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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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 Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 12:38 am Post subject: |
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| everything-is-everything wrote: |
| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
And what exactly is it that the American Embassy is supposed to have been able to do within the laws of both the US and ROK that they have not done? Why should they bear blame and for what?
| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| PatrickGHBusan wrote: |
Let this topic sleep people, whats the point of debating this here? |
I think that is the issue, her son died and she was told to let the topic sleep because there was no point in talking about it. That works with a lot of things here, but I don't see it working with a woman that lost her son. Most skeptics are demanding she provide documents and hard evidence, but apparently she isn't being provided with any help in obtaining them. I would put most of the blame with the USA embassy here, not the Korean government. I'm surprised people are so skeptical with hakwons and other issues here, but an incident that seems as shady as this one is just dismissed. Has anyone actually read an account of a witness? I can't really find any hard facts on the case, and in my opinion that isn't her fault, she isn't the one that should be conducting the investigation. |
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They should bear the blame for not providing clarification for everybody. I don't know what to think about this incident because all I can find is a bunch of gossip. Everyone says she is crazy, but where is something - anything - official to show that she is making all of this up? It isn't easy to just not talk about it either, and it isn't the first case of an American dying here when the cause was never really determined (or just made clear). I'm not saying murder, or foul play, I'm just saying because this has made the news, and will not improve relations between citizens of both countries, it is something the embassy should address. It seems like every few years there is an incident like this here, and it always seems to be the same old story.
If people want to put this to rest, how about linking to a story that actually gives the full picture...and what the final outcome was? I can't get a clear idea of what happened, I am trying to say that is the problem.
Until we can get a clear picture of what happened on that day, why would we forget about this? Why would we just "not talk about it"? seriously? |
Care to provide any specifics why foul play may have been involved? |
Care to provide any specifics at all that have been officially released by the Korean or United States Goverment regarding this? I don't have any official information, that was my point. All I have is what she is saying. I can't call her crazy or a liar when I have nothing that actually contradicts her story aside from people moaning and officials blowing this whole incident off from both countries.
I already said I was not stating murder or foul play was involved, however, the circumstances of the death were strange so is it too much for a mother to ask for someone from the embassy to look into it? Maybe help translate documents, clarify laws, inform her of the actions she can and can't take? Isn't that their job anyway? From what I see she is completely on her own on all of this, and maybe if the officials and people involved showed a little consideration and initially helped her figure out what happened, we wouldn't be talking about this at all.
This doesn't happen frequently, but it isn't the first case of a death occurring here where a family is left in the dark. People get suspicious when a death happens and details are not provided. I personally think this is just due to a lack of communication between officials, but if it was my family member I would make sure I knew exactly what happened too. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 2:00 am Post subject: |
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| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| I already said I was not stating murder or foul play was involved, however, the circumstances of the death were strange so is it too much for a mother to ask for someone from the embassy to look into it? Maybe help translate documents, clarify laws, inform her of the actions she can and can't take? Isn't that their job anyway? |
No, that is not their job. This is their job in the case of the death of an American citizen in Korea.
Let me explain something to you: it is an offense in this country to falsely accuse someone of a crime. Do you care to guess why nobody's bothered to sue Stephanie White? Here's the answer: it's because the people she's libeling/slandering/falsely accusing are not the heartless bastards she seems to believe they are. |
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definitely maybe
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 2:34 am Post subject: |
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| northway wrote: |
| Are parents who send their kids to boarding school inherently irresponsible? |
If life in the dorm is still as crazy as it was when I was in high school, then yes, perhaps they are! |
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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 4:40 am Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| I already said I was not stating murder or foul play was involved, however, the circumstances of the death were strange so is it too much for a mother to ask for someone from the embassy to look into it? Maybe help translate documents, clarify laws, inform her of the actions she can and can't take? Isn't that their job anyway? |
No, that is not their job. This is their job in the case of the death of an American citizen in Korea.
Let me explain something to you: it is an offense in this country to falsely accuse someone of a crime. Do you care to guess why nobody's bothered to sue Stephanie White? Here's the answer: it's because the people she's libeling/slandering/falsely accusing are not the heartless bastards she seems to believe they are. |
"After receiving word of the death of an American citizen in Korea, the Embassy is responsible for notifying their next of kin, if they are not already informed. We can also assist the family with:
understanding their options and navigating local regulations
making arrangements for disposition of the remains
serving as conservator of the estate when the next of kin is not in Korea
overseeing the disposition of the remains
preparing and sending the next of kin signed copies of the Consular Report of Death of an American Citizen Abroad to help them settle legal and estate matters in the United States. This document is in English and is based on the local death certificate."
UNDERSTANDING THEIR OPTIONS AND NAVIGATING LOCAL REGULATIONS...that is what I am talking about. Yes, I see the word "can" which means it is not required, however, given the circumstances maybe it would have been a good idea. Maybe the State Department should issue a travel warning about the saunas in Korea, I had no idea they were so lethal.
