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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 6:22 am Post subject: |
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| Naruto wrote: |
| But for work, multimedia, music, and general use i'd take a G5 over any Intel or AMD based machine. |
I guess you haven't heard then....
It's been pretty big news, even outside of the Apple world.
Apple to Use Intel Microprocessors Beginning in 2006
edit: corrected the link
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/jun/06intel.html
While I think it's great that you have 2 sweet machines, I value the fact that I don't feel forced to switch hardware based on whether I'm playing games or doing work.
Last edited by Bulsajo on Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:17 am Post subject: |
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| Naruto wrote: |
| PC hardware is cheap...why? Because it's crap components. |
That would entirely depend on the supplier of the component. Though generally, their is little (if anything) in a Mac that isn't available as a PC component.
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| Pre-built systems like Dell or HP are even worse with their integrated sound and graphics and their expandable 2 GB RAM. |
For $600 including a 15" monitor, what miracles are you expecting? Though integrated A/V though the Intel 915G/925G chipsets is pretty much good enough for anything short of recent 3D games. For the $2000+ pricetag of a G5, you can get a PC of superior specs.
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| Apple = expensive but high quality components, the fastest RISC processing system, stabler OS, better RAM/Memory allocation, expansion to 8 GB RAM...Which would you choose? Quality or Price? |
Fastest RISC processing system? What is this, 1989? Though frankly, no one views the Apple machines as being the fastest anything. Their strengths come from software, not hardware.
Better memory allocation? That only would have applied for a single-digit % increase if everyone was using RAMBUS RAM. PCI ram doesn't benefit from any speed increase based where in memory things are or how cleanly organized it is.
More RAM? Anyone running XP64 is only limited by the number of memory slots on their motherboard multiplied by 2GB each. So if a person has 8 memory slots, they can have 16GB of RAM.
Seems Apple has taken your advice and will be selling PCs next year which are hardware identical to everyone else's, though they will ship with their own O/S. |
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dbee
Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: korea
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 8:43 am Post subject: |
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Firstly - this made me laugh out loud
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Some magazine did a pole awhile back
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I presume this was meant as 'poll' .... although having spent some time in Poland, I've met a few Pole's I wouldn't mind 'doing' myself ... sounds like a fairly hardcore christmas party btw 
... but anyway, back to the discussion ... I really don't understand how anyone gets particularly excited about Macs and the apple corporation in general. They are just as greedy and abusive as microsoft are. If you have apple shares and the apple company is working for you then great - otherwise, I really thing there are more worthy causes to be championing out there than APPLE CORP ( Steve Jobs is just a less smart Bill Gates)
What about Open Source / GNU ? here's an philosophy that is open, trusted and reliable. It's being adopted quickly by developing countries everywhere, I was in india recently and they were having Linux expositions all over the country. I think that providing a real alternative to Windows to developing countries, that get to spend their IT budget on actually training their staff, as opposed to just padding M$ 40billion dollar reserve - is a cause that is worth supporting.
Who cares whether APPLE CORP lives or dies ?? (well not me anyway) Their DRM philosophy sucks ass ... and I buy something off their iTunes site ... it turns out that I don't actually own it at all, it comes with licensing up my ass. 
... I also don't know how the article you refer to manages to equate PC = Windows ... it's hardly the only operating system running on the PC and Linux only gets one mention in passing. BTW PC hardware is NOT inferior to apple hardware.
Most hardcore, programming, network/security computer professionals use *nix whenever possible. As far as I see it, it goes something like this
*bsd for serving
*linux for working
*apple for latte drinking, orange-haired, GUI-designing types (no offence intended AF)
*windows for solitare
(in fairness though - windows only crashes in two ways ... regularly, and often
... funny, but probably not true )
also, why would someone send their windows machine in for "very expensive debugging and reinstalling the OS" ???
Wouldn't that kinda defeat the purpose of 'debugging' it in the first place ... and who debugs windows ???
... this guy considers himself a 10+year 'power user' and yet knows absolutely nothing about computers. It's the same case when your aquaintance asks you for help with her computer AF.
The "I can't help you, I use a Mac" argument kinda sounds a bit strange to me. Surely learning a little about what makes a computer tick, isn't beyond the capacity of a computer professional of any ilk ???? |
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mishlert
Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Location: On the 3rd rock from the sun
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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Though it's old news now, no-one in this debate has stated the obvious:
Apple to Use Intel Microprocessors Beginning in 2006
WWDC 2005, SAN FRANCISCO—June 6, 2005—At its Worldwide Developer Conference today, Apple�� announced plans to deliver models of its Macintosh�� computers using Intel�� microprocessors by this time next year, and to transition all of its Macs to using Intel microprocessors by the end of 2007. Apple previewed a version of its critically acclaimed operating system, Mac OS�� X Tiger, running on an Intel-based Mac�� to the over 3,800 developers attending CEO Steve Jobs�� keynote address. Apple also announced the availability of a Developer Transition Kit, consisting of an Intel-based Mac development system along with preview versions of Apple��s software, which will allow developers to prepare versions of their applications which will run on both PowerPC and Intel-based Macs.
