| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
minos
Joined: 01 Dec 2010
Location: kOREA
|
 Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 6:38 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| itiswhatitis wrote: |
| Outside of Seoul most non-Koreans are either US military or English teachers. I was actually referring specifically to Seoul. For the record (government statistics don't lie) there are a lot of diplomats (Seoul must literally have at least 100 different embassies such as America, Japan, Nigeria ETC...) and there are a lot of Engineers and a lot of MBA's who are non-Korean in Seoul. Trust me, Koreans respect an American MBA/dipmolat/engineer a million times more than a public school English teacher. If you plan to come to Korea to teach English and you want so much as an ounce of respect then you ought to definitely work at a hagwon. |
Your correct.... but most of those foreigners are chinese, Indian, russian, or from other asian countries. I know plenty and koreans routinely give them crap unfairly despite their MBAs or even PHD. Apparently my chinese intern friends are a crimewave waiting to happen.
As far as they're concerned, non-western foreigner in korea = 3D worker.
As for American ones....they're pretty rare and usually older(30-40+ yr. old).
Koreans don't really see a huge respect difference between hagwon and public school teacher.....I'm not sure what your point is. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
brickabrack
Joined: 17 May 2010
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
| minos wrote: |
| itiswhatitis wrote: |
| Outside of Seoul most non-Koreans are either US military or English teachers. I was actually referring specifically to Seoul. For the record (government statistics don't lie) there are a lot of diplomats (Seoul must literally have at least 100 different embassies such as America, Japan, Nigeria ETC...) and there are a lot of Engineers and a lot of MBA's who are non-Korean in Seoul. Trust me, Koreans respect an American MBA/dipmolat/engineer a million times more than a public school English teacher. If you plan to come to Korea to teach English and you want so much as an ounce of respect then you ought to definitely work at a hagwon. |
Your correct.... but most of those foreigners are chinese, Indian, russian, or from other asian countries. I know plenty and koreans routinely give them crap unfairly despite their MBAs or even PHD. Apparently my chinese intern friends are a crimewave waiting to happen.
As far as they're concerned, non-western foreigner in korea = 3D worker.
As for American ones....they're pretty rare and usually older(30-40+ yr. old).
Koreans don't really see a huge respect difference between hagwon and public school teacher.....I'm not sure what your point is. |
Govt stats always lie.
But, YOU'RE correct. MBAs and PhDs are more respected than a teacher gig. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lalartu
Joined: 29 Apr 2008
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I work in a public high school and I get plenty of respect and discipline in my class.
I don't know where this is coming from. I'm just guessing that the guy is not good at teaching young kids (elementary), which would be a lot more difficult in any other country anyway.
The best thing that ever happened to me in a hagwon was lots of presents for the teacher's day back in 2007, but I've heard even that is illegal now and nobody is allowed to give you anything. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
NohopeSeriously
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Location: The Christian Right-Wing Educational Republic of Korea
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The truth is, private tutoring has always been better than hagweon or PS.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itiswhatitis
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| lalartu wrote: |
I work in a public high school and I get plenty of respect and discipline in my class.
Is your high school in Seoul? Foreign teachers in Seoul get the least amount of respect (at public schools at least)
"I don't know where this is coming from. I'm just guessing that the guy is not good at teaching young kids (elementary), which would be a lot more difficult in any other country anyway"
With respect, to say "in any other country anyway" is an extremely broad generalization!!! How many countries have you taugh in? The Korean students of today were not around for food shortages/wars and are not any more humble/ready to learn than an American/Canadian etc student.
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itiswhatitis
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| lalartu wrote: |
which would be a lot more difficult in any other country anyway.
|
With respect, how many countries have you taught in? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itiswhatitis
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:45 pm Post subject: Re: Hagwons jobs are better than public school jobs |
|
|
| sojusucks wrote: |
| itiswhatitis wrote: |
You will enjoy a hagwon much more than a public school.
