| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
wanderkind
Joined: 01 Jan 2012
Location: Japan
|
 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:29 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
| The victims are suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder and are getting psychological counseling from doctors. |
Really? All 7 of them?
| Quote: |
Most people having experienced a traumatizing event will not develop PTSD.[2] Women are more likely to experience higher impact events, and are also more likely to develop PTSD than men.[3] Children are less likely to experience PTSD after trauma than adults, especially if they are under ten years of age.
|
From Wikipedia.
I expect I'll get called a paedo now for suggesting they might be
exaggerating a little. Such is the modern hysteria on this topic. |
No, but I'll call you a half-troll for calling into question a claim by the victims (children / their families at that) that doesn't beg tremendous scrutiny. 'Most people don't get PTSD and less so among children' does not rule out the possibility of 7 kids getting PTSD.
And then you attempt to screen against rebuttal by linking contrary opinions to hysteria. Weak.
And "...modern hysteria on this topic"? Are you referring to child abuse or victim blaming? Either way, you might want to check your base of support there. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Oh that's right, you don't want to be treated equally. You want to be treated special. |
Ex pats should have special treatment and in the vast majority of companies they do. It's the trade off for the hassle of having to up sticks and move away from your homeland. |
While not necessarily "special" treatment, I do agree that they should get certain perks and accommodations. One of the tradeoffs for those is that you do have to jump through certain bureaucratic hoops. I just think its silly when people compare us to Korean teachers and complain that we aren't being treated the same. Of course not, we aren't the same. We get certain benefits and have to put up with certain things, they get certain benefits and have to put up with certain things. But I was taught that if you want equal status, you need to exercise equal responsibility. I tend to notice that most people screaming for equality in all the good stuff aren't too enthusiastic about doing all the bad. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:36 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| No, but I'll call you a half-troll for calling into question a claim by the victims (children / their families at that) that doesn't beg tremendous scrutiny |
I suspect lazy journalism in that the 7 children were probably offered counseling and the reporter filled in the blanks. I might be wrong but the statistics are on my side. My reference to modern hysteria referrred to the way emotions automatically seem to get in the way of the facts in cases like these and people who point this out tend to get castigated. E.g. if the newspaper/kids/parents say they have PTSD it must be true because they are the victims etc..The fact or non fact that all 7 children are suffering from PTSD would no doubt be an important issue in the trial so it's important to get it right. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| I tend to notice that most people screaming for equality in all the good stuff aren't too enthusiastic about doing all the bad. |
Your reference to joining the army for two years I assume was facetious and making people attend meetings/fill in paperwork entirely in Korean when they advertise for teachers who don't speak Korean is illogical and pointless. You might have a point about people complaining when they have to attend school dinners and the like. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmxc
Joined: 19 May 2008
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:42 pm Post subject: stop derailing thread |
|
|
The thread is about sexual assault of children by their Korean teachers. It is about how we all know Korean teachers in elementary schools, high schools, and even at universities practice rampant sexual harassment of their (especially) female students.
It is also about the double standard of how foreign English teachers are subject to much greater suspicion and perceived to be much greater threats than Korean instructors.
It is about how the media treats bad behavior or the accusation of bad behavior by Korean teachers completely differently than the way it treats behavior by foreign teachers.
The facts support that the greatest threat to Korean children comes from Korean adults, not from foreign English instructors.
Nothing else is relevant. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 12:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
Who are you to dictate what's relevant or not? Is your kid in the school system here? If so, would you not be concerned with ANY danger/threat?
I'm raising a kid here, and could give a toss about whether a pedo is Korean or non - I only care that we keep them away from kids. I'm all for CBCs of ALL adults working in/near schools - teachers, admin, support staff, etc... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
alongway
Joined: 02 Jan 2012
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 12:41 am Post subject: Re: another example of Korea's bull double standard |
|
|
| cmxc wrote: |
One of the things that most annoys me about Korea is their absolute refusal to acknowledge facts.
Foreign language instructors are subject to some of the most ridiculous requirements and with suspicion by authorities and parents.
- HIV test
- Drug test
- National criminal background check
- Visa tied to an employer
- minimal protections from contract violations
- salaries that have not risen with inflation
- media coverage that demonizes foreigners as if they are the biggest threats to Koreans
|
Let's go over this shall we?
Korean teachers are subject to tests for drugs and communicable diseases as well as general medical checks yearly.
they are also subject to a criminal background check.
The vast majority of professions in Korea have the visa tied to the employer, that's how you earn the right for it, in fact most countries have a lot of visas tied to sponsorship.
Foreigners have the same protections against contract violations that Koreans have.
Koreans don't seem to really take inflation into account when adjust salaries.
As for media coverage, you ever looked at anything besides ESLcafe in any country going?
