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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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Fraser
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
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 Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:54 am Post subject: |
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| Modernist wrote: |
Hear this, all the would-be teachers panting like dogs to live in Seoul at all costs? My God, the SUBWAY is the best they can come up with? Talk about a backhanded compliment. Even New York doesn't really talk up its subway, and it is 100X more authentically historic and interesting [albeit filthy] than Seoul's [read the book 722 Miles, it's fascinating].
I mean, think about it. What do they really have? Certainly no architectural landmarks or distinctive neighborhoods ['look kids! Over there is one of I'Park's 8 complexes of 7 identical concrete block towers. And just across the street, if you can believe it, is one of Hillside's 12 complexes of 9 identical concrete block towers! See, there's the orange one in front of the green one!']. Oh, there's N Seoul Tower, which is pitiful compared to Shanghai's Oriental Pearl, Tokyo's Sky Tree, or Guangzhou's TV Tower. There's Korea's tallest, uh, 63 City? 38K for, um, well, something...compared to Shanghai's WFC, Taipai's 101, HK's ICC, etc etc.
There's the Five Historic Palaces, or whatever, which have some fraction of the appeal of Beijing's Forbidden City or Tokyo's Imperial Palace. But why would any tourist choose the former over the latter?
Museums? Not world-class. Zoos or aquariums? Not world-class. Symphony, opera, theater? <cough, cough> But hey, there's always deafness-inducing DRUMMING...
There's the grand central public space and beautiful park...oh, wait. There's the active, energized riverfront...oh, wait. There's the lively cafe culture bringing to mind Vienna or Zurich...oh, wait. There's the quiet, tree-lined streets with gracious, well-kept historic homes beckoning you for a stroll...oh, wait.
Oh, of course. How could I forget? There's the SHOPPING. Mall after mall after endless department store stuffed to the gills with junk. Lotte and Shinsegae and Hyundai and I'Park and COEX and Mesa and on and on. AND the 'traditional' markets, if you like to have to haggle for your junk on top of trying to find it. Solution, Korea! Just show a global map of credit cards: 'Seoul. Shopping, Unleashed. ' |
I've been in Seoul a week and can understand what you're saying but good grief, you lay it all out there, don't you? If anyone has a hard time slinging mud at their enemies they can come to you.
I'm looking forward to fall and spring, I hear Korea is beautiful at this time. Consider the nearby hiking, adventures to Buddhist monasteries, checking out the local sports scenes (speed skating, World Cup venues, soccer games), and going on the KTX train to Busan - all things I'm looking forward to doing. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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I love the "economists" of Dave's...
Why would anyone in Cambodia want their country to be like Korea??? Surely they would rather continue to live in squalor and have no major companies to speak of than be major players in nuclear power, shipping, computers, telecom, and automobiles and have ugly concrete buildings.
I'd take ugly buildings anyday if it meant my country could have those things.
But then again, it's the Koreans who are superficial, not the waygooks who can't see beyond a concrete building. 
Then we get the people who rant and rave about the won. Sorry, but the won should not revolve around NETs being able to change their won into their home currency.
Weak currency makes people buy your stuff. People buying your stuff ensures employment and job opportunities.
Or you could have a strong currency and then have to go to a country with a weak currency to find a job. Ahem. |
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nukeday
Joined: 13 May 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Yeah, so many jobs available for Koreans thanks to the weak won..... |
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pugwall
Joined: 22 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Asians love to go to Korea because of the Hallyu |
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pugwall
Joined: 22 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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Asians love to go to Korea because of the Hallyu stuff. Korea is a huge draw for people from Asian countries. I think its hard for expats who have never lived in another Asian country to properly gague how big Korean entertainment is. They have culturally colonized a continent. Asian tour groups want to go to Chuncheon because of 'Winter Sonata'.
Literally every Filipinio, Thai, Chinese, Taiwanese, Japanese girl I know is obsessed with Korea and dreams of visiting today. That they will be dissapointed when they come is another matter. However, Korea has done an excellent job of marketing itself.
Why would they care about spending time on a handful of whiteys for whom their isnt much her of interest for? |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Modernist wrote: |
I sincerely hope that nowhere else in Asia lets its cities turn into Korea-style concrete-block ghettos. They would be better-served looking at all the progress China is making in design in dozens of cities, the immaculate Singapore, the sparkling Hong Kong, the charming frenzy of Bangkok...almost anyplace else in Asia, really.
