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Advice needed re the the whole teaching/contract thing
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Harvard Material



Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2003 9:27 am    Post subject: Maid in Korea! Reply with quote

NO! It's just that easy everyone. 'NO'!. Then go sightseeing. That's what I would do.

I used to sweep and clean my room everyday. But now all the kid's in the school play in my room because it is big. Now I don't clean it. The owner asked me to, but I said 'NO'! Took me a nano-second to say it, and you can say it twice as fast as you can type it! NO!
I teach these (very young), students, wipe their noses, put up with the noise, play and do my best to make class fun...don't tell me I am not a part of the team because I don't clean "your" institute. Could hire a cleaner, but that has already been exposed on this thread. I'll see the stalls lined with Facial Royale before that day arrives.

You can do what Matthews_World does...for the rest of the year! In for a penny, in for a pound, and that is exactly what it will amount to if you agree to do it Marathe.
I originally cleaned out of choice, not question or expectation. I prefer a clean room. I don't want a Korean co-worker cleaning my room anymore than I want, or need, my room-mate doing my laundry. IF my room-mate is foolish enough to start doing my laundry (plus cook and clean if I am really lucky), I will probably start to like it. A LOT! I would cry if it ever changed Crying or Very sad Your director won't appreciate any change either, if you agree to do it once.

...Take your Korean co-workers out for dinner the odd time if you worry about any poor reflections towards your 'comradory' with them. That's what I do now. We have a great time, and it doesn't cost that much. I spend 80 or 100,000won and have a great time AFTER work with the co-workers that do appreciate it, and not wasting my time (during or after hours), with some condescending director who expects it. My co-workers would say NO too if they felt they could keep their job and I realise that.

Part of the team? Where are, and more importantly WHY aren't the kid's going to school that day because the director has a meeting? So the director is out? Big deal. That director must be an extremely integral part of that institute to have to close shop when he/she is 'out'! WOW! Are all the restaurants in that area closed too? LG25's?

I hope the parents get a discount that month for the missing day. Cleaning lady would be a lot cheaper...
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itchy



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Busan

PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2003 7:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Advice needed re the the whole teaching/contract thing Reply with quote

[][]

Last edited by itchy on Mon Jun 05, 2006 3:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2003 6:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

waterbaby wrote:
TheUrbanMyth wrote:

We were hired to teach, not to clean.


I have my own classroom and I clean it twice a week, which is expected of me by my hogwan. If I don't clean my room (the foreign teacher I took over from NEVER cleaned because it "wasn't in the contract") then I know that one of my Korean co-workers will have to clean it for me.

...


Read my FIRST post in this thread again. Then read the FIRST post in this thread. Heck, I'll spell it out for you. He was asked to clean the school, not just the room he teaches classes in. I clean up my own classroom, I even suggested that he clean up his, if that what was being expected of him. But cleaning up the whole school is a bit much. So what if the Korean co-workers have to clean it up? That is what is expected of them when they sign on. They knew what they were getting into when they signed on unlike the foreign teachers who are only told this AFTER we sign on the dotted line. As for being unfair, well we get paid a lot more than our Korean counterparts. Don't you think that's unfair? In the spirit of fairness, shouldn't you talk to your boss and tell him "hey it's unfair that I get paid more than they do. I want to get paid the same."
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itchy



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Busan

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2003 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you sure you get paid more? 1.8 millon won a month is the average in Korea. Works out to about $30,000 CDN a year. A unionized bus driver in Seoul makes more than that. So do most Korean elementary school teachers.
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waterbaby



Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Location: Baking Gord a Cheescake pie

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2003 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheUrbanMyth wrote:


Read my FIRST post in this thread again. Then read the FIRST post in this thread. Heck, I'll spell it out for you. He was asked to clean the school, not just the room he teaches classes in. I clean up my own classroom, I even suggested that he clean up his, if that what was being expected of him. But cleaning up the whole school is a bit much.


Urban myth... I too agree with this. Cleaning a whole school is a different matter. I said that I only clean my own classroom - it's not in my contract, but neither is a lot of the stuff the school does for me. And I know that the school would not do a lot of the "extra's" they do if I ran to them every week and said "Oh, but it's not in my contract!"

What I was trying to suggest that this day off of his was probably unexpected and also not in his contract. Give a little, take a lot!

I was even trying to comment on individual situations in hogwans... if you like them, the extra mile you're willing to go to maintain a good relationship and consider what they might do for you in return. Not everyone works for bad hogwans and dodgy directors. Not everyone is paranoid about being walked over by their employer.

