Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Rteacher]

"In the beginning of Kali-yuga [the present cosmic age] the Lord will appear as Lord Buddha, the son of Aijana, in the province of Gaya, just for the purpose of deluding those who are envious of the faithful theist."

The above quote is a verse from Srimad Bhagavatam (Canto 1, Chapter 3, text 24) in the section listing all the scheduled incarnations , detailing where they would appear, who their parents would be, and what the main purpose of their advent would be.

In his commentary on the verse, Bhakivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada states - "Lord Buddha, a powerful incarnation of the Personality of Godhead, appeared in the province of Gaya (Bihar) as the son of Aijana, and he preached his own conception of nonviolence and deprecated even the animal sacrifices sanctioned in the vedas. At the time when Lord Buddha appeared, the people in general were atheistic and preferred animal flesh to anything else. On the plea of Vedic sacrifice, every place was practically turned into a slaughterhouse, and animal killing was indulged in unrestrictedly. Lord Buddha preached non-violence, taking pity on the poor animals. He preached that he did not believe in the tenets of the Vedas and stressed the adverse psychological effects incurred by animal killing. Less intelligent men of the age of Kali, who had no faith in God, followed his principle, and for the time being they were trained in moral discipline and nonviolence, the preliminary steps to proceeding further on the path of God realization. He deluded the atheists because such atheists who followed his principles did not believe in God, but they kept their absolute faith in Lord Buddha, who himself was an incarnation of God. Thus, the faithless people were made to believe in God in the form of Lord Buddha. That was the mercy of Lord Buddha: he made the faithless faithful to him."

[anjucat]

I've done Goenka's 10-day course on three different occasions. Yes, the schedule can seem rigorous, but (for me) fully enjoyable and and relaxing after you "get into" it. What's nice about Goenka's approach is that it's almost solely physical "mindfulness" meditation -- no real doctrine-related teachings, which makes it more appealing to those who shy away from "religion" or "cultish activities."

For me, vipassana is not the "end all, be all" of the spiritual path, but i found it to make for a nice break from the hectic pace of one's daily life.

Oh, and it is (technically) free. Those who do the course the 2nd time are encouraged to make a "suggested donation", but if you honestly have no money (as was my case), then that can be avoided. Most have no problems. Just pay what you can -- $1 or $1000 -- with a spirit of generosity.

[desultude]

[Rteacher]

Do you really think slaughterhouses are respectable? Do you think that impersonalistic and voidist philosophies that deny the existence of a personal, inconceivably powerful God are truly respectable?

I offer all respect to Lord Buddha as an incarnation of God. (I also offer all respect to Jesus and Mohammed as true representatives of the same Supreme God known by different names...) Real religions are "God-made" and are based on the authentic "Word of God" (though men manage to screw them up in time...) - Christians and Jews have the Bible, Moslems have the Koran, "Hindus" have Bhagavad-gita, and they all convey the message of devotional service to God as the highest good. Unfortunately, horrible things have been done in the name of God and religion, and they have given God and religion-in-general a "bad name" in the minds of some...

The fact that Lord Buddha used transcendental trickery to "delude" atheists certainly does not lessen his Divinity. God got tired of people killing animals in His name - and using scriptures as justifcation - so He decided to compassionately appear as Lord Buddha to stop the slaughter by denying the authority of the Vedas. When quoting the Bhagavatam verse I probably should have highlighted the fact that the ancient scripture (compiled about 5000 years ago by Vyasadeva, the "literary incarnation") accurately predicted in detail the circumstances of Lord Buddha's appearance. And by God's arrangement, subsequent incarnations drove Lord Buddha's teachings beyond India's borders and reestablished the authority of the Vedas...

Anyway, from an absolute perspective, impersonalistic and voidist philosophies tend to impede the spiritual progress of people influenced by them (and are insulting to God) so serious theists and devotees try to defeat them. Scriptural evidence is sufficient to convince "believer" types, but skeptics and atheists openly don't care for any scriptures; hence, arguments based on logic and reason are presented. However, one ot the symptoms of this fallen age of quarrel and hypocrisy is that - even when defeated - rascals won't admit it.

