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sportsfan
Joined: 26 Feb 2012
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 Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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| pkang0202 wrote: |
| sportsfan wrote: |
So you're saying only a Korean business can afford rent there? Not likely. |
Sigh..... Let me break it down for you.
Foreigners can not get business loans. So, unless you are sitting on at least $500,000 to open a bar in Gangnam, or have partners willing to fork over that money, your bar is not going to get off the ground.
Next, foreigners don't go out to Gangnam. Your customers will have to foreigners that live near there, or Koreans. Without customers, your business can't make money.
Rent in Gangnam is no joke. You will not be able to cover your overhead and your expenses charging 2500won for a Cass. You will have to price your drinks high, which will drive away the foreigners.
Lastly, Gangnam does not appeal to foreigners. Its expensive. Its damn near impossible to get a taxi. And once again, its expensive.
Also, the main Gangnam strip is notorious for shops catering to "Westerners" coming and going. I remember last year there was a place called Georgia Wings that only lasted a few months. |
Thank you for your arrogant response. Seems you have it all figured out. My disgreement was with your assumption about rent. Funny how "rent. nuff said." suddenly had many other components.
and if you think foreigners get chased out of places that don't sell cheap booze, you must be hanging with them cause most the ones I know are happy to spend a little more to have a better quality drink. And of course they would try to attract Koreans too. Seems to me there'd be quite a few of them in ganagnam that have studied or spent time abroad and might like a western style pub in the area.
oh, and $500,000 to get the business off the ground? I know for a fact you are not even remotely right. |
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fosterman
Joined: 16 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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it's not the rents in kangam. it's the premiums!
you want a place in back street Kangnam St you are looking at 200 million and up and that is probably basement, or 4 or 5th floor on some dodgy building. and that's lucky. then you have the key money lets say cheapest
again 100 million, so now you are at 300 million, but you are not in kangan st really, you are off the beaten track but hey.. then you need the interior, again very cheap 50 million? then booze, food, running cost 50 million?
ok, so you have now opened a cheap bar in Kangnam for 400 million won.
now your rents, staff and over heads well don't worry about that, that's business. what you need to worry about now, is after 2 years when your lease expires, does the owner of the building re new with you? or does he just kick you out and you lose your 100 million premium which he doesn't even give you a chance of selling your business to get back?
why don't foreigners go into kangnam but rather HBC or Itaewon? because Kangam is not very foreigner friendly in that regards.
most Itaewon foreign bars have multiple partners
3 alley, wolfhound, rmt, sam ryans, owned by waygookins.
so for some foreigners to move into kangnam will need to drop some major coin and take a huge risk. |
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sportsfan
Joined: 26 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:17 pm Post subject: |
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| fosterman wrote: |
it's not the rents in kangam. it's the premiums!
you want a place in back street Kangnam St you are looking at 200 million and up and that is probably basement, or 4 or 5th floor on some dodgy building. and that's lucky. then you have the key money lets say cheapest
again 100 million, so now you are at 300 million, but you are not in kangan st really, you are off the beaten track but hey.. then you need the interior, again very cheap 50 million? then booze, food, running cost 50 million?
ok, so you have now opened a cheap bar in Kangnam for 400 million won.
now your rents, staff and over heads well don't worry about that, that's business. what you need to worry about now, is after 2 years when your lease expires, does the owner of the building re new with you? or does he just kick you out and you lose your 100 million premium which he doesn't even give you a chance of selling your business to get back?
why don't foreigners go into kangnam but rather HBC or Itaewon? because Kangam is not very foreigner friendly in that regards.
most Itaewon foreign bars have multiple partners
3 alley, wolfhound, rmt, sam ryans, owned by waygookins.
so for some foreigners to move into kangnam will need to drop some major coin and take a huge risk. |
Now those are some valid points!
the premium would be murder. Unless you lucked out and found an unoccupied place, therefore no premium. That's what the guys at RMT were able to do. I met with a realtor and looked around in gangnam myself for kicks and 200 million premium is too high. I say a few places right around the nighclubing area starting at 100. actually only saw one the was 200 and it was in prime location and about 120 pyung.
I agree you'd have to have multiple partners. I actually never meant to imply someone would do it alone or that it would be exclusively foreign owned. Just a foreign style pub. I think most if not all have some korean partner to some extent.
