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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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 Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 11:43 pm Post subject: Re: 2 Grammar Questions, Multiple Choice |
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| YTMND wrote: |
Do you see 1 or 2 possible answers to the grammar questions below? If only 1, why?
1. Do you know the girl ___ by the teacher now?
a. to be mentioned
b. being mentioned
c. mentioned
d. mentioning
2. The morning air is so good ___.
a. to be breathed
b. to breathe
c. breathing
d. being breathed |
YTMND...a problem inherent with this type of post is that most people are wondering what the point of it is.
Was this a test...did you write it....who wrote it?
Why do you suggest just 1 or 2...not 0 or even 3?
What grammar point is being focused on?
What is the ultimate goal as a teaching possibility from discussing this? etc.
The other is the word 'possible'.
With that option...almost all answers are 'possible' given the right context and a relaxed view of acceptable grammar.
In 1 - b, (c,a) are possible
In 2 - if we are willing to accept colloquialisms, slang, ebonics, ect...
then in order of standard acceptance
- b, (a,d,c)
Unfortunately, discussing why and how these are 'possible' is going to raise all kinds of confrontational opinions when we don't know the aim of the grammar point.
Anyway, for what it is worth, I agree with you and the other posters who suggest that there is more than one 'possible' answer. |
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T-J
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yeonsinnae
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| Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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| wings wrote: |
"To be woken up by the neighbor's dog every morning gives me a headache. I should talk to my neighbor about this."
This is wrong as an infinitive can't be a subject in everyday modern English. You can still find examples of it in proverbs etc, or in cases where the old fashioned grammar is being used as emphasis but you can't use this form outside of relics.
You need a gerund here "Being woken up..." not an infinitive. |
Funniest thing I've read today. Thanks.
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T-J
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yeonsinnae
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| Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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To the OP's question, two answers are acceptable for both questions. Choices b and c for question one and choices a and b for question two are grammatically correct.
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:57 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| YTMND...a problem inherent with this type of post is that most people are wondering what the point of it is. |
If you look at about 10-20 test questions which students are required to only give 1 answer but 2 come to your attention that might have 2 or more possible answers, I think it is quite obvious what the point is.
| Quote: |
| Was this a test...did you write it....who wrote it? |
Of course it wasn't me. Does it matter who wrote it? This is not a question based on different types of English (British vs. American), these are English questions which from what I see would be used in any normal English speaking context.
| Quote: |
| Why do you suggest just 1 or 2...not 0 or even 3? |
The premise was that there was only 1. So, I was trying to see if others saw more than one like I did. If you see 3, then you see more than 1. However, I was only looking to see if others saw one more plausible answer.
| Quote: |
| What is the ultimate goal as a teaching possibility from discussing this? etc. |
Knowledge. If I walk around and explain one reason why another answer is plausible and 4 students nod their head in understanding, while 10 others look dumbfounded (oh my gosh, the teacher said there are 2 right answers!!!), I want to be able to explain why differently.
| Quote: |
| when we don't know the aim of the grammar point. |
In that case, do you think tests should have something which outlines this aim? |
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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:41 am Post subject: |
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| YTMND wrote: |
| If you look at about 10-20 test questions which students are required to only give 1 answer but 2 come to your attention that might have 2 or more possible answers, I think it is quite obvious what the point is. |
Ok then...what is the point?
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| Of course it wasn't me. Does it matter who wrote it? |
Of course it wasn't you? Htf should we know?
Yes...it matters who wrote it. Do you know who wrote it?
| Quote: |
| The premise was that there was only 1. So, I was trying to see if others saw more than one like I did. If you see 3, then you see more than 1. However, I was only looking to see if others saw one more plausible answer. |
And again...what is the point of this exercise?
| Quote: |
| Knowledge. If I walk around and explain one reason why another answer is plausible and 4 students nod their head in understanding, while 10 others look dumbfounded (oh my gosh, the teacher said there are 2 right answers!!!), I want to be able to explain why differently. |
Then being more specific in your OP would help us help you better.
