Korean Job Discussion Forums

[captain kirk]

my experience was similiar to chi chi's. i worked six months at a chain hagwon and had a great time. however, unlike korea, had to look around on my own (friend's girlfriend helped me out, and i lived at their place for two weeks and she also helped me get the job; she's a taiwanese) ie. without the free apt. to slip into as in korea. tax is 20percent for the first six months, but the difference after the standard 8percent is reimbursed IF you do not leave the country for six months. another complaint is the thirty day visa upon entry. two months is possible but it's rare. with korea, as canadian, it's six months tourist. so a person gets a job, then leaves taiwan again; a trip to h.k and back. it IS a flooded market for english teachers, hagwon (called bushibans there) owners very sure of themselves, knowing you can be easily replaced. but all these complaints didn't come up until the second working period there. the first i was comfy. another thing i found irksome that second working visit was, when looking for a postion, discovering that (mostly in the southern areas) wages were lowered by south africans willing to work for less. what chi chi said, 'never get angry, lose face and they will want to destroy you', is beam on. that's very UNlike korea, where venting is natural breathing. one way teachers get around things is to work while 'studying chinese'. agencies will sell you a chinese class which you needn't even show up for, and a relatively generous amount of visa time comes with it. generally, it's a little foxier, with twist and turns. here it's just plonk on in to a one year working visa. it's mostly teaching kids. a lot of kindergarten but with more of a class mode than the pitching in a few learnuns' here. the taiwanese seem to want to get them fluent as early as possible.
so the first time was great, settling right into a big, reliable franchise via it's decent branch. the second time was more of a job search which was fraying, then working in a public school program. that was decent too, but i found venting is really taboo. it's hot there, HOT. hotter than a snake's belly in a wagon rut. snorkling and diving are better, mountains and vegetation more exotic. sub-tropical. it's so hot they have a bizarre seeming sport; climbing waterfalls with mountaineering equipment and all wet.

[Patong Dong]

Another popular option in Taiwan is just getting a multiple entry tourist visa and then just hitting schools on your own and picking up hours. It's not legal but there were quite a few people doing it that way at my last school in Taichung. Some did not have degrees, but others chose that route because they avoided the 6 month 20% tax and they wanted to take mini-holidays when they had to do their visa runs.

Chi Chi I was not disputing that your experience could have been different than mine. I was only objecting to the absolute rules you put down. And sure, public transportation is not as good as Seoul or Pusan, but in Taichung it was no different than what I had available in JeonJu. Not everyone is Korea lives near a subway line, I hated the bus system in JeonJu. You had to be sure it was your bus and basically run with a mob and try to hop on as they briefly slowed down at stops.

You're right about the Chinese not helping out if you're lost, a mixed blessing, I couldn't look around for a washroom in Seoul station without some well meaning Korean coming to help me. But as you mentioned Japan, they will be the same as the Chinese, I spent a half hour walking around a large Tokyo train station looking for some English sign and not a single person offered to help. I expected them to be like Koreans in that regards but they walk with eyes firmly planted on the ground.

[Mankind]

Panthermodern you thinking of leaving now? My best friend did Taiwan for 3 years and Korea for 2. Asked him all the questions you're asking now. If you want any info, give me a call, and I'll pass on what he told me.

HAND

[Zark]

I've done two tours of duty in Korea and one in Taiwan.

I worked in Taiwan for 18 months and loved it. I found it easier to live there than in Pusan. My net SAVINGS, by the time all was said and done
was perhaps 25% less than Korea - but still substantial.

Some very real (and very nice) differences with Taiwan:
VERY pro-American Pro-Canadian
You can advertise for private classes - no fear of immigration on this
I taught all adult private classes there - no kids at all!
A much greater awareness of the world at large
Even more beautiful countryside
Easier to travel to SE Asia and beyond
More recreational opportunities beyond singing and drinking

BUT!
Less college/univ vacation time
College/Uni jobs are harder to come by (lots of PH.Ds working there)
Lanuage is difficult to learn
It is a more complex culture where favors are counted and called

Overall, I found the Taiwanese VERY friendly and helpful people and the culture fascinating.

