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denverdeath
Joined: 21 May 2005
Location: Boo-sahn
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 Posted: Sun May 21, 2017 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| 10YearsExp wrote: |
Now thats a respectful, sophisticated reply I can respect. Nothing rude about your reply there, and someone disagreeing/agreeing with someone else is quite normal. I can even see how you'd think I wasnt being honest about 90% of the teachers I gathered info from over the past 10 years saying "mehhhhh, its OK i guess, but I was already employing most if not all of those techniques, etc., BEFORE I did the CELTA"..... EXCEPT THAT THEY DID TELL ME THAT. Sadly, edward made it insulting and a veiled personal insult, while your reply should serve as an embellishment to edward's teacher certification (which I assume he has).
True what you said about people thinking they know, etc. We all do still have opinions though, and mine is simply that those programs are only partially at best going to make someone a better teacher, and at worst not going to have much of an effect at all.
However, we must not allow this thread to be derailed, as it nearly was by edward, into a Teacher Certification quarrel, or, worse yet, as edward so desperately wants, a bickering match which slowly but surely increases in snideness (just look at his tone: "90% of your 'mates' " - never said they were my mates, but he wants to spin it).
So ttompatz seemed along with Chiapet and JohnML and PS-3 and yourself, to have the nicest replies and I hope to see that niceness continue!  Its what makes this world turn and spreads the love and kindness!
So Korea has about 30% LESS jobs than 7 years ago...... next question for you guys/gals: I taught at a uni in Malaysia for 2 and a half years (English Foundation) to pre-Med and Engineering students (again, no teacher certification and no problem for that uni) --- does SK have anything along THOSE lines, do you know? |
I don't personally know about the numbers now, but, yeah, less students for sure, due to lowered childbirths. And, I DO agree with you regarding the TEFL/TESOL/TESL requirement. Life experience, or an intro to psyc/soc course would/could easily give you about the same. Having said that, if GEPIK/EPIK/SCHEMPICK is asking for it, you ain't getting squat unless you do it. Unis? Few and far between now. The master's, even though unrelated, MAY get your foot in a door at a country uni/college, but def not at a SKY place...or even my place...which basically only requires an F visa, as we're not hiring because of the numbers. Best of luck/skill! |
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10YearsExp
Joined: 02 May 2017
Location: The Big Apple
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| Posted: Sun May 21, 2017 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| denverdeath wrote: |
| . And, I DO agree with you regarding the TEFL/TESOL/TESL requirement. Life experience, or an intro to psyc/soc course would/could easily give you about the same. |
Yeah man, agreed, and for edwardcatflappy, here is the 26th teacher to tell me that now.
Is he my mate? Hey DenverDeath, are you my mate? Heck yeah! Good friends from now on, I loved your post, spreading kindness and peace thru respectful replies! Denver, I think YOU should replace a few on the Hiring Committees there! 
Yeah I taught 2 years 6 months in KL, one of the best universities in that country and it was ranked #74 in all of Asia, I taught English Foundation to freshmen. I also taught IELTS 2 Saturdays per month for 22 months.
I am not necessarily looking for any particular kind of school/uni in South Korea, nor expecting to be able to be hired at one kind or another, just wondering as my thread title says how things in South Korea have changed in general since 2007.
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10YearsExp
Joined: 02 May 2017
Location: The Big Apple
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| Posted: Sun May 21, 2017 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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edwardcatflapp
You assume quite a lot indeed. I do not EXPECT to be hired at a uni. Never said that but you assumed it and accused me of it. I also CHOOSE not to do a cert program, it is a choice, it is not that I "cannot be bothered to do it" as you hhave once again wrongly spun it.
As for the guy who out and out said he didnt believe me that 90% of them told me so, I did point that out to him FYI.
I do commend you however as admitting you were a bit snide right from the get-go. 90% of people cannot even do that if you paid them.
I am the least unaware person you will ever meet. I am fully aware most top notch places require certification and never once said I EXPECTED to be hired at a uni without any cert. Also its not that I am sensitive, but that I always wish that people treat each other in respectable ways. We can disagree with the cert issue from now until Doomsday, but God almighty, as Kurt Vonnegut once said: LOVE MAY FAIL, BUT COURTESY PREVAILS. |
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10YearsExp
Joined: 02 May 2017
Location: The Big Apple
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| Posted: Sun May 21, 2017 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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edwardcatflap
you wrote: ".....can't take criticism." First off, how are you already just coming out and criticizing? Who are you to criticize someone you meet for the very first time on a forum? It is you who is arrogant. To be quite honest, you don't seem to be the kind of graceful, kind character that even remotely belongs on a hiring committee. You have spun atleast 3 things I wrote into things I did not say at all. Is this your hobby? Is this what your certification has done for you? Ahh, now I see
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10YearsExp
Joined: 02 May 2017
Location: The Big Apple
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| Posted: Sun May 21, 2017 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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Again, back to the original topic.  How have things changed?
