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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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 Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Zaria32 wrote: |
Joinme...
What twaddle... |
Your 61 years old and on Dave's trying to impress a bunch of 20 year olds with words like "twaddle." What I say may be silly, but you are just plain sad. If you are going to insult people with condescension on Dave's, be prepared for it to come right back at you. Veiling your insults in obscure words may work on Korean children (much to your pleasure) but I think everyone on Dave's has been using an online dictionary for years. Congrats on your latest technology discovery. |
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Zaria32
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
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| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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So you're bothered enough to look me up? Yikes! Also, you must have looked up an old post as I'm turning 63 (western age) this month.
And frankly, I didn't know that you wouldn't understand a word such as "twaddle," and it semed so perfect... |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Adventurer wrote: |
| Join Me wrote: |
Adventurer,
As I told you, your attitude is the problem. In Korea people bump into you without saying "excuse me" and some of the police are corrupt. Welcome to Korea. If you are expecting either to change for you...you have a long wait ahead of you. From the sounds of it though you are going to last about six months more (tops) before Korea spits you back out on the shores of the land of the free and the home of the brave. You'll be missed for sure but don't loose any sleep over it cause there is always another self righteous foreigner willing to come over and educate Koreans on how to best live their lives in their own country. See...now there is something we Americans do well! |
My attitude is the problem? Well, your opinion is in the minority over here.
Dude, if a woman and her children simply walk into me, not simply just bump into me, they are not acknowledging me another human being.
It is not simply bumping into people. People walk around here in many cases as if others simply do not exist on the Confucian pecking order.
If your attitude is, well this is Korea, then the stuff you were complaining about the US one can say to you "It's America, love it or leave it".
If someone bumps into me, I don't care.
However, if you walk into me or hit me in the gut with your shoulder, I won't brush it off as culture. You can do that if you want. Waiting forever not to frantically call a mother in the same building when her son is in danger can't be explained away by the lack of Good Samaritan laws.
Look, you are the one getting into the petty insults, and I am older than
you, and I've been to far more countries. Second of all, I laughed when I read about you saying that I would last six months in Korea. I've been here already for 2 years and a few months.
I've survived teaching the ghetto. I walked through a terrorist hot bed of Egypt with a friend, because she wanted a shortcut, and I wanted to help her out, and I can blend enough with the languages I know. I have had to Labor in Korea, and I was helped by some decent people from the immigration office in Daejeon.
There are people who do right, and I support those people, but you are making excuses for the ones holding the country back. I know there are cultural differences, but, the Koreans themselves don't all simply like the rudeness.
Anyway, you still didn't address that thousands of cops don't care to do anything. You keep avoiding that one. You just say it is what it is.
But then you won't do that with America and say America is what it is.
How about some consistency, pal? By the way, you are assuming Koreans all want things to be the way they are in Korea and don't want change just like many Americans do want change. People want better lives, and the stuff I've mentioned, Koreans have told me anyway. I am not self-righteous, I just buy into blind nationalism, government corruption, police apathy. If you do, then good for you. |
So you have been in Korea for two years on your mission of cultural imperialism spreading the virtues of American culture to the peasants. How noble of you. It is obvious you are intolerant of the fact that other cultures have a right to conduct affairs as they please. You want your lawyer on retainer so you can sue everyone. You wan't everyone to say "please" and "thank you." You want your beloved Starbucks on every corner. Hello! You want to live in America. What in god's name is keeping you here? Is self pity and cultural arrogance that rewarding? |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Join Me wrote: |
So you have been in Korea for two years on your mission of cultural imperialism spreading the virtues of American culture to the peasants. How noble of you. It is obvious you are intolerant of the fact that other cultures have a right to conduct affairs as they please. You want your lawyer on retainer so you can sue everyone. You wan't everyone to say "please" and "thank you." You want your beloved Starbucks on every corner. Hello! You want to live in America. What in god's name is keeping you here? Is self pity and cultural arrogance that rewarding? |
You are sounding like Steve Schertzer who said the same things about America, and he had not one thing to good to say about the United States just like you. This is not about American culture. You don't seem to read, son. I was born in Canada, lived in several countries all over this world and can speak several languages. I don't think having the police doing their job and caring to do their job is about American culture, now is it? They do that in Singapore, Germany, France, and Turkey.
