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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Phoenix
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
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 Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2003 11:21 pm Post subject: |
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"I've ordered a laminator from the United States."
You know, some laminating plastic and an iron works just as well  |
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kylehawkins2000
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2003 12:19 am Post subject: |
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FYI: There are lots of laminators available in Korea. Why order them from the states? THe cost of shipping must make up for any savings you get by buying from the States.
Lavender: If you're planning on coming to Seoul there are lots of bookstores with English books for teaching ESL. I know Ulsan also has at least three ESL bookstores....which would lead me to believe that just about any city you end up in in Korea probably has a store that supplies the local Hogwans with English books (assuming you're not in a really small place of course.) |
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Lavender
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2003 7:55 pm Post subject: Thanks all |
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Hello,
Thanks for your posts! Appreciate it very much |
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indytrucks
Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Location: The Shelf
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2003 8:48 pm Post subject: Re: Lavish... |
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| Austin wrote: |
For starters, you have to understand the nature of sites like this one. The majority of the people that post here regularly have not adjusted well to Korean society, as they spend their free time on the Internet, rather than experiencing Korea. Moreover, people that have established a healthy social structure in Korea are extremely unlikely to care to spend their spare time posting how successful and great their life is. Therefore, you are left with a very unbalanced and unrepresentative slice of the true experience that is Korea.
You say you have a question for all of those “teachers out there,” but you will likely only receive responses from the likes of those that I described above.
Do you really want to take advice from people that are negative and have nothing better to do than complain about everything in life?
Admittedly, some of the stuff that I read here makes me laugh. I wonder how it must be for some people to be so miserable with their lives that all they can do is moan and complain.
People are not treated any differently here than any other part of the world in general. There are always going to be exceptions wherever you go, so you will have to really understand the entire story to appreciate what truly happened in many of the cases that you will read about on this site.
I have always asserted that much of the poor treatment that occurs here is earned here. People are seldom arbitrary and random in their actions, most of the time we are very deliberate. The fact that some foreigners here have failed to learn basic social and cultural practices, speaks to why conflicts arise.
For example, if your employer hires you site unseen, and upon your first face-to-face meeting they are short and cold to you, you might have a potential problem. Depending on how you are treated in the following days, you will know one important fact; either they do not like your “look” or your “feel,” or they do. However, the rub comes because most people’s egos could never comprehend the former as an option. It is compounded, because Koreans tend not to be confrontational, so rather than being straightforward and saying “I don’t like you,” they will treat you poorly until you quit.
Certainly, I can come up with examples as the days are long, but the key to your success will depend on your ability to understand your environment, interpret what is happening, and take action that will further your cause in a selfless bent. Egos are the cause of half of the conflicts of the world, while the environment causes the other half. If you want to avoid these conflicts, then you need to stroke those egos around you and create a safe environment for your colleagues and supervisors. If you fail to do either, you may suffer the consequence of bruising another's ego or contributing to the formation of a hostile workplace.
True Machiavellians thrive in Korea. The clever and shrewd will post no complaints or compliments, as the last thing they want is to invite attention where it is neither wanted nor welcome!
SCSA |
I, for one, would like to loudly, earnestly applaud Austin for an eloquent and concise description of the majority of maladjusted foreigners that a)populate this board and b)populate the cities of Korea.
If the original poster is after useful, objective advice on Korea, this IS NOT the place to look. |
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jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2003 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| So which regular posters out there want to admit being part of that "majority who have not adjusted well to Korean society"? I admit it without hesitation. I will never adjust well to living in this country. I doubt the majority of Koreans are adjusted well to it either. The crowdedness, the noise, the competitiveness are all pretty severe. The mentality is different than back home for sure. But congratulations to all you well-adjusted people in Austin's minority group. |
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kimcheeking
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2003 4:57 am Post subject: |
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| tomato wrote: |
I've ordered a laminator from the United States.