May I ask, are there Foundation programs at unis in which 10 levels of English must be passed in order to be able to begin a Bachelors degree program? If so, would a TEFL be enough, or would one need a DELTA? |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun May 21, 2017 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| it is a choice, it is not that I "cannot be bothered to do it" as you hhave once again wrongly spun it. |
Where did I say that?
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| I do not EXPECT to be hired at a uni. Never said that but you assumed it and accused me of it |
Did I?
You're beginning to come across as a little paranoid. |
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SuperfuzzBigmuff
Joined: 12 Mar 2017
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| Posted: Mon May 22, 2017 3:48 am Post subject: |
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I too have returned after quite a few years out of the country.
I haven't been back in Korea for too long, but there seems to be far more Western products in shops like Emart.
Wages haven't gone up in 10 years, but things in general seem to have gone up about 30% as a rough estimate. I doubt you'll get rich here.
Some provincial areas are as backwards as before. You still get the Korean glare in the small cities. I haven't spent any time in Seoul yet, but Busan is pretty damn nice; at least the Haeundae area. There are coffee shops everywhere.
I got a public high school job incredibly easily despite being middle-aged, but it's in a city in the provinces down south.I'm not sure if I could have gotten a job in Seoul or Busan where I lived for a few years.
Dave's is still full of the same sad old gits who've been posting their little lives away for up to a decade, but TUM seems to have finally moved on. |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Mon May 22, 2017 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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| TUM left Korea after 15 years (due to market changes). Now he lives in China. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon May 22, 2017 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| 10YearsExp wrote: |
I am now 53, energetic, but not wanting a hagwon job again. I do not have a TEFL or CELTA or any teaching cert at all, just a BA in English and an unrelated Masters.
...next question for you guys/gals: I taught at a uni in Malaysia for 2 and a half years (English Foundation) to pre-Med and Engineering students (again, no teacher certification and no problem for that uni) --- does SK have anything along THOSE lines, do you know? |
BA, unrelated MA, 2 years tertiary experience outside of Korea at the tertiary level plus some hagwon time ... you might find a job in a provincial uni but you won't find it sitting in your living room in NYC. Those jobs are found through connections.
You might find a job in a uni-gwan (university language center) from home but again, they usually don't come with airfare and often want to interview "in person" at your expense. The remuneration and hours are not much better than your average hagwon.
Public high schools and middle schools have largely discontinued the use of NETs in their programs leaving the bulk of jobs at the elementary level. PS jobs will require you to take a TEFL course if you want to be hired from abroad.
Hagwons are what they have always been and the number of jobs has largely remained consistent over the years. As businesses they come and go with some regularity but overall the number of positions in hagwons has largely remained stable. The bulk of those jobs are with younger kids (K-6 age ranges).
The bulk of the 30% of country wide reductions in NET positions has been in the middle/high schools.
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10YearsExp
Joined: 02 May 2017
Location: The Big Apple
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| Posted: Mon May 22, 2017 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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| SuperfuzzBigmuff wrote: |
I too have returned after quite a few years out of the country.
I haven't been back in Korea for too long, but there seems to be far more Western products in shops like Emart.
Wages haven't gone up in 10 years, but things in general seem to have gone up about 30% as a rough estimate. I doubt you'll get rich here.
Some provincial areas are as backwards as before. You still get the Korean glare in the small cities. I haven't spent any time in Seoul yet, but Busan is pretty damn nice; at least the Haeundae area. There are coffee shops everywhere.
I got a public high school job incredibly easily despite being middle-aged, but it's in a city in the provinces down south.I'm not sure if I could have gotten a job in Seoul or Busan where I lived for a few years.
Dave's is still full of the same sad old gits who've been posting their little lives away for up to a decade, but TUM seems to have finally moved on. |
awesome points highlighted above I love picturing a a southern rural area, I worked 2 years in Jeollranam-do (please forgive the spelling off the top of my head) very near to Suncheon. I love the deep south there, almost tropical at times, mild winters, just beautiful! |
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Guajiro
Joined: 04 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Tue May 23, 2017 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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| 10YearsExp wrote: |
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| 10YearsExp wrote: |
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Sounds like you also have a phobia about TEFL qualifications. |
no, Pete, it aint a phobia, its that I think they are nearly useless. |
If you've never got any, how would you know?
Anyway the good news is, that's pretty much what they think at your average Korean hagwan too, so I guess you'll fit in. |
So your argument is nobody can know anything unless they themselves personally do it? That is weak, not to mention silly. You are quite the agitator here in this thread, is that your usual role here on the forum then? When I said I have a phobia to needles, your sarcastic and trouble-making remark that I must have a phobia to certification showed me your mean-spirited character.