I've lived in numerous countries, and with the exception of Thailand (but can't make decent money there), Taiwan was the best.

[chi-chi]

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[captain kirk]

zark said, 'it is a more complex culture where favours are counted and called'. i got whacked with that right in the door the second time around. it was the working for the public schools job, and the standard we contracted for was about six hours a day. i was fast off the mark during the two week orientation and the program head took me aside and said, 'i'd like to offer you some extra work, after your standard hours three days a week. two hours teaching three classes of high school girls'. i baulked. he said, 'you've got the mojo', which was funny from a taiwanese. he also asked me because i was to be a sub, getting paid full hours for waiting by the phone at my apt. in case somebody of the teaching staff of forty got sick (and a lot did, taking advantage of the safety net set up, in spite of 'having to get a doctor's note' ) in korea if the boss asks you to do extra work, you say no, and i didn't know how i'd feel after doing the standard some days. that and a stubborn class of highschoolers at the end of a day with elementary...so i said 'do i have a choice?'. he looked funny, like i wasn't 'functioning smoothly', then said jauntily, 'of course'. well i don't think he forgot that 'refusal', even though it was presented as an option. during the term i met those who had stayed a second year, been there long before me; they met with the boss from time to time in groups for dinner and such like he was their patron and they were his loyals. the return teachers were all SMOOTH, slick, and presenting aspects of pleasant social face. i was never 'in' with the top guy after that, from a distance he looked at me in an amused way, like i'd dumped myself. so zark is spot on, from my experience above.
zark says there are more recreational opportunities than norebang and drinking. yes. the taiwanese don't seem to drink a lot, at least not as much as here. they are really family oriented, extended family i mean, and like TEA. yeah, bizarre. personally, zapped on caffeine, who has time for tea!
and re; 'foreigners'. there is no sense of zone or force field you are carrying around you, differentiating you in the eyes of the populace like here. it's more like being ignored, and in a good way, like just one of the gang. korea is known as 'the nation of politeness'. if you stop and look at the subway map for ONE second a college student will whisper to her friend and come over and ask if you need help, or some businessman, or anybody. in taiwan maybe they assume you know what you're doing, having got there in the first place.
as an aside, the teachers i talked to said 'if you want to see the 'real china' it's not in taiwan, but in china'.
they love america and the west, and they love japan. it's funny, i saw a christmas special on tv and thought they like america so much because it's a way of squidging away from big momma china which is so threateningly possessive about taiwan. and funny because there is no snow, only in the high interior mountains, and there at the very tops, even in summer. big mountains. schoolkids are FASCINATED by snow. being from canada it seemed weird and marvellous. i wish i'd brought some scrapings from the freezer or some crushed ice from 7-11 to class to 'show them some real snow from canada i had sent over'. they'd have been hilariously rocked. they are softspoken and the men are gentle. they are not macho. which is something different if you're hopping over from here. i was shocked. being with a taiwanese woman is no problem to the guys there. they seemed to lead with humility. favours and counterfavours. very smooth/subtle ways. face is important just like here, but no venting, ever, destroys the form, wipes it out. then you'll be destroyed, for some odd reasons it seems to a person.
they are proud of their ancient chinese culture, and at the back of their mind seem to think westerns are 'barbarians' in comparison. those taiwanese that compare. but there's no staring, bristling, etc. based on you not being taiwanese and a westerner. calm they are. very into groupthink, too. and it hustles and bustles like korea physically, but with inner calm. faces are soft, relaxed, not taut. buzzing on scooters like they're sofas, born on them.
man, i really hope you land well and enjoy. cheers

[itchy]

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[chi-chi]

Oh I forgot to mention the Taiwanese are pretty tame when it comes to partying-agreed-they are more into burgalries (can't spell today! Upset about my diploma) and gambling, gang related activity and shit.
But the expats there are completely nuts compared to the ones here-they're wild-I refer to the above "Spring Scream" that Itchy mentioned.
Korea's the place to go if you want rehab, um, Taiwan's not.
Chi-Chi