The biggest problem in Korea with buildings is their refusal to bring in globally capable architects and designers. Instead, everyone has to be Korean, and Koreans just haven't demonstrated the originality to create first-rate stuff. The Chinese hire Paul Andreu to design their performing arts center, the Koreans...well, have you ever stepped inside the pitifully derivative Sejong Center? Look at the magnificent Shanghai World Financial Center [American], or the brilliant CCTV Building in Beijing [Dutch], compared to the mediocrity in Jongno and Gangnam. For God's sake, the freakin' Bangladeshis--barely solvent--spent more than 10 years getting one of the 20th century's best parliament buildings from the genius Louis Kahn. The Koreans, right at the same time [1975], dumped out that huge ugly block of concrete nothing on Yeouido--but it IS the biggest parliament building in Asia, so...I guess someone should care?
They need to recognize it's more important to get the best, than to get something done by a Korean. Otherwise they end up with Seoul, 2011--Come see our subway system! |
I'm not literally talking about Korea's architecture, I'm thinking that Asians want to see what an affluent society would be like, hence the reason wanting to visit places like Korea or Japan. These two societies are culturally much more similar than Europe or North America. |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| pugwall wrote: |
| Literally every Filipinio, Thai, Chinese, Taiwanese, Japanese girl I know is obsessed with Korea and dreams of visiting today. That they will be dissapointed when they come is another matter. However, Korea has done an excellent job of marketing itself. |
Kind of like how I'm usually disappointed seeing all the world's great wonders. They are usually much smaller than what they look like in the picture. |
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tiger fancini
Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
Why would anyone in Cambodia want their country to be like Korea??? Surely they would rather continue to live in squalor and have no major companies to speak of than be major players in nuclear power, shipping, computers, telecom, and automobiles and have ugly concrete buildings.
I'd take ugly buildings anyday if it meant my country could have those things.
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Cambodia also has a problem with smelly-hippy-backpacker-types, who must be kept out of Korea at all costs. |
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Tamada
Joined: 02 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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| pugwall wrote: |
Literally every Filipinio, Thai, Chinese, Taiwanese, Japanese girl I know is obsessed with Korea and dreams of visiting today. |
A bit of an exaggeration to say the least.
Nevertheless, I've done my bit to spread the word to my overseas Asian friends, telling them how rubbish the place is, meaning they'll now choose to go to Japan or elsewhere instead.  |
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pugwall
Joined: 22 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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Korean facial products are also a massive draw to Asian women. They are a lot cheaper in Korea than in other places.
Hallyu tourists are quite happy to go shopping all day in Myeongdong, visit the set of some crappy drama, photo themselves wearing Hanboks like in Dae Jeong Gum, photo themselves eating bibimbap like they do in dramas, buy ginseng and go home. Stuff that would make your avergae bignose weep like a little girl.
Seriously travel in Asia, turn on the TV. Just Korean drama, Korean drama,Korean pop music or those stupid stupid Korean gameshows or localized versions of the Korean gameshows. Not saying any of it is good but its hard to say that Korea is not a huge draw for tourism in Asia |
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Modernist
Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: The 90s
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| I'd take ugly buildings anyday if it meant my country could have those things. |
| Quote: |
| Asians want to see what an affluent society would be like, hence the reason wanting to visit places like Korea |
Missing the point. Is Korea the only model of becoming affluent in Asia? No. So for poor places like Cambodia, Laos, parts of Indonesia, etc, the question is why look to Korea [and Seoul, specifically] as a model, when Koreans have done such a poor job COMPARED TO other Asian countries and major cities?
Are you really going to argue that Cambodians, of all people, would look to Seoul instead of, I don't know, Singapore, which happens to be right on their doorstep? Singapore is cleaner, has far better architecture, better food, more cultural diversity, is a destination for travelers, on and on. THAT is a model for the poorer countries. Not even to speak of Bangkok, which is really the capital of SE Asia--I'm quite sure Cambodians would pick there over Seoul if you asked them about the future of Phnom Penh, with its lovely architecture and historic neighborhoods and character that Korea can only envy.
Japan is a model [did you think Korea thought of the KTX on its own?]. Hong Kong is a model. The wealthiest cities in China, like Guangzhou, are becoming models as we speak. Korea, and Seoul, are NOT models of development for anyone in this hemisphere, and their lack of a global identity proves it. Hyundai and Samsung and big shipyards don't add up to a place the world wants to go, or be. Buy their stuff, sure. But there's more to life and living than swiping a credit card. At least, if you DON'T live in Korea. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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| nukeday wrote: |
| Yeah, so many jobs available for Koreans thanks to the weak won..... |
You do realize that a strong currency is a bad thing for an export driven economy right?
