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| is your contract in any way at all illegal? biggest to smallest infractions. |
| yes |
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40% |
[ 15 ] |
| no |
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45% |
[ 17 ] |
| probably |
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8% |
[ 3 ] |
| i don't care |
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5% |
[ 2 ] |
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| Total Votes : 37 |
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Message |
TexasPete
Joined: 24 May 2006
Location: Koreatown
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 Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2006 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Vollrath wrote: |
if you go ahead and contact the labor board, then you face unpleasant consequences that far outweigh the benefit of being "right"... such as
+dirty looks and shovelling $H!T for the rest of the year
+crazy schedules that meet labor law, but are of the utmost inconvenience
+the worst classes ALL the time
+possibly even being fired for some fabricated reason (after all, we KNOW they pull lots of "parental complaints" out of thin air)
even if we speak the language (as i can fairly enough) we hold NO water when it comes to defending ourselves should the owner decide to play nasty.
maybe the tax thing is the only thing the government will really care about because it causes THEM loss of revenue. otherwise, i'm not convinced the labor board gives a hoot about whitie X at hagwon Y. like if the contract stipulates "dinner break is only 20 minutes" instead of the standard 30, it's too small an infraction for them to care. and yes it's not a life-threatening or ball-busting infraction, but it's just that--an infraction. contracts are LITTERED with little things like this all the time and people don't even realize it. sometimes the academy owners themselves don't even know the law!! what they need is for the government to supply the hagwon with standard issue contracts that EVERYONE gets, let them change hours or wage, but leave all the rest the same. that way they also ensure that proper taxes will be deducted. |
Well I wouldn't keep working there after that. I'd find another job. Done it before and I'd do it again if I had to. Obviously it's a hassle, which is why I now work at public schools, which tend to be a lot better on the whole.
Bottom line: If the teacher agrees to sign an illegal contract it is the teacher's fault. Why anyone would agree to sign a contract without being aware of the labour laws and doing at least some research continues to amaze me.
And like I said, you don't have to contact the labour board or tax/pension departments. You can use the threat of that as leverage. No pension, okay but then no 'bad' classes. |
And where should or would a teacher go to find out if there's something illegal about a potential contract? The nearest lawyer? The "Legal Eagles" of DavesESL who almost never seem in conjecture on anything? Let's face, it's dawgone difficult to know what is and isn't legal about labor law in any foreign country, let alone this one.
Somethings i will admit are the teacher's fault. They should make sure they get their health insurance card or at least know enough to know they should receive a physical piece of paper that says they're insured. If a teacher wants private accomodation, make sure that's in the contract. If you don't want split shifts, please specify.
None of those have to do with legal rights though. In other words, none of these things that a potential teacher does have control over cover the legal rights of an employee such as minimum 10 days paid vacation, pension percentage witheld or taxes.
Hogwan owners have practically made it an artform, screwing us over and the cards aren't exactly stacked in our favor here to begin with. It's not always a case of a teacher not knowing enough or being some ignorant jerkface which many here seem to ascribe to any teacher that gets screwed over. |
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braunshade
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Location: Somewhere better!
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| Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Koreans are by nature a bunch of backstabbers who enjoy screwing people. They always will be too. |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 6:23 am Post subject: |
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| I wouldnt say 'all Koreans' But I would definately agree with "all hogwan owners" |
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teachingld2004
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 5:23 pm Post subject: legal |
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There is a definate fine line between "legal" and "fair". WHen a teacher complains, there can be lots of things a hogwon owner can do.
For instance, let us say you sign a contract for 3o hours a week. (yes, yesI know all about contrcts that consider one class an hour,and another will have a 60 minute hour).
So, you are a complainer. Then the boss gives you 30 hours, while the other teachers teach 25. Is this fiar? No. But all of you have the same contract, so do you have the right to complain?
I worked in a school where the worst teacher had 6 hours less then the rest of us. We complained. Why did that teacher getl ess hours? We were told the teacher was not a good one, so the teacher had less hours so he had less contact with the students. Moronic, but that was what we were told.
When we sign a contract, and it gets changed "just a bit" by the school, we can complain. (and some us us do, and other do not) There is not a thing we can do IF WE WANT TO KEEP THE JOB.
Get a new copy of your sealed transcript. Go back to Japan. Get a new apartment. Pay for the moving fee. (some times the school will pay)
Perhaps the new job will not start right away. You will not get paid for your time off. You might get a job that is worse.
Of course you should complain if you are getting screwed a lot, but some times it is better for you to stick out your contract and shut up. Note I said "some time", not all of the time. |
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buymybook
Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Location: Telluride
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| Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| Quote: |
| you're wrong--people who signed to and agreed to illegal clauses in their contracts are (unless the clause says to rape and murder children) bound to fulfill whatever crazy crud the boss says they have to do. |
Not true at all! If your contract says income tax will be deducted at 5% and the going rate is 2% then thats not income tax! Its quite easy to contact the revenue department and get a statemtent on your taxes! Believe you me! These guys will go after a crooked hogwan owner about errouneous tax rates!
Same goes for clauses that violate the labour standards act...contact the labour board and they will also notify the schools to cease and desist or face fines!
Its stupid to agree to bad clauses and its even stupider to try to live with them for an entire year! |
Have you been to the Korean tax office to seek information on your account? I went there to ask for information on my account, they had none even though my hogwon director had held out approx. 660,000 Won for 11 months of taxes.
They told me many hagwons directors do that, they didn't care!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They helped me fill out my taxes but were not interested in where I worked. They did not want to know, if fact they would not put the name/address of the hagwon on my tax form.
I was with a Korean friend at the time. They set me up with a password where I was told I could go online and check my taxes in the future.
I tried, the password didn't work. I was going to go online and input the Hagwon name/address myself.
I owed money(approx. 50,000 Won) and didn't pay because I was fired illegally and didn't really have any to spare at the time. I found a job the next year and my employer filled out my taxes for me. I received money back and the money the tax office said I owed them from the previous year was not held out in my Jan. 06 tax return.
I'm sure they conveniently lost my tax form which I placed in the tax form box after I signed it. I wasted freaking hours trying to be an honest citizen. Honesty is NOT the best policy in Korea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If I learn anything from living in Korea it will be how to LIE, CHEAT, and STEAL.
The TAX OFFICE don't care, or at least the one I went to didn't. In their eyes I was just a pain in the ARSE to them. A Korean going down because of a foreigner ain't looked upon kindly especially when a Korean(whether government employee or not) is needed to help simply because of the language factor. |
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Buymybook- agreed. I suspect that other businesses in Korea are run the same way. Plus, cheating foreigners evidently doesn't seem to bother many Koreans, no matter how much good we do here for the kids and their futures. |
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Cheonmunka
Joined: 04 Jun 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jun 11, 2006 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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When Iask people about where I can pay taxes and get involved with doing the right thing I hear, "Why do you bother?"
Luckily I can pretty much do things my own way.
I would hate to be in a position where the hakwon owner was taking 5% and keeping it and I couldn't get a return on it.
I'd be quite angry.
You were proactive but somewhere it fell apart.
Better luck next time.
I guess it's all about luck, really. Good school, bad school...
At least the best you can do is try. I think that's where the backbone bit came from. And when failure hits you several times, you are still gaining vital experience that will come to assist you somewhere in the future. |
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sadsac
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Gwangwang
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| Posted: Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:02 am Post subject: |
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I know mines good, I wrote it.  |
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