I don't go to Starbucks, pal. I go to this Korean cafe that has Brazilian, Yemenite, Guatemalan, Kenyan, and Costa Rican coffee. However, nice try. I will go to Starbucks once in a while. You keep going on putting words in people's mouths, because they don't agree with you, and the you call others arrogant? It sounds like you have the problem. If you aren't Steve, you surely sound like his twin brother. No, I don't expect Koreans who bump into me to say excuse me, but you better not walk into me. I don't think American culture is that great in many ways.
I just expect to be dealt with like a human being as an equal, to get paid on time, get what's written in a contract etc.... These are international standards that even sane Koreans agree with.
Cultural imperialism? Incidentally, Korea is working hard to improve certain things. They don't want to remain stagnat as you seem them to want to be. You want America to change, but not Korea. I expect Italians to be Italians, Kenyans to be Kenyans, but I also expect international standards, laws to be followed. If you don't, it's your right. The UN happens to agree and made reports on all these things.
With your logic, if the Phillipines has all kinds of problems it is because the people want it that way. I disagree. Would I want Korea to take some things from our culture? Yes. Would I like the US to learn from some parts of the East? Yes. I believe cultures should share.
I am for cultural exchange, mutual assistance, and international standards. It's a global era. |
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Zaria32
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
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| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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Join Me, I'm not sure I've ever read posts on here that put so many unsaid words in another's mouth, or probably unthought thoughts in another's head, as your posts do. And there seems to be no basis except your own desire to trivialize what your opponent is saying, or perhaps your own inability or unwillingness to more carefully explain your own position in a controlled, and adult, fashion.
I agree with some of what Adventurer is saying and disagree with some of it....but your attitude makes it difficult to even try to understand your point of view.
It seems to me that you make extreme and unjustified statements, then egregiously attack those who disagree, bringing the dialogue to hitherto unknown, and undesirable, levels.
If your "style" of communication is then criticized, absent a more valid criticism, you just start slinging nasties. |
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ultra
Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Location: Book Han Gook Land Of Opportunity
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:50 am Post subject: |
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Main Entry: 1twad�dle
Pronunciation: \ˈtw�-dəl\
Function: noun
Etymology: probably alteration of English dialect twattle idle talk
Date: 1782
1 a: silly idle talk : drivel b: something insignificant or worthless : nonsense <that idea is pure twaddle>
Sounds good to me, and it's not a personal insult, it's a description of the author's words. |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 4:20 am Post subject: |
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| Adventurer wrote: |
| Join Me wrote: |
Adventurer,
As I told you, your attitude is the problem. In Korea people bump into you without saying "excuse me" and some of the police are corrupt. Welcome to Korea. If you are expecting either to change for you...you have a long wait ahead of you. From the sounds of it though you are going to last about six months more (tops) before Korea spits you back out on the shores of the land of the free and the home of the brave. You'll be missed for sure but don't loose any sleep over it cause there is always another self righteous foreigner willing to come over and educate Koreans on how to best live their lives in their own country. See...now there is something we Americans do well! |
My attitude is the problem? Well, your opinion is in the minority over here.
Dude, if a woman and her children simply walk into me, not simply just bump into me, they are not acknowledging me another human being.
It is not simply bumping into people. People walk around here in many cases as if others simply do not exist on the Confucian pecking order.
If your attitude is, well this is Korea, then the stuff you were complaining about the US one can say to you "It's America, love it or leave it".
If someone bumps into me, I don't care.
However, if you walk into me or hit me in the gut with your shoulder, I won't brush it off as culture. You can do that if you want. Waiting forever not to frantically call a mother in the same building when her son is in danger can't be explained away by the lack of Good Samaritan laws.
Look, you are the one getting into the petty insults, and I am older than
you, and I've been to far more countries. Second of all, I laughed when I read about you saying that I would last six months in Korea. I've been here already for 2 years and a few months.