OK, I'll entertain you, I guess you're just looking for a quarrel, I can smell you a mile away. I don't need to get one to know, I feel having spoken to maybe 25 teachers over the past 10 years who DID get certified and been told by 90% of them that the certification does little-to-nothing and is largely just based on common sense, is quite enough confirmation for what I had already thought on my own after researching those programs for years.
Between you and me bro, I really don't care about your personal judgements of me at all, as the fact you have instantly in your very first interaction with me behaved so abrasively utterly disqualifies you from being viewed as a dignified, respectful individual.
Good show! |
The extra certification may or may not teach you something you already know, but the fact of the matter is that it is a requirement for many TESL jobs. This is becoming a common requirement for many jobs in China as well as Korean public schools. If you want to continue teaching in the more lucrative markets of East Asia, it would probably be to your advantage to upgrade your credentials. |
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tophatcat
Joined: 09 Aug 2006
Location: under the hat
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2017 5:34 am Post subject: |
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^
thumbs up
However, I like having less competition in the market. It's good to know there are so many people out there willing to coast along. The guy who is happy with good enough is the guy who makes it easier for me to do much, much better. |
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Enrico Palazzo
Mod Team
Joined: 11 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2017 5:51 am Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Now thats a respectful, sophisticated reply I can respect. Nothing rude about your reply there, and someone disagreeing/agreeing with someone else is quite normal |
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| Too, I don't believe that 90% of the 25 teachers said the certification does little-to-nothing to help. |
I made a slightly snidey comment about phobias while he just outright
accused you of lying. And that's respectful and sophisticated? Still it's interesting to see what things wind people up more than others.
| Quote: |
| does SK have anything along THOSE lines, do you know? |
Some very crappy Korean universities out in the sticks might take you on from outside the country with your unrelated Masters. I'm curious though about how you'd feel paying to go to university and getting lessons from someone with no related qualifications in that field. If you'd be fine about it I guess that's fair enough.
And sorry, I usually ignore personal insults but I won't be lectured to about spreading love and kindness
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| I hope to see that niceness continue! Its what makes this world turn and spreads the love and kindness! |
After you accused me of all this.
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silly, agitator, sarcastic, trouble-making, abrasive, insulting
snideness, rude. |
And what did I do? Accuse you of having mates you don't have?
Finally, for an older guy you seem to have very little self awareness. You're basically looking for work at a Korean university and many people on here, myself included serve on hiring committees occasionally. Yet you come across as arrogant - thinking you, unlike others, don't have to bother with qualifications and very sensitive to criticism (I'm guessing that could be one reason why you don't want to do any training) Hardly the kind of guy anyone would want to hire. |
Edward, Edward, please play nice. No need for all that.  |
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10YearsExp
Joined: 02 May 2017
Location: The Big Apple
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| Posted: Mon May 29, 2017 10:32 am Post subject: |
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| Enrico Palazzo wrote: |
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Now thats a respectful, sophisticated reply I can respect. Nothing rude about your reply there, and someone disagreeing/agreeing with someone else is quite normal |
| Quote: |
| Too, I don't believe that 90% of the 25 teachers said the certification does little-to-nothing to help. |
I made a slightly snidey comment about phobias while he just outright
accused you of lying. And that's respectful and sophisticated? Still it's interesting to see what things wind people up more than others.
| Quote: |
| does SK have anything along THOSE lines, do you know? |
Some very crappy Korean universities out in the sticks might take you on from outside the country with your unrelated Masters. I'm curious though about how you'd feel paying to go to university and getting lessons from someone with no related qualifications in that field. If you'd be fine about it I guess that's fair enough.
And sorry, I usually ignore personal insults but I won't be lectured to about spreading love and kindness
| Quote: |
| I hope to see that niceness continue! Its what makes this world turn and spreads the love and kindness! |
After you accused me of all this.
| Quote: |
silly, agitator, sarcastic, trouble-making, abrasive, insulting
snideness, rude. |
And what did I do? Accuse you of having mates you don't have?
Finally, for an older guy you seem to have very little self awareness. You're basically looking for work at a Korean university and many people on here, myself included serve on hiring committees occasionally. Yet you come across as arrogant - thinking you, unlike others, don't have to bother with qualifications and very sensitive to criticism (I'm guessing that could be one reason why you don't want to do any training) Hardly the kind of guy anyone would want to hire. |
Edward, Edward, please play nice. No need for all that. |
Thank you Mr. Palazzo |
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oatmeal
Joined: 26 Nov 2013
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| Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| well one thing for sure that hasn't changed in Korea since 2007, threads like this lol |
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