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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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snufalufagus
Joined: 10 May 2004
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 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:25 am Post subject: |
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I believe it had relevance, but no, it didn't focus on the user and the issue raised specifically. I was focusing on the opposing view. Making it a debate, but didn't accomplish that. Yes, some come to encompass multiple factors that can make teaching here rewarding (financially, professionally, etc), but I'm sure that's far and few in-between.
You're correct, I didn't stick to the original post |
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Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:35 am Post subject: |
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Well, it would make a lively debate, albeit a tad "Intel vs. AMD"ish in the ESL world.  |
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posco's trumpet
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Location: Beneath the Underdog
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:38 am Post subject: |
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So -- what do you do to make it work, or keep it from falling apart?
My personal rules:
1. Keep your ear to the ground at all times.
2. Be ready to change course at a moment's notice, or as soon as you see things going wrong.
3. Remember the class is more important to you than to them.
4. Keep the students on a short leash, but don't yank it.
5. This is the TV generation: change channels every 8 minutes or less.
6. Avoid syntax; embrace pragmatics. 
7. Never interrupt uncomfortable silences.
8. Make the students do as much of your work as you possibly can.
9. Don't use games to encourage good behavior; start and finish every class with a game or puzzle.
10. Ritualized activity offers tempo, but it can be addictive and stultifying.
They work most of the time, with most classes, for me.
| rapier wrote: |
POSCO: don't get too happy. I've had all the same cards and gifts etc...we love you, blah blah. Most of them had help from the korean teachers to write them, and the same kids behave like animals.
Most Koreans are not genuine, especially the kids,- but they are trained in the importance of creating a good impression and image.
I take whatever creative BS they write with apinch of salt, unless its from a student who I know has been exceptional and impressed me. |
I know, I know... I've had enough of the BS --from kids and adults-- to see that this was genuine.
These guys seriously impressed me all term long, and I could see it was genuine. It's pretty easy to tell when a class is enjoying itself while working hard, and if a class enjoys itself week after week, you get an idea.
I also know they didn't get help from anybody (they wrote the thing in class, passing it back and forth while they held a simulated meeting between representatives of the FKI, the unions and the government), except perhaps from the lesson I taught them on the format and content of thank-you notes.
One of the students was on a prize-winning team in a marketing contest held by a multinational cosmetics manufacturer. She got a 6-day trip to Paris to compete with teams from other countries. Her flight returned this afternoon. She made it to class at 5 pm. That's what this class was like. There was a level of interest and commitment one dreams about. We just hit it off.
It probably also helped that I gave them skills and information directly and practically relevant to the issues most on their minds: finding and keeping a job. We did all sorts of simulations, argumentation exercises, presentation work, letter-writting, intercultural office politics etc.
The class just had good chemistry from start to finish, and it showed in student progress.
Last edited by posco's trumpet on Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:53 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:50 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, posco's trumpet....those were some really nice comments, and very good of you to post them as an example of how good it can be when you finally connect with students.
I hope the OP can get into a situation where they can get some of that sweetness. |
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sadsac
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Gwangwang
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 9:18 am Post subject: |
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Posco, it is those things that make it all worth while. It's a tough game and as with the OP, often we feel that it's a waste of time and then one of those magical moment happens. We can be cynical and view them with a high degree of skepticism but I like to think that they are valued comments and written with a smidge of honesty and respect. Take heart it gets better.  |
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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 9:38 am Post subject: |
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The OP is talking about his experience at a public school so I can't relate.
As for teaching at a hagwon, all I can say is that you have to remember that you are an employee of the hagwon and not a teacher. |
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Thomas
Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 11:05 am Post subject: Re: Teaching Disillusionment |
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| adventureman wrote: |
| Before I arrived in Korea last year, I was very excitied about many things: living in a new country for an extended period of time for the first time, experiencing a new culture, and most especially, my job. Although I didn't have a huge number of preconcieved notions beforehand of what teaching English in Korea would be like, I, at the very least had hopes that would be able to try hard and do a decent job, have the ability to communicate and work alongside my co-workers on some kind of a level and at least make somewhat of a postitve impact on some people's lives. I was very eager to begin and spent much money and time on developing ideas and resources for my position. However, almost a year on, I have nearly lost all that intial hope and optimism. I am finally beginning to come to terms with the fact, that many of my students speak almost no english in class, never speak english outside of my class, and have zero interest in learning English. I am clearly accored less respect becasue of my 'outsider' status and to many of them, I feel as if I will never be anything more to them than a waygook-in novelty clown who they see once a week for a few minutes. Because of the way Korean teacher-centered eduction is stuctured, many of these students, even the ones who are better at English, are too scared to speak in front of the class and cannot learn in anyway except through choral repition. I often find that many of my ideas that I get excitied about bringing and sharing with the class do not work well. In addition, pretty much all of my co-workers do not acknowldege and have no desire to work with me or utilize me in anyway and/or are afraid to speak to me becasue of the 'face saving' atitude of Koreans. The ones who DO speak some english do not know to do anything except translate everything I say during class, almost as useless as doing nothing. Many times I leave work feeling exhausted and fustrated in my stuggles and have clearly come to the conclusion that I could never teach English in Korea for longer than a couple of years . Has anyone else experienced this kind of teaching disillusionment during their time here? |
As an ex-Epik person, I have experienced pretty much the same, over the course of 4 years. All of those things, plus the lack of any increased incentive to stay (promotion or money or job satisfaction) is finally what made me leave.