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You can buy a laminator at costco for about 125,000won. |
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waterbaby
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Location: Baking Gord a Cheescake pie
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| Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2003 5:06 am Post subject: |
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| jajdude wrote: |
| So which regular posters out there want to admit being part of that "majority who have not adjusted well to Korean society"? I admit it without hesitation. I will never adjust well to living in this country. I doubt the majority of Koreans are adjusted well to it either. The crowdedness, the noise, the competitiveness are all pretty severe. The mentality is different than back home for sure. But congratulations to all you well-adjusted people in Austin's minority group. |
That's a pretty funny post, jajude! It's a change of perspective.
I must admit (now that you have) that even though I've married a Korean, I know I'll never fit in here. I know I'll never master the language. I know I'll never completely understand the culture. I know I'll always miss drinking water straight from the tap, Aussie BBW's, surf beaches, good (and cheap) wine, my friends and my family.
As much as I love being here, I'll never adjust to raw meat served on the table that I have to cook myself, the 24x7 noise that has recently started to interrupt my sleeping pattern, corn on pizza, having tiny fingers probing my arse on a regular basis and feeling pretty helpless and unresourceful when it comes to fending for myself.
My new slogan this week is "Hell, I'm not adjusted to Korea, but I'm gonna love it anyway." |
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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2003 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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I guess I should change my nom de plume to 'some malcontent' then.  I've been here almost 2 years, and the longer I'm here the more I wonder what on Earth I'm doing.  Having hated Korea from day one, I have a question for those of you who say that you "love it here".
Did you always love it, or did it take a few years for you to develop a taste for Korea and things Korean?
The reason I ask is because I am trying to decide if sticking it out any longer here is really worth it.  What I mean is, will I still be this unhappy with my life if I decide to stay another year or two?
Perhaps it's a question only I can answer, "quien sabe?"
Hangeneul ban gap sumnida..... or something like that.
cheers  |
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Austin
Joined: 23 May 2003
Location: In the kitchen
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| Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2003 6:35 pm Post subject: To answer your question... |
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Yes, I loved it from day one. However, please understand that I came here to study the language, as I had studied it back home and made some university friends from the U.S. that were Korean. Moreover, it was not my first time to live abroad.
In other words, I was not the typical "teacher" type that just jumped on a plane for the first time and traveled to a country that they knew nothing about from day one.
Anyway, I do not know you, but I doubt that a person can come to love a place if after two years they still hate it.
Best of luck on your search.
SCSA |
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waterbaby
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Location: Baking Gord a Cheescake pie
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| Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2003 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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I loved Korea the moment I got here. It's so quirky... and there's something here that matches my Australian underdog sensibilities.
After my first contract, I tried living in China (checking out the greener grass), went to Taiwan and worked a Winter Camp to check out the job scene... and I came back to Korea. I've been back for just over four months and I still love it. Sure I have my days... but I work for some really lovely people that look after me and I'm married now, so have the support of my guy too.
The people that I've met that have initially hated it here, continue to hate it... Some Waygug-in... not giving you much hope for things to change, eh? Hopefully some of the long timers will respond will something more positive to your question. |
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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2003 3:29 am Post subject: |
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No this isn't the first country I've worked in, but perhaps that's part of my problem. I was in Mexico before here and I guess that's why I can't find much joy here. (other than money) I'm always compairing this place to Mexico, (not that Mexico was perfect, if it were I'd still be there) it's just that I found Mexico so very interesting, warm, fun, exciting, the people were easy to get to know, open, friendly etc. The language was easy to learn, the culture is awesome. (too bad I couldn't make any money there though)
This place is none of the above.
Sure, there are things here that are better than Mexico, money, banks that are honest, easier access to health care, computors etc.
But what a stressed out freakin' place! Everyone's running around trying to out-do the next guy, bragging about how much money they make, what a wonderful teacher they are etc. No one seems to give a damn about anyone else.