If that is indeed your point.
| Quote: |
| In that case, do you think tests should have something which outlines this aim? |
Here is the big question.
Some of us on this board have been discussing these types of tests for years. We often try to focus on one particular grammar point in order to keep things in context.
As for the tests themselves...most of them are poorly designed...there is no doubting that point.
You are certainly not alone in questioning the validity of such tests. |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:33 am Post subject: |
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| Ok then...what is the point? |
There is a crazy concept among test takers. Strangely enough, they want to get the answer correct. Perhaps, you haven't run into this alien like phenomenon. I encourage you to sign up for a college course and take one of their tests. It's too late to try elementary school through high school.
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| Of course it wasn't you? Htf should we know? |
I wrote a test with only 1 right answer, then I asked you guys if there were 2? Why on earth would someone sane do this? Obviously I didn't write it if I think 2 are possible.
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| Yes...it matters who wrote it. Do you know who wrote it? |
Sure, you name me one student who knows who wrote a test question, and I'll get right on it. Come on now, students take "the test" they don't ask who wrote a particular question before trying to answer it. Again this hinges on whether or not you had any experience in your past test taking. So far, from 2 of your replies, the answer is you must not have.
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| And again...what is the point of this exercise? |
The point is rather self evident, to understand a second possible answer to a question.
| Quote: |
| Then being more specific in your OP would help us help you better. |
No, when people see the reason and give me their opinion, I am always going to rate their reply more useful than someone who asks "What is the point?" a bunch of times and dismisses using logical discourse to arrive at a conclusion (and contribute that to a conversation in the form of their own opinion).
It's a waste of my time and energy to post a book online with all the pedantic permutations you could ask me in order to have me isolate EXACTLY what I want to know so you don't have to think of the reasonable premises behind asking. Others have already satisfied my curiosity, and they didn't keep asking me questions or seek clarification. They stated their opinion, and they moved on. That's all I was looking for initially and that's why my post wasn't long and drawn out as this reply is.
Maybe you should answer what the point is in what you are doing by interfering in a thread where others have stated their opinion and moved on. Is it your hobby to clutter threads that already have run their course?
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| We often try to focus on one particular grammar point in order to keep things in context. |
This is the ONLY useful part of your replies. I will not be addressing anything else unless it pertains to the above quote.
We may focus on one particular grammar point, but I was asking if the tests should outline these so the test taker has some understanding which plausible answers to avoid? This again goes along with the theory that students want to get 1 correct answer on a test question. |
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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:13 am Post subject: |
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| YTMND wrote: |
| Why on earth would someone sane do this? |
At this point...not sure that you are someone sane.
Enjoy your crazy train with its crazy concepts full of pedantic permutations.
Alliteration Anonymous is missing you. |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 8:43 am Post subject: |
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| I welcome all opinions. |
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justpale
Joined: 29 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:59 pm Post subject: Re: 2 Grammar Questions, Multiple Choice |
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| The Cosmic Hum wrote: |
| YTMND wrote: |
Do you see 1 or 2 possible answers to the grammar questions below? If only 1, why?
1. Do you know the girl ___ by the teacher now?
a. to be mentioned
b. being mentioned
c. mentioned
d. mentioning
2. The morning air is so good ___.
a. to be breathed
b. to breathe
c. breathing
d. being breathed |
...
The other is the word 'possible'.
With that option...almost all answers are 'possible' given the right context and a relaxed view of acceptable grammar.
In 1 - b, (c,a) are possible
In 2 - if we are willing to accept colloquialisms, slang, ebonics, ect...
then in order of standard acceptance
- b, (a,d,c)
...
Anyway, for what it is worth, I agree with you and the other posters who suggest that there is more than one 'possible' answer. |
I tend to err on the side of clarity and simplicity. Other answers may be technically correct but necessarily the best answer. that's why many standardized tests say to choose the BEST answer.
If it was my fault for giving vague instructions, I'd probably give the students the points and make it clear next time to choose the best/clearest/most logical answer. |
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