From my experience, at a hagwon you are considered to be an actual teacher whearas at a public school you are considered more of a clown/white monkey. At the hagwons the Korean children are extremely respectful and they bow to you as they come in and as they leave. |
Reading your article was interesting. I am glad that you found a nice place to work, which is not that easy in this country. Once you do find a good work environment, stay there. But generalizing that all hogwans or that all public schools are better is not appropriate unless you have a large sample size to draw upon. I have talked to hundreds of teachers in Korea, which is why I know that your experience is an exception rather than the rule. |
Thanks for the fair and balanced reply. I respectfully disagree with you about me being an exception, the reality is that hagwons are better than public schools. While I can't claim to have spoken with "hundreds" of teachers, I would estimate that I have spoken to about ONE hundred and that 95 out of 100 much prefer hagwons to public schools. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itiswhatitis
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:48 pm Post subject: Re: Hagwons jobs are better than public school jobs |
|
|
| runthegauntlet wrote: |
| itiswhatitis wrote: |
You will enjoy a hagwon much more than a public school.
From my experience, at a hagwon you are considered to be an actual teacher whearas at a public school you are considered more of a clown/white monkey. At the hagwons the Korean children are extremely respectful and they bow to you as they come in and as they leave.
I've done both and I can tell you that I never have discipline problems at the hagwon. At the public school the control of the classroom all depends on the Korean teacher (average elementary class size in a public school is between 35-40 UNLESS you're at a rural school in the middle of nowhere). With such large classes discipline is often a problem at public schools.
Time for a reality check:
How many Korean teachers do you think actually want a foreign teacher in their classroom? I mean really, stop and think about it. A very small minority of them do, and the minority of them that do want you only want you so that they can use you to practice/improve their own English. They may beg you to meet with them on your own time to study English and they will not pay you for it (maybe in Kimchi). If you refuse to meet with them then they have the power to make you life miserable. DON'T THINK THAT THIS IS UNCOMMON AND THAT IT WON'T HAPPEN TO YOU.
Speaking of which.....
My co-teacher at the public school (I now work in a hagwon) used to complain that now that she has a foreign teacher that she has no choice but to know the correct answers to questions from her students about English. I was shocked that she admitted this to me and I considered complaining about it but I didn't after I realized how vulnerable I was (she could have made my life miserable or even got me fired). This kind of BS would never be tolerated in a hagwon. You think this is uncommon? THINK AGAIN!!!
Kids in Korea have little respect for foreign teachers in a public school setting. They view you as being a clown. Kids in Korea know the difference between a white person/foreigner who is a diplomat, MBA or Engineer and one who is a dime a dozen English teacher. The reason you get more respect in a hagwon is because in a hagwon you are viewed as a teacher but in a public school you are viewed as a spoiled clown who does no real work (even though this is not the case-you will work much harder and longer hours at a public school).
My experience is that public school teachers get the least amount of respect in Seoul (as compared to other parts of Korea). This is probably because many of the white people/foreigners in Seoul are in fact diplomats, MBA's and engineers (trust me...a 10 year old Korean knows the difference and it will become very clear to you).
My advice: keep away from public schools in Korea at all costs (especially those in Seoul). Korea is a great place to live so long as you don't work in a public school |
How many more times are you going to regurgitate this asinine drivel?
Are you a troll or a recruiter?
Bored or your business is just going down the tube? |
I am an English teacher in Korea who is trying to provide a reality check. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itiswhatitis
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Modernist wrote: |
My goodness, this troll must be enjoying himself saying the SAME THING OVER AND OVER now, what, 2 dozen times? Hijacking other people's threads wasn't enough fun, now you've gone and made your own, a quick little cut-and-paste of your drivel, I mean argument, and off we go!
I personally don't know what else would motivate someone to join a forum and then go fruit loops like this EXCEPT good old economics. I'm leaning towards the idea he or she is in fact either a recruiter or perhaps has been hired by recruiter[s] to plant pro-hagwon messages all over the forum, 'cause that's all that's being done here. I hope the checks aren't too big, since the 'product' is pretty worthless. |
I am an English teacher who is trying to give a reality check. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itiswhatitis
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Modernist wrote: |
My goodness, this troll must be enjoying himself saying the SAME THING OVER AND OVER now, what, 2 dozen times? Hijacking other people's threads wasn't enough fun, now you've gone and made your own, a quick little cut-and-paste of your drivel, I mean argument, and off we go!
