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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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Privateer
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Location: Easy Street.
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 Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 1:24 am Post subject: |
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| manlyboy wrote: |
| I wouldn't underestimate the cunning of these kids, either. Kids are far more wily and manipulative than adults give them credit for. Often it is our attention that they are mostly interested in. |
I think they're quite blatant in their clumsy attempts at manipulation and clearly crave attention all the time. This makes them easy to manipulate. |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 2:59 am Post subject: |
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Yes, I actually think you guys are almost right, the problem is so many people now are not stopping where you guys are saying. They take the choice thing way to far. We call them children for a reason. I can see tzechuk's point, and while I said I disagree, after thinking more, I pretty much agree. The problem is I have seen how these theories are implemented and they almost never work. Unfortunately, it is impossible for current teachers to do a lot of these things with a class of 30 children by themselves. Now that I have pretty much said I was wrong and you guys are right after consideration...
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| (I wonder if it could be because of current MA Education or Psychology students creating all these new theories with little experience actually dealing with children). |
There is a growing problem of psychologists not necessarily making things up, but striving way too hard to make a name for themselves by diagnosing something new. The same with education theories (especially with special ed). I have found (and I do have experience here) that many people who just graduate with a BA in sociology or psychology and get right into their field think they really know a lot (let alone having an MA or PHd). Now this isn't the same with other disciplines from my experience (well, some, but not most).
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| And this is like the real world. If don't want to work on the database then you can choose not to. The consequence would be that your boss could fire you but you still have the choice. |
This is not true. If you have kids and no savings (a good number of people) it is not optional. In theory, yes it is. In practicality, you know it isn't  |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Privateer wrote: |
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| I still can't figure out what Koreans do to bring up such horrid little kids but (with a few but only a few exceptions) such nice teenagers. |
They do what's expected of them like kids everywhere.
Also the older they get the more they are obligated to interact with younger people, which means acting 'adult' towards them, and that increases their level of maturity. |
But they don't act 'adult' towards them at all - they treat them like children who have to be micro-managed. And they're not mature at all - socially they're years behind Western teens. I'll freely admit that I treat my middle and high school students like children. But they're so kind-hearted, nice, easy to manage, and downright adoreable, whereas so many little Korean kids are such selfish, out of control (and even violent) monsters. I really just don't get it. |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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I implemented a sticker system, and the only time my kids have ever cried is when I threatened to take a sticker away from them when they are bad The few times this hasn't worked, I just count down from 5 and things fall in line. This has only not worked a total of 4 times with grade 1's. This works with all my special ed students too.
But how about parenting (education systems are a whole other topic)? Obviously parents are doing something wrong. Look at North American society now. |
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khyber
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Compunction Junction
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| Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| The kids that often throw hissy fits do so because they've learned through their parents that if they do it hard enough, the adult will cave in and they can get what they want. |
That is undoubtedly true. But there are easy ways to head that off at the pass with parents.
Parents who remain lazy with their children and end up "caving" more often than not, don't really realize the extent of their DESTRUCTIVE reasoning that they are instilling in that child.
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| Kids are far more wily and manipulative than adults give them credit for. |
I don't think it's a matter of credit, I think it's a matter of effort on the adults' part.
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| Or at least, your prolonged, undivided attention on them and no one else is an acceptable substitute to what they originally wanted. And if you give them that, at the expense of the other kids, they learn that whenever they want that special undivided attention again, they just have to throw another hissy fit. In fact, they can throw hissy fits whenever they want because they know they can do so with impunity. |
So are you arguing that hissy fits are NOT stemmed from a dissatisfaction? Cause I disagree with that.
As has been told in that rather indepth example, SURE yelling to that kid to "sit down shut up and smile at your daddy" COULD have got that kid to shut up. But the fact it that it doesn't TEACH them anything. And when you're dealing with kids, you GOTTA remember that HOW you act, and everything about you is a LESSON.
When the jag explains her reasoning and WHY she shouldn't be angry, then the next time it occurs, it's simply a "oh remember..it's not your turn now".
Kids are ALLOWED to be pissed off. Yelling at them ain't gonna STOP them from being angry for some relatively silly reason. And THAT is what you want to happen: You want them to think about if their anger is justified, as opposed to simply telling them that expressing their anger is inconcequencial to their own life. |
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