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Babayaga
Joined: 28 May 2005
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 Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="ddeubel] I can't believe nobody mentioned his "Confessions"....great stuff and very , very human (as the OP mentioned). I love Tolstoy for his humane stance against all sorts of "*beep*" -- I kinda Slavic Voltaire....especially read his religious writings --really not religious in the sense of being preachy or biblical.....
As an aside, Tolstoy claimed loud and clear that his worst writing was both "Anna Karenina " and "War and Peace" -- he referred to them as "dribble" and soap operas... [quote]
Talk about a spiritual transformation! True, his works of the last period differ vastly from his earlier mature works. Don't forget that he wrote War and Peace and Anna shortly after his marriage and was in a euphoric mind--set with regard to marriage. But I guess it shows how people's views and philosophies change as they age/mature.
Last edited by Babayaga on Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:05 am; edited 1 time in total |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 4:27 am Post subject: |
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Finished "Anna karenina" and "War and peace" in my first year of being in korea.
Liked them both, but Tolstoy is far from being my favorite writer. |
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Kalhoun
Joined: 30 May 2003
Location: Land of the midnight noise!
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| death from above wrote: |
| Dostoevsky is so much better.. |
Agree, in regard to psychology. But Tolstoy still rocked! |
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batman
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Location: Oh so close to where I want to be
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| death from above wrote: |
| Dostoevsky is so much better.. |
What impressed me about Dostoevsky, with regards to his novel Crime and Punishment, is his ability to manipulate the audience. We are there in the beginning for the murder (gruesome as it was) and, yet, during the course of
the story we are hoping for the escape and unpunishment of Raskolnikov.
As far as Russian authors go, has anyone read The Fiery Angel by Briusov? |
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Hans Blix
Joined: 31 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 5:45 am Post subject: Re: Tolstoy fans ?? |
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| Babayaga wrote: |
| My favourite works are War and Peace , "The Death of Ivan Ilyitch" and Resurrection. |
privyet babayaga, vi ruski/aya?
i also like russian lit, and i've read tolstoy's 3 novels. there's definitely a unique talent to him, but there are parts of his books which are horrifically dull to get thru.
i remember nabokov's analysis of karenina going something like this:
levin, from the book
why must i struggle with the idea of god so much?
nabokov, commenting
why indeed, asks the careful reader.
still, don't think i don't appreciate the old war horse. he probably is the greatest novelist of all time. |
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Babayaga
Joined: 28 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:55 am Post subject: |
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Speaking Of War and Peace, has anyone read the sequel to it by Staroy Pierre and Natasha ? Apparently, Staroy isn't one writer but a group of writers who contributed to this book. It was written in the 90's, I think.  |
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Babayaga
Joined: 28 May 2005
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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What are your favourite movies based on Tolstoy's works?
Mine is a Soviet production of War and Peace. Great stuff.
I hated the American version made in 1956. Thought it was pretty dumb. |
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batman
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Location: Oh so close to where I want to be
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 5:31 am Post subject: |
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I agree. Watched the Soviet version several years ago. Not an easy thing to find. Completely hate the Hollywood versions of all of Tolstoy's work, especially of War and Peace. The people responsible for that travesty had no
idea what the book was about. |
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VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 5:38 am Post subject: |
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I think one has to be somewhat Christian to fully appreciate Tolstoy.
Dostoyevsky has a wider appeal however. |
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Babayaga
Joined: 28 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 7:54 am Post subject: |
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| batman wrote: |
| I agree. Watched the Soviet version several years ago. Not an easy thing to find. Completely hate the Hollywood versions of all of Tolstoy's work, especially of War and Peace. The people responsible for that travesty had noidea what the book was about. |
I also hate the Hollywood versions of Tolstoy's works. I agree that their version of War and Peace is a complete, idiotic travesty of that work. Another Hollywood movie I hate is Anna Karenina ---ridiculously watered--down and insipid treatment of an excellent work. |
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Babayaga
Joined: 28 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| VanIslander wrote: |
I think one has to be somewhat Christian to fully appreciate Tolstoy.