Do you even know what having a strong and a weak currency means? |
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free1439
Joined: 28 Apr 2011
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Modernist wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I'd take ugly buildings anyday if it meant my country could have those things. |
| Quote: |
| Asians want to see what an affluent society would be like, hence the reason wanting to visit places like Korea |
Missing the point. Is Korea the only model of becoming affluent in Asia? No. So for poor places like Cambodia, Laos, parts of Indonesia, etc, the question is why look to Korea [and Seoul, specifically] as a model, when Koreans have done such a poor job COMPARED TO other Asian countries and major cities?
Are you really going to argue that Cambodians, of all people, would look to Seoul instead of, I don't know, Singapore, which happens to be right on their doorstep? Singapore is cleaner, has far better architecture, better food, more cultural diversity, is a destination for travelers, on and on. THAT is a model for the poorer countries. Not even to speak of Bangkok, which is really the capital of SE Asia--I'm quite sure Cambodians would pick there over Seoul if you asked them about the future of Phnom Penh, with its lovely architecture and historic neighborhoods and character that Korea can only envy.
Japan is a model [did you think Korea thought of the KTX on its own?]. Hong Kong is a model. The wealthiest cities in China, like Guangzhou, are becoming models as we speak. Korea, and Seoul, are NOT models of development for anyone in this hemisphere, and their lack of a global identity proves it. Hyundai and Samsung and big shipyards don't add up to a place the world wants to go, or be. Buy their stuff, sure. But there's more to life and living than swiping a credit card. At least, if you DON'T live in Korea. |
I'm not sure where all this rage/anger/generally-pretentious-jack-kerouac-reading-hippy-BS attitude came from, but I find it comical that you would consider any of these cities as "models." I will now go and bash each of them for you.
Hong Kong, was a British colony and major import/export area for many years. Was basically managed as a city-state which easier to manage than an entire country.
Singapore. City-state. Grand total of 5 million people. Easier to manage than a whole country.
Mainland Chinese cities. Cannot access Facebook (which is a God-given right). Major human rights violations. Much easier to build nice, neat things when you tell people to STFU and get out.
Tokyo. I admit that they have a nice society and nice city, but now have nuclear and power issues from not properly assessing the risks of nuclear power. A good portion of the country is effectively uninhabitable for a good while.
Given those factors, I think Seoul doesn't look too bad. I admit there are some growing pains and pretty big eye soars around town. This notion about credit swiping or whatever dribble you are trying to utter is non-sense. I'm not sure if it is jealousy or nativity. But generally, this is how people act when they go from being very poor to generally middle-class. It's the same thing in China. |
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flakfizer
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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| free1439 wrote: |
I will now go and bash each of them for you.
Hong Kong, was a British colony and major import/export area for many years. Was basically managed as a city-state which easier to manage than an entire country.
Singapore. City-state. Grand total of 5 million people. Easier to manage than a whole country.
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Oooh. Take that HK and Singapore. Consider yourselves bashed. |
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Modernist
Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: The 90s
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| nearly meaningless, incoherent babble |
I may be having a slow day, but not slow enough to spend much time responding to a posting of this 'quality.'
I will point out some modest, obvious flaws in your response which I am quite sure will be wasted on you.
I was speaking of Seoul, not Korea, based on the original article starting this thread. So observing HK and Singapore are city-states [thank you, Captain Obvious] is irrelevant. Seoul is a city, not a country, and with over 10 million people and the vast majority of political and financial resources of an entire developed nation at its disposal, it hardly wants for resources. Despite this wealth, it's quite mediocre in many areas, as noted by the original article, especially compared to many of its immediate regional neighbors.
Chinese cities are worse because you can't access Facebook? I hope you didn't use too many brain cells on that piece of 'thought'. The PRC human rights issue has limited relevance--Hong Kong's SAR has all the nice human rights protections you could ask for and they still create 'nice neat things.'
Tokyo; this part of your posting is so incoherent I'm really not going to bother.
IF you really look at Seoul, it is clear that a huge proportion of its attraction and attention is spent on shopping of one type or another. Every neighborhood is described based on what you can buy there. Once the consumption orgy is over, what's left? In Seoul, very little. If you really think it's world class, well, based on this post I'm not surprised. But facts are stubborn things. |
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