Granted I didn't change the world there, but there are some students who did very well and really liked my classes (and learned). In fact, some of them still ask about me and a couple have gone from the countryside to major in English! Of the Korean teachers I taught, most of them have continued doing what they were before they met me... but some of them still use the material I gave them and explain differences that I taught them.
You would probably be surprised the effect you have had on many people... and hopefully it is a positive one for you yourself, for foreign teachers, and for your nationality. (Sounds corny, but it is a good thing).
Overall I did my very best for the job. I refused to slack and take the easy way, even though I could've done it. I chose my time of departure (i.e. I chose not to renew) and I took all of my hard won experience, ideas, and skills back to the US where I now teach in a public school. Korea was not a waste of time for me. I hope that you continue to do your best, choose when to leave and then make the best of your time in Korea and beyond it. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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My line is "It takes a remarkably short amount of time to go from trying to figure out the best way to show these children all the wonder and mystery there is to behold in the world to trying to figure out how to just get them all to shut the h_ell up."
Bear in mind we're ultimately trying to teach children. Dozens of them. Most parents have their hands full trying to raise one or two.
Sometimes you have to suck the joy out of this job like marrow from the bones. A student called me a "kind" teacher last week. That made my week. A couple girls gave me some of their candy. That made another week. |
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jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2004 6:23 am Post subject: |
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I like to believe we are doing some good over here. I think we are just in the early stages of Korea's getting used to the world. Before the 1988 Olympics I guess most foreigners were truly foreign. Now we're not such a big thing anymore. Even if we are not making a big mark, collectively we have some impact. The kind of change Korea is seeking will take a generation or more. We are near the beginning of that and helping it get off the ground. Hopefully it will pay off.
Hope I'm not being too silly or optimistic, or not even making any sense!
For your students you just might represent an outside world full of possibility, not being a real part of the limitations of an all Korean existence! |
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Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2004 6:32 am Post subject: |
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| jajdude wrote: |
I like to believe we are doing some good over here. I think we are just in the early stages of Korea's getting used to the world. Before the 1988 Olympics I guess most foreigners were truly foreign. Now we're not such a big thing anymore. Even if we are not making a big mark, collectively we have some impact. The kind of change Korea is seeking will take a generation or more. We are near the beginning of that and helping it get off the ground. Hopefully it will pay off.
Hope I'm not being too silly or optimistic, or not even making any sense!
For your students you just might represent an outside world full of possibility, not being a real part of the limitations of an all Korean existence! |
*APPLAUSE* |
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the saint
Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Location: not there yet...
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| Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:24 am Post subject: |
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If it's any consolation to the OP, the attitude of the students in Korea blew me away when I came here. It is way better than that of the students in Japan. So, at least know there are worse students to teach out there somewhere.
But, in actual fact, teaching here is less than ideal. You sound like a person who really cares that they do a good job. If you stick around in EFL you will do that. It may not happen in Korea but it will happen. I would encourage you not to let the scene on the ground here colour how you see EFL globally. There is a lot more out there and new cultures can take a long time to adjust to. Having said that, the more experience you get at adapting, the easier it gets so hang in there. |
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TECO
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2004 8:27 am Post subject: |
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Interesting Thread topic!
Also great responses!
I agree with so much that has been said here.
Also, we should remember that we cannot 'change the world.' Maybe we can have a positive impact on the lives of some of the individuals who we do come into contact with as TEFL'ers. I can totally empathize with your feelings, though.
I also agree with these comments a 100%:
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I started living here for new reasons...all my own. I found study, hobbies and the unique gift offered here....isolation. I enjoy being alone immensely now, unlike when I arrived. This "outside"ness is a rare opportunity, one not afforded back home. Fill the time well, and it's time well-spent.
I don't want to be long-winded and preachy here, but I really think that if you want to hang around here for any longer, re-create yourself, or at least, re-define your goals. Choose the fruit that the tree bears, not pine for what isn't on the branch or what is out of your reach. |
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jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2004 8:36 am Post subject: |
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| the saint wrote: |
| It may not happen in Korea but it will happen. . |
Great post Saint.
I would like to add though, that it is happeneing in Korea! Despite all our down days we are making a difference. If I did not believe that I would be out "tout de suite"!
I don't think we appreciate just what a difference we are making. And I'm not saying it's altruistic or anything, but little by little, as time unfolds, change happens.
Somebody said a while ago:
"Teachers are the guardians of civilization."
Remember that no matter what you think you are. |
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Wishmaster
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Ha! You're the same clown that dissed on me because I was having such a great time in Korea. Now I get it. You are in Korea and you can't hack it and are pissed because I'm kicking ass here. Tough titty, kitty. I'm having a great time here...I've got a nice situation. If you can't hack it here, go back home. Go back to the land of $7 an hour and enjoy working HARD for your money. I'm all for taking it as easy as I can in life...the more I slack, the better I feel. If you want to work yourself to death so that your employer can make money off your hide, go for it. I make excellent money and I do play lots and lots of bingo and puzzle games. It is great fun. If you've got such a beef with the money I'm making, you would really have a heart attack at all of the overpaid atheletes, porn stars, corrupt politicians that are pulling down king jack back in the west. Yeah, I'm sure that they are really working HARD for that money. I'm all for the non-hackers leaving Korea...it makes it even easier for me to find jobs and continue making such easy, easy money. I'm enjoying my life here and you and your opinions don't mean shit to me. Enjoy that visit to the proctologist..................... |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Sun Jun 13, 2004 3:53 am Post subject: |
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| Public school is tough here if the foreigner environment wasn't previously established. It seems great for the first few months, but by the end of the year, you really feel just how little you've done. |
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