Either way, it would be nice to see one there and add another location to go besides itaewon and hongdae with some western catering |
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sojukettle
Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Location: Not there, HERE!
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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Whiskey Weasel Bar opening 23rd March.
.....Whiskey Hello everyone and welcome to the WHISKEY WEASEL GANGNAM PUB! This is a very exciting time as we have begun construction,and are aiming to open the pub to you in MID MARCH. We are located steps from NB Club on the 5th floor in the heart of the nightlife district of Gangnam. .......
https://www.facebook.com/whiskeyweaselgangnam?ref=ts#!/whiskeyweaselgangnam?sk=info
Hopefully this will last.
Cheers
sk. |
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sportsfan
Joined: 26 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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| sojukettle wrote: |
Whiskey Weasel Bar opening 23rd March.
.....Whiskey Hello everyone and welcome to the WHISKEY WEASEL GANGNAM PUB! This is a very exciting time as we have begun construction,and are aiming to open the pub to you in MID MARCH. We are located steps from NB Club on the 5th floor in the heart of the nightlife district of Gangnam. .......
https://www.facebook.com/whiskeyweaselgangnam?ref=ts#!/whiskeyweaselgangnam?sk=info
Hopefully this will last.
Cheers
sk. |
guess that'll solve the debate...depending on how it does. Thanks sojukettle! |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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| sportsfan wrote: |
| pkang0202 wrote: |
| sportsfan wrote: |
So you're saying only a Korean business can afford rent there? Not likely. |
Sigh..... Let me break it down for you.
Foreigners can not get business loans. So, unless you are sitting on at least $500,000 to open a bar in Gangnam, or have partners willing to fork over that money, your bar is not going to get off the ground.
Next, foreigners don't go out to Gangnam. Your customers will have to foreigners that live near there, or Koreans. Without customers, your business can't make money.
Rent in Gangnam is no joke. You will not be able to cover your overhead and your expenses charging 2500won for a Cass. You will have to price your drinks high, which will drive away the foreigners.
Lastly, Gangnam does not appeal to foreigners. Its expensive. Its damn near impossible to get a taxi. And once again, its expensive.
Also, the main Gangnam strip is notorious for shops catering to "Westerners" coming and going. I remember last year there was a place called Georgia Wings that only lasted a few months. |
Thank you for your arrogant response. Seems you have it all figured out. My disgreement was with your assumption about rent. Funny how "rent. nuff said." suddenly had many other components.
and if you think foreigners get chased out of places that don't sell cheap booze, you must be hanging with them cause most the ones I know are happy to spend a little more to have a better quality drink. And of course they would try to attract Koreans too. Seems to me there'd be quite a few of them in ganagnam that have studied or spent time abroad and might like a western style pub in the area.
oh, and $500,000 to get the business off the ground? I know for a fact you are not even remotely right. |
All of the reason I listed in my previous post go back to 1 single factor: RENT.
Last edited by pkang0202 on Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:23 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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fosterman
Joined: 16 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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| sportsfan wrote: |
I met with a realtor and looked around in gangnam myself for kicks and 200 million premium is too high. I say a few places right around the nighclubing area starting at 100. actually only saw one the was 200 and it was in prime location and about 120 pyung.
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so you saying places can be had for 100 million no problem?
what were the rents and key money for the places you saw? |
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sportsfan
Joined: 26 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| fosterman wrote: |
| sportsfan wrote: |
I met with a realtor and looked around in gangnam myself for kicks and 200 million premium is too high. I say a few places right around the nighclubing area starting at 100. actually only saw one the was 200 and it was in prime location and about 120 pyung.
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so you saying places can be had for 100 million no problem?
what were the rents and key money for the places you saw? |
those varied depending on the other. higher key money had lower rent, as typical as getting an apartment. saw rent as low as 2mill and as high as 8mill. |
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fosterman
Joined: 16 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 12:48 am Post subject: |
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| sportsfan wrote: |
| fosterman wrote: |
| sportsfan wrote: |
I met with a realtor and looked around in gangnam myself for kicks and 200 million premium is too high. I say a few places right around the nighclubing area starting at 100. actually only saw one the was 200 and it was in prime location and about 120 pyung.