So out of that entire list you've come up with a bunch of stuff Korean teachers also have to do and things that happen to everyone in the same situation in every other country on the planet. So..kudos for that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Old Painless
Joined: 01 Jan 2014
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| The vast majority of professions in Korea have the visa tied to the employer, |
The Japanese don't do this for education/teaching. Japan is a great country. Korea is 3rd world because Korea allows unscrupulous and evil people to run private schools, taking advantage of foreign teachers. If you have enough money to grease the officials' palm, you too can mistreat your foreign teachers and take months to pay them a fraction of what you owe them. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Who's Your Daddy?
Joined: 30 May 2010
Location: Victoria, Canada.
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:45 am Post subject: Re: stop derailing thread |
|
|
| cmxc wrote: |
| we all know Korean teachers in elementary schools, high schools, and even at universities practice rampant sexual harassment of their (especially) female students. |
It's not rampant. I've taught in maybe 8 different elementary schools, and I've never heard of rampant harassment of students in any of them.
I think it is an exception. If harassment was rampant parents wouldn't send their kids to school. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
alongway
Joined: 02 Jan 2012
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Old Painless wrote: |
| Quote: |
| The vast majority of professions in Korea have the visa tied to the employer, |
The Japanese don't do this for education/teaching. Japan is a great country. Korea is 3rd world because Korea allows unscrupulous and evil people to run private schools, taking advantage of foreign teachers. If you have enough money to grease the officials' palm, you too can mistreat your foreign teachers and take months to pay them a fraction of what you owe them. |
Then go to Japan. I believe in China your visa is not only tied to your employer, but they can claim you broke the law, refuse to take it to court and basically keep you hostage in the country until you give them the shirt off your back (literally) if they really wanted to. Taiwan is also tied to the employer. But yeah, Korea 3rd world country, go expats!
This was about foreign language instructors in Korea. They are not subjected to anything outside the norm for Korea either in regards to visa, teaching requirements, labour protection, or even how a given country treats foreigners in general. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hokie21
Joined: 01 Mar 2011
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I can say I've always been treated pretty fairly by my school/schools.....though my new school is run by a bit of a *beep*. He runs a number of schools and he has and extremely high opinion of himself. He hits on all the female Korean teachers whenever he is around and recently made all the foreign teachers sign a paper promising not to commit sexual harassment....not a legal document....just like a piece of paper he had someone type up. He tells all the female Korean teachers not to hang out with foreign men outside of work and hits on them daily.... but we are the ones who have to sign some stupid piece of paper. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmxc
Joined: 19 May 2008
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:30 pm Post subject: Korean teachers checks != foreign teachers checks |
|
|
It is straight up bullshit that Korean teachers are subject to yearly drug tests, HIV tests, and criminal background checks.
That is the entire reason for the outrage. Have you even seen the film 'The Crucible'? Read up on the happenings at the Dogani school and the courts protection of the child-rapists.
The facts are that Korean teachers convicted of sexual assault of their own students are only transferred to other schools. They are not even legally punished. Those with criminal records are allowed to continue teaching.
Hug me, kiss me: words from a teacher
http://koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2012/10/113_123265.html
Teachers to get heavier punishment for sex crimes
http://koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2012/12/113_126678.html
Fight against sex crimes at schools intensifying
http://koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2011/11/113_97673.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
alongway
Joined: 02 Jan 2012
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| It is straight up bullshit that Korean teachers are subject to yearly drug tests, HIV tests, and criminal background checks. |
That's certainly compelling evidence. Any teacher registered with any education office in Korea needs a criminal check full stop.
teachers also provide new medical checks yearly. Wasn't there a big to-do awhile ago about HIV tests for E2 visas stopping?
| Quote: |
That is the entire reason for the outrage. Have you even seen the film 'The Crucible'? Read up on the happenings at the Dogani school and the courts protection of the child-rapists.
The facts are that Korean teachers convicted of sexual assault of their own students are only transferred to other schools. They are not even legally punished. Those with criminal records are allowed to continue teaching. |
The fact is that was many years ago and the laws have changed since then. At the time they weren't allowed to pursue the case without the victim's consent and the statute of limitations had expired on some cases. Those laws have all been changed.
This is the way they're currently handling it: http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/national/2012/07/05/0302000000AEN20120705007500315.HTML |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:03 am Post subject: Re: Another teacher investigated sexual abuse |
|
|
| Lucas wrote: |
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2014/07/116_161659.html
| Quote: |
After the probe began, the teacher allegedly called the parents to cajole them into dropping their complaint.
The education office in Seoul said the teacher will be dismissed once he is indicted.
Police earlier asked the court to issue an arrest warrant for the teacher. However, the court rejected that, saying the teacher is unlikely to take flight.
|
2-1 odds he kills himself  |
Times are changing. In the past a teacher would have done this and it would have been covered up with the either the teacher or student being reassigned to another school and that's it. Higher ups might have even pressured the parents to drop it.
A friend told me about a teacher who groped a girl student and the parents were afraid to speak up because he had the ability to approve their trip abroad to New Zealand for English study. This was my old country town several years ago. We both shook our heads. This country has changed quickly, which is a good thing. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| optik404 wrote: |
| Oh that's right you and sr have this weird non sexual crush on each other. |
Who said anything about it being non-sexual? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