��Our goal is to provide our customers with the best personal computers in the world, and looking ahead Intel has the strongest processor roadmap by far,�� said Steve Jobs, Apple��s CEO. ��It��s been ten years since our transition to the PowerPC, and we think Intel��s technology will help us create the best personal computers for the next ten years.��
��We are thrilled to have the world��s most innovative personal computer company as a customer,�� said Paul Otellini, president and CEO of Intel. ��Apple helped found the PC industry and throughout the years has been known for fresh ideas and new approaches. We look forward to providing advanced chip technologies, and to collaborating on new initiatives, to help Apple continue to deliver innovative products for years to come.��
��We plan to create future versions of Microsoft Office for the Mac that support both PowerPC and Intel processors,�� said Roz Ho, general manager of Microsoft��s Macintosh Business Unit. ��We have a strong relationship with Apple and will work closely with them to continue our long tradition of making great applications for a great platform.��
��We think this is a really smart move on Apple��s part and plan to create future versions of our Creative Suite for Macintosh that support both PowerPC and Intel processors,�� said Bruce Chizen, CEO of Adobe.
The Developer Transition Kit is available starting today for $999 to all Apple Developer Connection Select and Premier members. Further information for Apple Developer Connection members is available at developer.apple.com. Intel plans to provide industry leading development tools support for Apple later this year, including the Intel C/C++ Compiler for Apple, Intel Fortran Compiler for Apple, Intel Math Kernel Libraries for Apple and Intel Integrated Performance Primitives for Apple.
Intel, the world��s largest chip maker, is also a leading manufacturer of computer, networking and communications products.
Apple ignited the personal computer revolution in the 1970s with the Apple II and reinvented the personal computer in the 1980s with the Macintosh. Today, Apple continues to lead the industry in innovation with its award-winning desktop and notebook computers, OS X operating system, and iLife and professional applications. Apple is also spearheading the digital music revolution with its iPod portable music players and iTunes online music store.
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/jun/06intel.html |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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hypnotist
Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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Well, they're running the BSD kernel now. Makes sense to do it on Intel HW. I wonder what they'll do w.r.t. chipsets though.
Damn, I'd buy an iBook tomorrow if the 12" model came with a superdrive. But as it doesn't, it's PC hell for me. There's literally nothing out there that can come close on weight, battery life and appearance. DAMN YOU APPLE! |
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ulsanchris
Joined: 19 Jun 2003
Location: take a wild guess
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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| couldn't you get a seperate dvd burner for an ibook. |
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hypnotist
Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| ulsanchris wrote: |
| couldn't you get a seperate dvd burner for an ibook. |
Yes, but that rather defeats the object of getting an ultraportable with optical drive built in... |
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ulsanchris
Joined: 19 Jun 2003
Location: take a wild guess
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| spend the extra cash and get the 12 inch power book. or go bigger with the 14 inch ibook. |
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hypnotist
Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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I don't need to spend an extra $700 for the PowerBook. And I want a 12" laptop (13" at best).
Such is life. The Lifebooks from Fujitsu are looking nice. |
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the_beaver
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| hypnotist wrote: |
I don't need to spend an extra $700 for the PowerBook. And I want a 12" laptop (13" at best).
Such is life. The Lifebooks from Fujitsu are looking nice. |
For 12" I'm partial to the Lifebook or Vaio. But, money available, I'll go for the new Libretto at 8". |
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hypnotist
Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:44 am Post subject: |
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| the_beaver wrote: |
| hypnotist wrote: |
I don't need to spend an extra $700 for the PowerBook. And I want a 12" laptop (13" at best).
Such is life. The Lifebooks from Fujitsu are looking nice. |
For 12" I'm partial to the Lifebook or Vaio. But, money available, I'll go for the new Libretto at 8". |
Wow, that Libretto is sweet. Not at all practical for my kind of usage, but I want one anyway 
The Vaios are damn expensive (though the previous models are much more reasonable). Fujitsu it will be, unless uni give me a killer offer on the new IBM - or work let me buy this HP. |
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muggie2dammit
Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Location: Ilsan, Korea
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 8:08 am Post subject: |
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| Naruto wrote: |
PC hardware is cheap...why? Because it's crap components. Pre-built systems like Dell or HP are even worse with their integrated sound and graphics and their expandable 2 GB RAM. Apple = expensive but high quality components, the fastest RISC processing system, stabler OS, better RAM/Memory allocation, expansion to 8 GB RAM...Which would you choose? Quality or Price?
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Actually, for the cost of a good Apple, I can easily build a superior PC. That's because I know the components relatively well, and I have spent years custom-building systems. I would never buy a Dell or HP, simply because I know where they cut their costs, and that's in the worst places. Great for their bottom line, bad for the customer.
Tell me what you want, and the budget you want to spend on it, and I'll design you a system. And in most (not all) cases it'll kick Apple butt. In some cases the Apple will kick my system's butt, because there are some areas where Apple _is_ better, whether most PC buffs admit it or not. For games, it's PC all the way. And I like games.
Muggie2 |
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dbee
Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: korea
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:20 am Post subject: |
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The Developer Transition Kit is available starting today for $999 to all Apple Developer Connection Select and Premier members.
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... well I for ONE am pracitaclly coughing up my breadkfast trying to pay you to $1000 to port apps to your OS .... parties over apples ...  |
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BigBlackEquus
Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Location: Lotte controls Asia with bad chocolate!
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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| the_beaver wrote: |
Apple is still cashing in on its "we're not the big guy and the big guy is evil"
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Hey, beav, isn't this the wrong place for yet another "Canada is great, the US sucks" thread?
Just joshing ya.
I like Macs a lot, but I have a feeling we'll all be talking more about Apple selling music in a few years. I think they're positioned to cash in on that one more than anyone. |
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