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Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Underwaterbob

Joined: 08 Jan 2005 Location: In Cognito
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Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| Hyeon Een wrote: |
| It seems that 100% of the population's ancestors were Yangban. I understand there is obvious shame in being the descendant of a slave or a butcher, but it's kind of odd that everyone is a yangban. |
I don't understand why there should be any shame for that. It's not like the current generation had anything at all to do with their ancestors being slaves or yangban. Too bad my attitude on that isn't widespread here. |
This has got me curious. I asked around a bit and found out that all the common family names (박, 최, 이, 김, 한, 심, 정...) are descended from yang-ban, or at the very least important people of some kind (military leaders, rich merchants etc). The only family names I've managed to discover that are descended from low class families are Ma and Pi (마, 피), and in my school of nearly 1000 students, I'd be surprised if there were more than five 피s and any 마s at all (I've never met one). Compare that to probably half of the school being either 이s or 김s.
Did all the low class families die off? Was there a mass changing of names at some point in the past? Did the low class families all somehow manage to marry into high class families? The rest of the world seems to show us that generally the lower class the family, the more offspring they have. The Koreans I've asked don't seem to know. |
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toph
Joined: 10 Jun 2010
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Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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@jvalmer
Well, both 전 and 천 can be romanized into "Chun." But whatever, since they're both last names in Korean.
As for the previous poster...
You're correct in saying that these people descended from yangban, but not ALL of them have. The common family names, as I explained before, were adopted as a quick response by the people during King Tae-Jo's reign. During his time, he mandated the use of a surname, and many yangban created the common family names (e.g., Kim).
But at the same time...many of the commoners went with these family names as well. So just because someone today has the last name Kim, doesn't necessarily mean they were descended from one of the original yangban, or does this mean they've descended from one of those commoners. It's kind of hard to tell as there's no differentiation in the last name. The person would have to do extensive family research to see if they were really tied to yangban. That is, if they wanted to find out.
So for the very popular names in Korea (e.g., Kim, Park, Lee, Choi...), these were first adopted during King Tae-Jo's time by BOTH common and nobles families. There wasn't any differentiation between the social classes as far as last names were concerned, and that's why it's so hard to tell today if a person is a descendant from yangban--especially if they have a common name. But, the basic point is just because they have a common name doesn't mean they descended from common people. Also, the common names did not originate with one person, but rather they originated at the same time with several un-related families. Thus, the huge amount of people with the last name Kim, for example. |
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nautilus

Joined: 26 Nov 2005 Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
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Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 2:39 am Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
Did all the low class families die off? Did the low class families all somehow manage to marry into high class families? The rest of the world seems to show us that generally the lower class the family, the more offspring they have. The Koreans I've asked don't seem to know. |
Koreans may or may not know, or are possibly ashamed to divulge the history.
The yangban owned thousands of slaves (the common people) which they habitually raped and abused..or kept as concubine.It took centuries before slavery was abolished (mostly by the Japanese i believe).
Owing to the Korean obsession with class and social status...most people then creatively re-invented their ancestry. hence everyone claiming to be descended from royalty nowadays.
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| One of the interesting aspects of pre-modern Korean history is the existence of a huge number of slaves, perhaps averaging 30% or perhaps 40% of the population for the Chosŏn dynasty. As I read about this for my class and we had our discussion of it today, I found that there seems to be considerable resistance in Korean historiography and amongst many Koreans towards using the �S� word with all its negative connotations. |
http://muninn.net/blog/2005/04/nobi-rescuing-the-nation-from-slavery.html
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| Korea had a very large slave population, ranging from a third to half of the entire population for most of the millennium between the Silla period and the mid-18th century. Most of the Korean slaves were indigenously generated. |
http://www.britannica.com/facts/5/388206/Korea-as-discussed-in-slavery-sociology |
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