I've survived teaching the ghetto. I walked through a terrorist hot bed of Egypt with a friend, because she wanted a shortcut, and I wanted to help her out, and I can blend enough with the languages I know. I have had to Labor in Korea, and I was helped by some decent people from the immigration office in Daejeon.
There are people who do right, and I support those people, but you are making excuses for the ones holding the country back. I know there are cultural differences, but, the Koreans themselves don't all simply like the rudeness.
Anyway, you still didn't address that thousands of cops don't care to do anything. You keep avoiding that one. You just say it is what it is.
But then you won't do that with America and say America is what it is.
How about some consistency, pal? By the way, you are assuming Koreans all want things to be the way they are in Korea and don't want change just like many Americans do want change. People want better lives, and the stuff I've mentioned, Koreans have told me anyway. I am not self-righteous, I just buy into blind nationalism, government corruption, police apathy. If you do, then good for you. |
Putting words in peoples' mouths...sure. You absolutely reek of cultural imperialism and it seems your superiority isn't just targeted to those outside of your own country. Though it is clearly targeted towards those outside of the elitist culture you believe you are a part of.
So how was your time in the "ghetto?" Whether you realize it or not the community you lived in, which you elect to white wash over with your elitist general isms, actually had a name. Something tells me the members of that community didn't refer to it as "the ghetto" as you and your fellow cultural imperialists did. What exactly was the generalized term you used to describe the people who lived in this "ghetto." Hmm...I can only imagine.
Why do you keep saying things like this which give me more to rip on you about? I will tell you why. Because you were born into elitism and it is so ingrained in you that you can't even see it. You think it is your right to debase others communities by describing them as "the ghetto" just as you feel it is your right to try to educate Koreans on manners.
Just remember, when you leave Korea, try to remember the name Korea. Telling all your fellow cultural elitists that you contributed to the advancement of the 3rd World may sound more admirable (at least in your circle) but Koreans won't appreciate being referred to as 3rd World anymore than those from your past appreciate your "ghetto" references when speaking of their communities.
Now, all the little elitist apologist come to the rescue! |
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Ilsanman
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Bucheon, Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:38 am Post subject: |
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That's 3 more people that dialed 911 for him than for Michael White, and they didn't wait for him to die first.
| Join Me wrote: |
| Gopher wrote: |
What about these facts?
| Quote: |
| ...four people dialed 911 within a minute of the accident, and that Torres received medical attention shortly after that. |
In any case, I have seen similar situations, not usually so traumatic, of course, everywhere I have lived. The threshold that usually finally provokes people to intervene in this or that situation seems to be quite high.
People like our friend here, Join Me, seize on such stories to lauch into morally superior tirades. But when they, for example, hear people talking on their cell phones in the cinema or what-have-you, I wager that 19 out of 20 lack the courage to actually stand up and say something about it -- and that is just in the movies. |
So four people dialed 911 and then let an old man lay in the street alone until EMS arrived. Afraid their "Latte" might get cold while they actually get involved? That is a heartwarming story of human compassion. I guess he should be thankful for that though. |
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The Bobster
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 9:38 am Post subject: |
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This thread has been the most pointless rehashing of old grievances I've come across in a long time ... and more often than not I myself am the target of of those kind of resentments that really oughta just be left to drip gently off one's back.
At least Ilsanman even mentioned the article in the OP. Personally, I don't see the parallels soe people seem to be drawing to the Michael White affair. Completely apples and oranges from the get-go, seems to me. |
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Ilsanman
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Bucheon, Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah well, with guys like Steve...I mean Join me around, that's what we get.
| The Bobster wrote: |
This thread has been the most pointless rehashing of old grievances I've come across in a long time ... and more often than not I myself am the target of of those kind of resentments that really oughta just be left to drip gently off one's back.
At least Ilsanman even mentioned the article in the OP. Personally, I don't see the parallels soe people seem to be drawing to the Michael White affair. Completely apples and oranges from the get-go, seems to me. |
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Zaria32
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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Wait, wait, I'm confused...
Is there some indication here (cultural imperialism etc) that Join Me may be Steve Schertzer? Really? REALLY? REALLY???