Of course, these are concerns of staunch theists and devotees. Dilettantes and some "eclectic" types tend to have what amounts to an uncritical approach to spiritual matters, and adopt an "I'm OK, You're OK, He's OK..." attitude. Not that such dilettantes and "eclectic" types are so bad - everyone has to start someplace...Indeed, they should be given respect and encouragement to get more serious on the path to spiritual perfection. (Admittedly, I'm a long, long, long, long, long ways from the goal... - also please excuse any condescending tone...)

[Rteacher]

I couldn't help but notice there's been no reply to my mad ramblings... And where's the originator of this thread - who has yet to provide any details of his possibly traumatic experience?

[desultude]

[Rteacher]

The main thing is understanding the difference between spiritual and material. Material means focusing primarily on your own senses and sense gratification while spiritual means focusing on pleasing the senses of the Supreme Living Being.

Materialism infects practically everything in this world - including religion. Unlike other religions (meant to attract different types of people in different places) the original religion of ancient India does not have a particular historical starting point and is based on the Vedas which were first spoken millions of years ago (long story...)

Because Buddhism denies the authority of the Vedas and the existence of a supreme sentient being it is not very pleasing to God - except to the extent that it has stopped sinful animal slaughter and tricked people into worshipping Lord Buddha.

Worse than Buddhists are the so-called Vedantists who - although they supposedly accept the authority of the Vedas - refuse to accept the conclusion of the Vedas that there is always a distinction between the innumerable living entities and the one Supreme Living Entity. They mistakenly identify their soul (infinitessimal spiritual spark of the Supreme) with the Supersoul (expansion of God situated next to the soul as a witness...) The soul and supersoul are simultaneously one (in quality) and different (in quantity) The individual souls (jiva-atmas) are eternally small, while the Supersoul (param-atma) localized feature of the Supreme Being is eternally great - and is maintaining all the the individual living entities. Basically, impersonalists - or mayavadis - offend God because they believe that we are all God - and we are just (forgetfully) going through the motions of suffering in ignorance and illusion for the hell of it

In the Vaishnava line of spiritual masters originating with Krishna there are two types of devotees: bhajananandis - who constantly chant( bhajans) and meditate softy for their own benefit - and ghostyandandis - who chant loudly (kirtans) and preach for the benefit of all the fallen conditioned souls. Although both types reach spiritual perfection, Krishna states that "no is more dear" to Him than one who takes all risks to preach the message of Bhagavad-gita ("Song of God"...)

[desultude]

Yeah, Yeah

I have no real time for fundamentalism, Christian, Islamic, or Hindu, which I can see you are into. Proud that the Buddhists were driven out of India? A peaceful religion there may have alleviated some of the religious bloodshed there over the centuries.

With your ham handed arrogant attacks on Buddhism and all, this is the end of my end of this conversation,. If you can call it a conversation, with you using a religious tract that A) I don't have, and B) I am not interested in.

Also, please note, I have never attacked your beliefs, just your attacks on mine. I have always been rather neutral on Hinduism. Thank you for opening my eyes. I'll try to keep an open mind on it, but I will be more wary in the future.

Have a good lifetime.

[Rteacher]

Farewell (...shhh! ... - I think I got the last word in!!)

[Rteacher]

Where did I indicate that I - or anyone else - was "proud" of driving Buddhism out of India? And what violence are you referring to? - I think I clearly expressed that Buddhism was philosophically defeated, and the Vedas were reestablished by subsequent incarnations. (As far as violence in India goes, my understanding is that most aggression was initiated by the Moslems and the British - not by "Hindus.") Furthermore, I'm fifty-six years old, and I'm not aware that I've ever been considered especially "arrogant." I usually take a humble position when preaching, and I expect to be personally insulted on occasion - mostly by those inimical to the idea of a personal God... (or those who just don't like my looks - go figure...)

[Red]

[gypsyfish]

People corrupt all religion.

It wasn't that long ago that the Chogye Buddhists were throwing fire bombs at the other Buddhist sect (can't remember their name) here in Seoul because they didn't want to give up the right to control the money donations.

[desultude]