a ten inch android monster for a fraction of the cost of an apple or samsung tablet. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:22 am Post subject: |
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| NohopeSeriously wrote: |
| I'm surprised that nobody mentioned about Samsung's involvement in the domestic auto industry with a help from Renault. A good chunk of profits made by Samsung is from selling cars around the Seoul Metropolitan Area. |
Samsung Motors went belly up and was bought by Renault/Nissan. They kept the name, but that's it.
The cars were always Nissans. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:34 am Post subject: |
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| Modernist wrote: |
As for Hyundai, I would argue they have the most stylish line of any Asian carmaker. A Sonata is 10x more interesting and sleek than an Altima, let alone a Camry. The Japanese carmakers have gotten meek and risk-adverse in their body design. They are coasting on their reputations.
| Quote: |
| and sell mostly on price and perceived value. |
That's Toyota, not Hyundai. People buying Camrys and Siennas are thinking about the supposed durability and resale value, not the looks or performance. |
Hyundai is the cheapest and that's why they sell. People think they are a good deal.
Disagree on the Altima. Toyota and Honda have never been much on style so your comments are off-base there IMO.
Hyundais are designed in Europe and the U.S., depending on the model. |
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Konglishman

Joined: 14 Sep 2007 Location: Nanjing
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Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 11:02 am Post subject: |
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Welcome back.
| komerican wrote: |
"Necessity is the mother of invention and copying"
Plato Komerican, 2011 (Seoul)
| radcon wrote: |
| maladict23 wrote: |
| Triban wrote: |
| It is people like this who should be running the country and chaebol if Korea wants to succeed as a wealthy nation. He voiced what I have thought (and been chastised by Korean for saying) for years. Lack of experimentation and originality, blatant copyright infringement, etc. leads to stagnation and ineptitude. |
Bollocks. Japan copied everything they made for years off the UK and the USA. Triumph motorcycles died a death after Japan 'borrowed the idea'. It's the first rung on the ladder before moving on to an original market of your own. |
And look at Sony now. A shell of its former self . |
Look at Zenith Electronics, now owned by LG Electronics (wikipedia)
| Quote: |
The company was co-founded by Ralph Matthews and Karl Hassel[1] in Chicago, Illinois ...in 1923. Zenith introduced the first ...in 1924,the first mass-produced ...in 1926,[2] and ... in 1927. It added ...in the 1930s. The company would eventually go on to invent such things ...........Zenith was also one of the first companies to introduce.....HDTV...
In the 1980s, Zenith encountered increasing financial difficulty as their market share progressively went to Japanese companies who had lower overhead, and could sell their sets cheaper.
By 1990, Zenith was in trouble and looking more attractive to a hostile takeover. ... With their analog line aging ...Zenith's prospects were dim. Eventually, LG would raise its stake in Zenith to 55%, enough to assume a controlling interest. Zenith filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 1999, and in exchange for its debts, LG offered to buy the part of Zenith it didn't already own. |
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Eedoryeong
Joined: 10 Dec 2007 Location: Jeju
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Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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| This is a problem generally characteristic throughout East Asia - China, Korea, Japan - isn't it? They've always been guilty of it in spades. |
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carleverson
Joined: 04 Dec 2009
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Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Eedoryeong wrote: |
| This is a problem generally characteristic throughout East Asia - China, Korea, Japan - isn't it? They've always been guilty of it in spades. |
You think the US and Europe is immune to copying?
America copied movie making technology from the Europeans. Also alot of other intellectual / ideological stuff was taken straight from Europe. Europe copied from other places too... |
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Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
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Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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| carleverson wrote: |
| Eedoryeong wrote: |
| This is a problem generally characteristic throughout East Asia - China, Korea, Japan - isn't it? They've always been guilty of it in spades. |
You think the US and Europe is immune to copying?
America copied movie making technology from the Europeans. Also alot of other intellectual / ideological stuff was taken straight from Europe. Europe copied from other places too... |
Like gunpowder, printing, algebra, medicine, etc.
Whose numerals are we using? Oh that's right...ARABIC numerals.
The fact that people graduate from college and don't know these kinds of things is embarrassing. |
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Chokse
Joined: 22 May 2009
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Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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Actually, the numbers we use originated in India during the Gupta era, as did the decimal system. They are no longer called "Arabic Numerals." Instead, they are called either "Hindu Numerals", or "Hindu-Arabic Numerals."
Arab traders involved in the Indian Ocean trade network learned of the numbers while trading in India and brought the knowledge of them back to the Near East and Europe, which is how they got the misnomer "Arabic Numerals."
I don't think you should chastise someone about making a blunder when you have made an equally embarrassing blunder! |
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