Mr. I'm So Superior to all other ESL teachers?
Mr. I Believe in Discipline in the classroom?
Mr. Screwy Ideas?
Mr. Sure I Hit My Students sometimes?
Mr. Unbelievably Condescending to other teachers?
THAT Steve Schertzer? If Join Me is the aforementioned self-righteous so'n' so, well, how about learning:
a little bit about how to structure an argument...
a little bit about disciplining your own mind...
a little bit about discipline of self...
a little bit about behaving as an adult...
And Join Me, if your aren't S.S., I do sincerely apologize... |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 11:21 pm Post subject: |
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I watched the video, and I wasn't so schocked, to be honest. It happened in the ghetto. I have seen all kinds of stuff covered up in the ghetto.
Shocking stuff happens in neighborhoods all the time.
I remember not far from where I was working some punks hit a daycare with their care and stuff and when some got out, they were laughing. Unfortunately, really bad stuff that happens in those areas is ignored.
Many are used to seeing lots of violence and bad stuff over there. This is not to say someone from the ghetto or a bunch of people wouldn't help each other, they would, but the ghettos and the people in them have been forgotten by America in my opinion. One guy when asked about parts of LA said it was like the third world but without the hope. His comments didn't make it on air. It is still shocking in a way, but, in a way, it is not. Surviving in the ghetto is not easy. One of my colleagues had to stay in hospital for months after being assaulted by a gang member when he was trying to save this girl at a school. Horrible things happen in some hoods.
So much stuff gets covered up in the hood. This is a story that basically made it to the news. I guess someone had a camera. |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Your obviously feel perfectly fine with your opinions on other groups of people and think it is alright to judge them and tell them how to live. Your entitled to your opinions ...now go pester someone else with your cries of victim hood. |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Zaria32 wrote: |
Wait, wait, I'm confused...
Is there some indication here (cultural imperialism etc) that Join Me may be Steve Schertzer? Really? REALLY? REALLY???
Mr. I'm So Superior to all other ESL teachers?
Mr. I Believe in Discipline in the classroom?
Mr. Screwy Ideas?
Mr. Sure I Hit My Students sometimes?
Mr. Unbelievably Condescending to other teachers?
THAT Steve Schertzer? If Join Me is the aforementioned self-righteous so'n' so, well, how about learning:
a little bit about how to structure an argument...
a little bit about disciplining your own mind...
a little bit about discipline of self...
a little bit about behaving as an adult...
And Join Me, if your aren't S.S., I do sincerely apologize... |
Many of you seem to know this person intimately, was this your cult leader or something? Is there some bed hopping going on amongst you folks? On second thought, I don't think I want to know to be honest. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:22 am Post subject: |
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| Join Me wrote: |
| Zaria32 wrote: |
Wait, wait, I'm confused...
Is there some indication here (cultural imperialism etc) that Join Me may be Steve Schertzer? Really? REALLY? REALLY???
Mr. I'm So Superior to all other ESL teachers?
Mr. I Believe in Discipline in the classroom?
Mr. Screwy Ideas?
Mr. Sure I Hit My Students sometimes?
Mr. Unbelievably Condescending to other teachers?
THAT Steve Schertzer? If Join Me is the aforementioned self-righteous so'n' so, well, how about learning:
a little bit about how to structure an argument...
a little bit about disciplining your own mind...
a little bit about discipline of self...
a little bit about behaving as an adult...
And Join Me, if your aren't S.S., I do sincerely apologize... |
Many of you seem to know this person intimately, was this your cult leader or something? Is there some bed hopping going on amongst you folks? On second thought, I don't think I want to know to be honest. |
Steve, your glorifying of prostitution on the net and on here is another thread, your ranting about anti-capitalism, your ranting against Starbucks is like the rant you had in the Korean Herald about McDonald's spoiling Asia by coming here. Oh no! Koreans are going to eat Mickey Dee's!
How awful! And that anti-imperialism rant sounds is really typically Steve Schertzer. Okay, so you go on these seeming communist like rants, but it is because of capitalism that the Koreans want you here. That's interesting isn't it? |
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