Quote:
So what if the Korean co-workers have to clean it up? That is what is expected of them when they sign on. They knew what they were getting into when they signed on unlike the foreign teachers who are only told this AFTER we sign on the dotted line.


I disagree with you there. I think the Korean teachers are a lot more powerless than foreign teachers when it comes to the school asking them "favours". And a lot of these "favours" come after they've started working and I don't know any korean teachers who have signed a dotted line...

Ultimately, it's Marthe's decision to make - it's his/her situation.

So now I'm curious... Marathe... did you clean or not?
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2003 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="waterbaby"]
TheUrbanMyth wrote:


Quote:
So what if the Korean co-workers have to clean it up? That is what is expected of them when they sign on. They knew what they were getting into when they signed on unlike the foreign teachers who are only told this AFTER we sign on the dotted line.


I disagree with you there. I think the Korean teachers are a lot more powerless than foreign teachers when it comes to the school asking them "favours". And a lot of these "favours" come after they've started working and I don't know any korean teachers who have signed a dotted line...

Ultimately, it's Marthe's decision to make - it's his/her situation.

So now I'm curious... Marathe... did you clean or not?


...On the dotted line, not A dotted line. Wink In a previous post Marathe said that he'd made up his mind to take the day off.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2003 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

itchy wrote:
Are you sure you get paid more? 1.8 millon won a month is the average in Korea. Works out to about $30,000 CDN a year. A unionized bus driver in Seoul makes more than that. So do most Korean elementary school teachers.



3M/month. Works for me. And I was talking about hakwon teachers who (except a few who teach TESOL and other such courses) most certainly do not make 1.8 million won a month.
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whiskey jack



Joined: 30 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2003 12:30 pm    Post subject: cleaning up Reply with quote

I have to agree with Matthew_world. And I have to wonder why anyone would call themselves a teacher if they work for a hagwon. That is not what we do. It only "looks" like we teach. I mean c'mon,why take the job so damn seriously,anyways thats my 2 cents.
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itchy



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Busan

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

;';';

Last edited by itchy on Mon Jun 05, 2006 3:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Gord



Joined: 25 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

itchy wrote:
All the good jobs are straight salary.


Most jobs you see advertised are for beginners and novices. They know that most of the people who respond are people who have either never taught before or have lost previous jobs.

Once you actually have experience and contacts in Korea, if you were good then you'll get offers of 3M+. You don't see these advertised because they come word of mouth.

Myself, I'm paid by the hour and earn between four and five million won a month depending on how busy I am and I turn down offers.
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Hotuk



Joined: 10 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Myself, I'm paid by the hour and earn between four and five million won a month depending on how busy I am and I turn down offers.


This may be so - and good on you - but you're also sitting around waiting for the next Immigration amnesty period. Some of us would call that a restriction.
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Rand Al Thor



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Locked in an epic struggle

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hotuk wrote:
This may be so - and good on you - but you're also sitting around waiting for the next Immigration amnesty period. Some of us would call that a restriction.


as well as obviously illegal.
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Katz



Joined: 06 Apr 2003
Location: Ulsan

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have to agree with waterbaby. In Korea I have found it to be rather customary that at times workers pitch in and help out with cleaning. This is not just at hagwons, but at offices and regular elementry schools. In fact I know of a couple of elementry schools that ask one mother a week to come in and clean the classroom. I have also seen cleaning day at many companies, one day where the entire staff clean the office.
With that said, if your school's director is a jerk, and you fine that they are over working you, not paying you on time, not giving you overtime, or forcing you to work overtime class that you don't want to, then by all means teel them where to shove their mop.
If your school is nice, treats you with respect, and adapts to your needs, you may find it to be benificial to roll up you sleeves and scrup a little. You may also find that you get to know some of your Korean co-workers a little better.
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Gord



Joined: 25 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 3:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hotuk wrote:
[This may be so - and good on you - but you're also sitting around waiting for the next Immigration amnesty period. Some of us would call that a restriction.


The description you are looking for is "government work". Not everyone who makes more than the base minimum for inexperienced workers is working illegally.

That still doesn't negate the offers I've had for much more than the starting wage of 1.9M or whatever. That's essentially minimum wage. As with any job, once you are good at it you can demand more and people will pay more.

Though if I did not take full time work at once place, I would have just gotten a sponsored visa for part time work a hogwan and then added all the extra part-time places I would work at under my visa legally. Not complicated.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 5:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rand Al Thor wrote:
Hotuk wrote:
This may be so - and good on you - but you're also sitting around waiting for the next Immigration amnesty period. Some of us would call that a restriction.


as well as obviously illegal.



Sorry to burst your bubble guys, but I'm totally legit.
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