I personally don't know what else would motivate someone to join a forum and then go fruit loops like this EXCEPT good old economics. I'm leaning towards the idea he or she is in fact either a recruiter or perhaps has been hired by recruiter[s] to plant pro-hagwon messages all over the forum, 'cause that's all that's being done here. I hope the checks aren't too big, since the 'product' is pretty worthless. |
I'm starting to think the same. A quick check of his posting history (all 2 pages of it) shows that 2/3rds of his posts (literally) are all about how hakwons are better. |
I am an English teacher in Korea who is trying to provide a reality check. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Modernist
Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: The 90s
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
Even your responses are cut-and-paste!
If you ARE a recruiter you're spectacularly inept at it. If you're being paid by a recruiter there's got to be a bottle of something out there that would be a more entertaining and less harmful use for the same money.
If you're something else, well, I find myself at a loss as to what your point in continuing to push this could be. What is your response to emmajuno's post in this thread about her horrible hagwon and the demands it makes on her? What about the hundreds cases of hagwon abuse that the most casual search of this forum would find? There must be a dozen cases mentioned on the first page right now--the guy who agreed to work for his boss without being paid where the hagwon is going under and now's he screwed, maybe?
And of course the laughable assumptions about how hagwon students behave compared to PS students, which anyone who has taught her for more than 3 days knows are thoroughly ludicrous.
Any perspective teacher coming here is free to read your cut-and-paste 'argument' and compare it to the experiences of hundreds or thousands of others before making a decision. FTR, I fully agree that good hagwons can be excellent employers, provided you can find them. It's your blanket denigration of PS to which I and others here object. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:40 am Post subject: Re: Hagwons jobs are better than public school jobs |
|
|
| itiswhatitis wrote: |
| [. While I can't claim to have spoken with "hundreds" of teachers, I would estimate that I have spoken to about ONE hundred and that 95 out of 100 much prefer hagwons to public schools. |
Well after 11 years here I can make that claim. And I would estimate that nearly all (95%+) greatly prefer public schools to hakwons (those who have taught in both.)
A scroll through the first few pages of the job discussion forum shows at least a dozen cases where hakwons turned bad. And a quick scroll of the history reveals literally HUNDREDS. Just check the blacklists. On the other hand very very few public schools make the blacklists or worst employers simply because they usually pay out everything they promised in the contract.
The main complaints about public schools are the excessive downtime and forced deskwarming...some have nasty co-teachers as well.
But at all the orientations where I've spoken with dozens of teachers...the overwhelming consenses was that public schools were better.
Yes good hakwons are excellent employers. But for every good one there's 10-20 bad ones. For example just look at the contract sticky thread and do a quick check of those who provide pension vs those who don't. You'll see the same ratio as above. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
runthegauntlet
Joined: 02 Dec 2007
Location: the southlands.
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: Hagwons jobs are better than public school jobs |
|
|
| itiswhatitis wrote: |
I am an English teacher in Korea who is trying to provide a reality check. |
No, you're a troll with an agenda that no one is falling for.
But that's already been pointed out multiples times, yeah?
Yeah. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
picasso77
Joined: 06 Jun 2011
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:31 pm Post subject: get a life |
|
|
| I have worked at a public school for 3 years in korea, and i can tell you they are alot better than a hagwon. i worked at two and i can tell you yes your right about the respect you get at the hagwons, than public school, but at the public schools are more consistant with your pay pensions, and medical, working at a public school as a teacher you are taking care of. But working at a hagwon, your respected to do more work, and the hangwon are sticklers, with time. The kids are much more intelligent with english and you have to deal with but kissing american co-teachers that kiss the other korean co-teachers buts and the directors, so buddy i think you have it the other way around good luck with the future you have in a hagwon. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:36 pm Post subject: Re: get a life |
|
|
| picasso77 wrote: |
| I have worked at a public school for 3 years in korea, and i can tell you they are alot better than a hagwon. i worked at two and i can tell you yes your right about the respect you get at the hagwons, than public school, . |
He's not even right about that. It varies depending on the school and the teacher. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
