Korean Job Discussion Forums

[nate1983]

Some good comments here. As for the original question, I would definitely say foreigners in Japan and China typically speak the language better than in Korea. I was actually pretty impressed with the general ability in both countries. In Shanghai I remember having an address written down in Chinese and I asked the nearest caucasian girl if she could read the address and she quickly told me the pronunciation and how to get there.

One of the explanations is that Koreans actually speak more passable English than Chinese or Japanese. I couldn't imagine living for years in one of those countries without speaking the local language, but many people seem to make do in Korea. And as has been mentioned, China and Japan have been more important politically and economically, thus more reason for foreigners to learn the language.

I guess I'm a foreigner who speaks "decent Korean" (graduated from SKY language program and have passed TOPIK level 5) and I've known a fair number of westerners at my level or higher. However, like some others on the thread, I used to get a lot of bewildered looks or asked to repeat myself even when I was sure I pronounced everything well. One thing you have to keep in mind is that the tones and stress in Korean are very important (although not explicit as in Spanish, Chinese) and a native speaker is used to hearing not just the sounds 소-주-주-세-요 but a certain rhythm. Try to imitate the way Koreans sound if, like in my case, it doesn't come naturally to you. Also, as in English, filler words help prepare the listener for what's coming next, so instead of saying "소주 주세요" you could try "저기, 소주 좀 주시겠어요?"

While my level of Korean isn't any better than it was a couple years ago (have only spent a few months in Korea since then), once I worked on my accent/intonation I started getting a totally different response. It's no longer "your Korean is really good" but rather "you sound so Korean." Taxi drivers would often joke "are you Korean?" and on one occasion I think the guy was actually serious. At a 7-11 I asked some question to the clerk whose back was turned, and when he turned around his eyes darted around and then not seeing anyone else he realized it was me asking the question and said he was expecting a Korean. My accent isn't perfect and it breaks down from time to time, but one of the biggest things a foreigner can do is work on the intonation and being able to properly pronounce the sounds (including distinguishing ㅂ/ㅃ/ㅍ, ㄷ/ㄸ/ㅌ, etc).

[hiamnotcool]

[hiamnotcool]

[AbbeFaria]

[happiness]

[PRagic]

The better half and I have been in and out of both China and Japan over the years, both for business and for travel. Without a doubt, at least in our experiences, there are more people who have functional Chinese and Japanese than there are who can purport to get by in Korean. I have been genuinely impressed with the Chinese ability of a lot of international business persons.

[Brooks]

Lots of mercenaries in Tokyo.
Outside Tokyo there are fewer.
Mercenaries have no time for learning Japanese since they want to work six days a week.

It really is pathetic to live in Japan for several years and to not even know how to spell your name in katakana.
Yet there are Americans I know who don't really bother to learn Japanese.

As for Korean, my friend in Seoul said pronunciation was the hardest part.
Obviously grammar is another issue. Pragmatics too.
And obviously honorifics, since they are far, far more compared to English.

There is some similarity with Japanese vocabulary, maybe partly due to Japan's colonization.

[newb]

I've learned to speak, read, and write Korean fairly well, but I only use it when I'm outside of work. It's very fun and useful when eavesdropping on my co-workers. Learning the language while I'm here has made my life much easier to cope than other FTs. However, I won't have any use for it when I leave Korea.

[coralreefer_1]

[hiamnotcool]

[Zyzyfer]

[PatrickGHBusan]

Lots of good comments in this thread.

Deciding to learn Korean (or not to) and at what level is very context dependant.

For someone here for 1-2 years to pay off debts, travel and so on, I do not see the need or a very high motivation to learn Korea beyond the basic survival level. The incentive would likely just not be there.

For a mid-term resident it would also vary because it will depend on how they view their stay in Korea. Some people who stay 4-6 years still view Korea as a layover on their way to somewhere else, so learning the language is not high on their list of priorities. Also ad to this the fact that a person who reaches survival Korean can get by and ask help from K-coworkers or friends for more serious language issues.

Long-termers (or lifers) would typically have a much higher motivation to learn but then again you get funny cases like the foreigner who marries locally and who does not learn Korean beyond the basics because their spouse becomes a human translator. Others learn to varying levels depending on the time they have to dedicate to study, on motivation...

As for difficulty, Korean can be challenging especially when your studies hit the world of real life interactions! At the lower levels, this can be a pretty rude shock as you study your butt off to learn some basic phrases and responses and in your first live interaction you fail miserably (or think you do anyway). This seems fairly common to most languages in the early stages.

Also, most beginners grossly over estimate the quality of their pronounciation and their mastery of the proper terms and sentences. This leads to frustration and discourages many learners (understandably so).

I would say learning Korean while you live in Korea will only benefit you. At even the intermediate level, it gives you linguistic autonomy (limited) and frees you from depending on Korean friends or from resorting to a mix of K-words and sign language. At a higher level, it can and does open doors professionally.

The key and for me the only thing that worked was working at it everyday, getting in as much practice as possible and immersing yourself through music, movies, reading and so on. Today with all the mobile resources you have, it is a lot easier to keep learning as you can load podcasts on your Iphone, Ipod or tablet and listen to lessons as you transit to and back from work.

[thebektionary]

I've definitely had that frustration before - some people just suck. Like when you said "Soju Juseyo" they probably just weren't willing to listen to you at all, because even in an American accent it's still comprehensible.

However, I've noticed that as my Korean skills have improved, so has my ability to be understood by Koreans. If they can't understand you, 95% of the time it is because you're not pronouncing it correctly. There are those exceptions where the person is just being a jerk and not willing to listen to you, of course, but most of the time it is pronunciation issues. Korean pronunciation and English pronunciation are COMPLETELY different and there are many sounds in Korean that do not exist in English. Therefore pronunciation must be learned and once it is, then you will be understood better.

I live in a place called Beombak-dong, and for the longest time I had a lot of taxi drivers going "HUH?!" But now I've adjusted my pronunciation ever so slightly after listening to the way Koreans say it and I hardly ever get a "HUH?!"

Anyway I'm currently studying at Sogang and I find it really fun. The level is a bit low for me right now but it's still helping me improve my speaking fluency (not stopping to go "ummm") as well as my pronunciation.