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so you saying places can be had for 100 million no problem?
what were the rents and key money for the places you saw? |
those varied depending on the other. higher key money had lower rent, as typical as getting an apartment. saw rent as low as 2mill and as high as 8mill. |
right...yeah I have looked also.
key money is over 100 and so is premium.
for a small bar it costs like 300-400 million, its insane!!
sure you get it back, they say.. but who has 300 million to drop down. |
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everything-is-everything
Joined: 06 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:14 am Post subject: |
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| pkang0202 wrote: |
Next, foreigners don't go out to Gangnam.
Lastly, Gangnam does not appeal to foreigners.
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What the hell are you talking about? Plenty of foreigners hang out in Kangnam?
And I'm not just talking gyopos.
You're talking out of yer azz there buddy. |
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manofwar
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:24 am Post subject: Weasel |
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Whiskey W is a really nice place in Ilsan, so if the Gangnam WW is anything like the one in Ilsan ; people in the area will love it.
They rerun NFL, NHL, UFC, Rug, and whatever sports program that people want. Prices are good with a lot of different choices. A place where you can meet a lot of good decent expats. |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| everything-is-everything wrote: |
What the hell are you talking about? Plenty of foreigners hang out in Kangnam?
And I'm not just talking gyopos.
You're talking out of yer azz there buddy. |
Foreigners that hang out in Gangnam are usually live in or around Gangnam. I don't' know too many foreigners that will travel from Hongdae or Itaewon to party it up in Gangnam.
You got a crapload of hagwons in Gangnam and most of the foreigners that hang out in Gangnam work at those hagwons/public schools in Gangnam.
I live in Sinsa, I've lived in Dogok and Yeoksam. I've been in Gangnam for over 4 years. I know what I'm talking about.
The only time people from outside of Gangnam/Seocho area will come to Gangnam is probably clubbing at Eden/Answer/Mass/Ellui/Octogon/etc...
You spell Gangnam with a K. I think YOU don't know what you are talking about. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, I've been working here in Gangnam and can't say that the place is packed with visible foreigners.
In the summer, there are boat loads of Kyopo everywhere, but on an average day of walking on the street here, I'll see maybe a handful.
I'm not sure if there'd be enough numbers to justify a "foreign bar". It'd have to have a lot of appeal to Koreans.
Walk into any foreign restaurant in Gangnam on any day. What's their clientele like? |
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sportsfan
Joined: 26 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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I think some of you guys are looking at this from the wrong perspective. No reason the place has to be a party spot. Pubs don't operate 2 nights a week like night clubs. There IS a load of schools in and around gangnam. That place becomes the spot to go and unwind after work, hang out on a day off, go for company hwashik (however you spell it), a place foreigner businessman go or are taken while visiting korea, etc. And that doesn't even include the westernized koreans.
the owners do it right and I think it can do fantastic, unless you know of another place that fits that bill in Gangnam. |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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| everything-is-everything wrote: |
I like how you changed your argument from foreigners not going to Kangnam/Gangnam (seriously whatever douche bag) to only foreigners living in the vicinity.
And don't you think a lot of foreigners who live in Jamsil or Bundang would prefer to go to Gangnam than Itaewon of Hongdae?
Other than Itaewon and the Hongdae/Shinchon area I would say that Kangnam is the most foreign (i.e. Western) frequented area of the city.
Ever been to Voodoo, Rainbow, Kings Tap or Big Rock? |
I've been to Raindow, Kings Tap, and Big Rock. All three of those locations have predominantly Korean customers. The only place I've seen packed on a weekend is Rainbow. Big Rock/Kings Tap has a crapload of empty tables on Friday/Saturday night.
Just admit your assumption is incorrect. Maybe you and your group of friends hangout in Gangnam all the time. Nothing wrong with that. I'm not saying its a bad place. I'm saying the area doesn't draw foreigners.
If you want to keep defending your position, go right ahead. After this post, I'm done beating this dead horse. Gangnam doesn't appeal to foreigners. The only reason someone from Jamsil or Bundang would go to Gangnam is due to the proximity of their homes. NOT because of the bars and entertainment it has to offer. (Pssst...because it doesn't appeal to foreigners).
*EDIT*
Maybe Whiskey Weasel will start a change in that status quo. A year from now it Gangnam could be bigger than Hongdae for foreigners. However, right now, foreigners prefer other areas. |
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