Dostoyevsky has a wider appeal however. |
Actually, I find Dostoyevsky's characters rather unpleasant and grotesque. But then I read that he himself was a very unpleasant person--bitter, envious and abusive. Also, he was quite prejudiced:there are lots of derogatory references to the Jews and other nationalities in his works.
As well, the subject matter in his works is for the most time gruesome.
I don't understand why he has a wider appeal.
Tolstoy is a much more human, understanding and sympathetic writer. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 3:46 am Post subject: |
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| death from above wrote: |
| Dostoevsky is so much better.. |
Amen...
War and Peace was interesting and well-written, but the determinist message and particularly the second epilogue are sloppily thought out. (I'll never forget his analogy of the Captain of a ship, and how he is supposed to watch every wave crash over the bow of the ship. This was in favor of his determinist view of history, except Tolstoy clearly knows nothing about seafaring or Captains)
But, I don't want to be unfair to Tolstoy, he has his virtues. Indeed, I would recommend War and Peace to any high schooler who was interested in reading, even if only as someone to get beyond.
| Babayaga wrote: |
| ddeubel wrote: |
I can't believe nobody mentioned his "Confessions"....great stuff and very , very human (as the OP mentioned). I love Tolstoy for his humane stance against all sorts of "*beep*" -- I kinda Slavic Voltaire....especially read his religious writings --really not religious in the sense of being preachy or biblical.....
As an aside, Tolstoy claimed loud and clear that his worst writing was both "Anna Karenina " and "War and Peace" -- he referred to them as "dribble" and soap operas... |
Talk about a spiritual transformation! True, his works of the last period differ vastly from his earlier mature works. Don't forget that he wrote War and Peace and Anna shortly after his marriage and was in a euphoric mind--set with regard to marriage. But I guess it shows how people's views and philosophies change as they age/mature |
Actually, I thought one of the great strengths of War and Peace was the description of Prince Andrew's last thoughts and sentiments. Becoming entirely detached from the world, one can become too harsh a critic of their own work in the passage into death. In a sense, the phenomena surrounding Prince Andrew's death could help explain away the significance of Tolstoy's deathbed renunciation of some of his works.
I, too, find Dostoyevsky more engaging and interesting. The only problem with Dostoyevsky, however, (if I may plagiarize Leo Strauss) is that he could only write about tragic characters, and he could never master a novel about a character who overcame his/her own deficiences to grow. |
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batman
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Location: Oh so close to where I want to be
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| Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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| VanIslander wrote: |
I think one has to be somewhat Christian to fully appreciate Tolstoy.
Dostoyevsky has a wider appeal however. |
As a person of non-Christian beliefs I would disagree.
The wider appeal of Dostoyevsky might stem from the fact that he concentrated greatly upon the darker side of life and people generally seem to find the greatest of interest in the lowest common denominator. |
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batman
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Location: Oh so close to where I want to be
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| Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Babayaga wrote: |
Another Hollywood movie I hate is Anna Karenina ---ridiculously watered--down and insipid treatment of an excellent work. |
Very, very true. |
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Babayaga
Joined: 28 May 2005
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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| batman wrote: |
| VanIslander wrote: |
I think one has to be somewhat Christian to fully appreciate Tolstoy.
Dostoyevsky has a wider appeal however. |
As a person of non-Christian beliefs I would disagree.
The wider appeal of Dostoyevsky might stem from the fact that he concentrated greatly upon the darker side of life and people generally seem to find the greatest of interest in the lowest common denominator. |
Very true. Indeeed, that's what I was going to say. The reason Dostoyevsky may appeal to a greater majority of people is because he wrote about the darkest,vilest human sentiments: greed, lecherousness, propensity for murder and other crimes, which is deeply fascinating to a human psyche,even if on a unconscious level. Look at all the programs on T.V. that focus on crime,murder,rape, abductions and their investigations: they greatly outnumber "cozy" family shows or other positive shows. |
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