If I had known then what I know now, I would have stayed in Mexico.
Cheers |
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Thomas
Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2003 7:05 am Post subject: Re: Korean treatment of teachers--is it just foreigners? |
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| Lavender wrote: |
Hi all,
I have a question for all those teachers out there: does the "negative" treatment of teachers by Korean schools, directors, and administrators, only apply to FOREIGN (ie: non-Korean nationals) teachers? or have you noticed that, not being paid, being let go without any notice to save paying severance payments etc, something that happens to Korean english teachers as well? Also, do you think this kind of treatment is the NORM in Korean business practise?
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To add some input on the original topic... my wife is a Korean public school teacher and shares many stories with me. Korean teachers get the same last minute notification (so when you do, don't jump on the messenger, please), last minute changes, forced to work extra hours for free, asked to do things above and beyond their 'job description', and sometimes don't get paid on time or for the full amount. So, why don't we see them complaining?
1. Culture - it is not polite nor accepted to question your boss. They have been put in that position because they were chosen by someone higher than you for some reason. Don't question that. Do what you are told. (This is why when you have been "wronged", your co-teachers are more apt to side with the boss.)
2. "What comes around..." - Many Korean teachers aren't worried about the extra time they put in or the extra tasks because they know that when it comes time for promotion, the boss will choose his most loyal followers. Also, money comes around. Teachers will tell you they don't get much pay for their long hours... that's right. However, they don't tell you about the bonus pay, supplemental pay, money from parents (and parents' organizations) and so on. Most Koreans are aware that if they work as they are supposed (i.e. without complaining), they will be recognized and rewarded down the line.
3. Not everything is black or white -Look at the hours teachers work... there may be a schedule but it isn't necesarily followed. Teachers MUST do what the boss says. As long as it appears they are doing what they are supposed to, the boss looks the other way... hence the occurances of drinking and eating parties at school, lots of trips and generally 'laziness' (it's not really laziness, but puting in the hours without doing something all of the time... appearance is important.)
For those reasons above, the best way to deal with a problem in Korea is with not the way many of us are trained to... we like to complain loudly and take it to the top. It's far better to mention the problem to your co-workers and ask them how to deal with it. Don't tell the boss... you'll look disloyal and cause him to lose face. If you scream and yell... you lose face and they will laugh at you. Work behind the scenes but ALWAYS appear professional and hard working... make sure you are seen (strategically... especially be seen working when the boss comes in), ask for advice from seniors (you don't have to follow it), and do what you are told (at least in appearance). Then, when you have a problem, it will be resolved quicker than if you cry and complain loudly. |
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Austin
Joined: 23 May 2003
Location: In the kitchen
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2003 7:41 am Post subject: Thank you... |
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Thomas:
No doubt you have and will go far in Korea. I have been trying to state the same thing for many years, but not many seem to understand what you so tactfully posted.
Some waygun:
What is the use of comparing two separate experiences?
Socrates had it right when he stated:
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| He who is not contented with what he has, will not be contented with what he doesn't have. |
I hope you can come to accept ever experience in life for what it is, as opposed to what it is not.
SCSA
Last edited by Austin on Thu Jun 12, 2003 6:45 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Mosley
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 4:41 am Post subject: |
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| SCSA: You seem to have an affinity for Socrates, and perhaps a desire to imitate him. Wasn't he forced to drink a cup of hemlock? Hmmm... maybe things are looking up.... |
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Austin
Joined: 23 May 2003
Location: In the kitchen
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| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 9:22 am Post subject: Thank you... |
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| Quote: |
| The attempt to silence a man is the greatest honor you can bestow on him. It means that you recognize his superiority to yourself |
SCSA
| Quote: |
| The moment we begin to fear the opinions of others and hesitate to tell the truth that is in us, and from motives of policy are silent when we should speak, the divine floods of light and life no longer flow into our souls. |
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