I am not an expert on this case, and I don't want to be. I am just trying to make the point that this issue won't be put to rest until someone other than Stephanie White comes out with a conclusion. If that never happens then so be it, but expect the issue to come up periodically, just like the other situations that have occurred here in the past that were never really resolved. Chalking it up to bad parenting and telling people to move on isn't going to work.
If she is defaming the owner of the sauna or the people that were in there then they should sue her. I don't think that would make them heartless. Take her to court, get the facts out. Maybe afterward she will finally accept the settlement money.
Does anybody have an article or a link that actually explains what happened? Not from her or from a media outlet that is speculating, I mean someone that actually interviewed other people that were there, etc.... |
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tardisrider
Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 4:42 am Post subject: |
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[quote="hiamnotcool"
I already said I was not stating murder or foul play was involved, however, the circumstances of the death were strange so is it too much for a mother to ask for someone from the embassy to look into it? Maybe help translate documents, clarify laws, inform her of the actions she can and can't take? Isn't that their job anyway? [/quote]
Embassies may provide lists of translators and English speaking lawyers, but when it comes to actually taking part in investigations, embassies have absolutely no authority. In fact, conducting or participating in investigations regarding (potential) criminal matters (involving their nationals as either perpetrators or as victims) is not only beyond the capabilities of an embassy but antithetical to their very reason for existence. |
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eventually
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 5:07 am Post subject: |
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didn't hear about this case, but will say:
i know that hot tubs and saunas usually have warnings about not using them if you have a heart condition. i don't know if they do here. perhaps a case could be made on that account. but it isn't a stretch at all to think that the kid just collapsed. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 5:09 am Post subject: |
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I am not an expert on this case, and I don't want to be. I am just trying to make the point that this issue won't be put to rest until someone other than Stephanie White comes out with a conclusion. If that never happens then so be it, but expect the issue to come up periodically, just like the other situations that have occurred here in the past that were never really resolved. Chalking it up to bad parenting and telling people to move on isn't going to work.
If she is defaming the owner of the sauna or the people that were in there then they should sue her. I don't think that would make them heartless. Take her to court, get the facts out. Maybe afterward she will finally accept the settlement money.
Does anybody have an article or a link that actually explains what happened? Not from her or from a media outlet that is speculating, I mean someone that actually interviewed other people that were there, etc.... |
Not to be insensitive, but given the outlandish nature of her claims, I think the onus is kind of on her to provide some kind of evidence. She tells her version of her son's death as if it's incontrovertible fact, despite the fact that everything she claims is ridiculously speculative. I'm sorry, but I need to see some evidence if I'm going to believe that a group of Korean teenagers randomly murdered an American kid. |
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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 5:17 am Post subject: |
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| tardisrider wrote: |
[quote="hiamnotcool"
I already said I was not stating murder or foul play was involved, however, the circumstances of the death were strange so is it too much for a mother to ask for someone from the embassy to look into it? Maybe help translate documents, clarify laws, inform her of the actions she can and can't take? Isn't that their job anyway? |
Embassies may provide lists of translators and English speaking lawyers, but when it comes to actually taking part in investigations, embassies have absolutely no authority. In fact, conducting or participating in investigations regarding (potential) criminal matters (involving their nationals as either perpetrators or as victims) is not only beyond the capabilities of an embassy but antithetical to their very reason for existence.[/quote]
I was referring to the section of what the embassy does in the case of the death of a US Citizen. They help the family with understanding their entitlements and what the regulations are. As posted above.
You are both right though, I am exaggerating the embassies role, I don't really know what they can do in this situation. Let me get my foot out of my mouth before I choke. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| The Cosmic Hum wrote: |
| Zyzyfer wrote: |
| The Cosmic Hum wrote: |
| Sauna's require caution. |
Oh my. Oh dear. You of all people abused the apostrophe? 
Oh and to stay on topic I agree with PatrickGHBusan 100%. Can't believe this was resurrected. |
dohhhh...2am...it was 2am!!!! 
Agree with you and Pat...why was this thread resurrected? |
Quite likely a trolling attempt... note the OP hasn't posted again in this thread. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| UNDERSTANDING THEIR OPTIONS AND NAVIGATING LOCAL REGULATIONS...that is what I am talking about. Yes, I see the word "can" which means it is not required, however, given the circumstances maybe it would have been a good idea. Maybe the State Department should issue a travel warning about the saunas in Korea, I had no idea they were so lethal. |
Are they any more lethal than saunas/pools/spas in other countries?
I figure them all to be full of hazards. |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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| Posted: Mon May 28, 2012 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| everything-is-everything wrote: |
| Pablo wrote: |
I had not heard about this incident before, but watching the mother's videos, it's pretty clear that what happened was more than an accident. Multiple witnesses came forward to tell her so, even though they wouldn't go on record with the police for fear of their own lives.
(Tragic) accidents are convenient for guilty people, and also for people who don't want to get emotionally involved.
The take-home message for me is a stark reminder that, much as I dislike the word, we are in a *foreign* country. And that always has the potential to be very dangerous. |
What conspiracy are you referring to? |
MAFIA COVER UP, YOU WANT I SHOULD DRAW YOU A PICTURE? |
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