|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
|
 Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 12:01 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| dairyairy wrote: |
| Quote: |
| If you want to talk about wiring money overseas, then for sure(!), exchange rates are relevant. But if you're talking about the price of buying a bunch of bananas on payday, then no, it's not all that important |
It depends on the exchange rate and if a product is imported.If it's not imported then the price should be the same. Is that what always happens in Korea? |
My point is... factoring straight exchange rate when deciding something is cheap or expensive in korea, does not always work. If milk is 2000won per litre today, but the US dollar strengthens tomorrow, milk did not suddenly get more expensive. If you're buying stuff here as a tourist, that holds true, but if you're living here, and your income is in Korean won, then the exchange rate is not as big of a factor.
Keep in mind that this was in response to someone talking about costs via exchange rates. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
silkhighway
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Comparing Nova Scotia to Korea...keep in mind the median household income in NS as of 2010 was about 64K/yr, compared to about 56K in 2005:
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil108a-eng.htm
Right now I live in perhaps one of the most expensive areas of Canada, but nobody here earns a wage an ESL teacher in Korea earns. You just couldn't. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nicwr2002
Joined: 17 Aug 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 10:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| beison wrote: |
Obviously it depends on what you do.
It's pretty standard that specific things (hobbies, food, what not) are pricier in Korea and then service based things are cheaper.
But look at the whole cost of survival: Included sales taxes, ridiculously low income taxes (compared to the US tax rate anyway), really low medical care costs (again, compared to the US), and the fact that tipping is not part of any cost create a situation where it's significantly cheaper to live in Korea than it is in the US.
Here's a good example: You go to buy a six pack of a craft brew in Chicago. It costs $8.99, not too bad. Then you go and slap on the county tax, state tax, federal tax, and the city tax (alcohol taxes are a bitch) and you're up to a staggering ~20% tax! now your six pack is close to 11 bucks!
Factor this into every purchase you make, and you realize that any sticker price you might see is going to be 7-11% more expensive, and suddenly korean prices start to look a whole lot cheaper. |
Some cities even have a special tax, so you get the federal 5% tax, then the 1% state tax, then the 1% special purpose city tax, then the 1% special purpose local option sales tax. Then your at 8% sales tax on all items except food. Just wait for the Extra Special Purpose Local Option Sales Tax to come out next... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 11:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Its always going to be difficult to compare prices. Canada and the USA are geographically large nations, with rich natural resources and oil, and are also the breadbaskets of the world and can trade with each other easily.
Korea is essentially an island (3 sides surrounded by sea, no trade via the north) with little natural resources and an incredibly dense population, with limited arable land. Its two closes nations, aside from the one with the DMZ, are a nation with 1.2 billion consumers, and another densely populated, limited natural resource, limited arability, island nation. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
meangradin
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| having just returned to BC after 5 years away, i too was shocked by the price of things. however, most shocking to me was how much debt my friends carry. Even though many are now 10-15 years and many promotions later in to their careers, not a single one is solvent. most, have 30-40 year mortgages, and yes, they have lovely homes, but they will be paying for these homes in to their retirement. when i compare this with my friends in korea, it's really frightening. like myself, most carry no debt, own multiple properties, are amassing large retirement savings and are almost satiated in luxury goods (well, our wives are); and most have achieved this in 5-10 years of being in korea. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Who's Your Daddy?
Joined: 30 May 2010
Location: Victoria, Canada.
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| meangradin wrote: |
| having just returned to BC after 5 years away, i too was shocked by the price of things. however, most shocking to me was how much debt my friends carry. Even though many are now 10-15 years and many promotions later in to their careers, not a single one is solvent. most, have 30-40 year mortgages, and yes, they have lovely homes, but they will be paying for these homes in to their retirement. when i compare this with my friends in korea, it's really frightening. like myself, most carry no debt, own multiple properties, are amassing large retirement savings and are almost satiated in luxury goods (well, our wives are); and most have achieved this in 5-10 years of being in korea. |
Is your house in Korea comparable to your friends house? In my area of Canada a comparable condo is only about 25K more than my condo in Korea.
Most of my Canadians friends live in much nicer houses than 95% of Koreans do. Yeah to pay for that they have a large debt, but if they lived in a Korean size apartment they probably wouldn't.
And while you're amassing more "retirement savings" your friends might be getting a pension.
Also their salaries might be going up.
Also do your friends have kids?
Basically I'm not sure your story is comparing like things. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Who's Your Daddy? wrote: |
| Most of my Canadians friends live in much nicer houses than 95% of Koreans do. Yeah to pay for that they have a large debt, but if they lived in a Korean size apartment they probably wouldn't. |
A lot of families live in apartments between 30-60 pyeong. That's roughly 1000-2000 sqf. I grew up in a house that was maybe 2400 sqf (including the basement). Granted, you don't get the lawn space though. But you can buy cheaper land that is maybe two hours out of Seoul (that covers most of teh country) for a decent price, and build whatever you want on it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lazio
Joined: 15 Dec 2010
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Who's Your Daddy? wrote: |
| Most of my Canadians friends live in much nicer houses than 95% of Koreans do. Yeah to pay for that they have a large debt, but if they lived in a Korean size apartment they probably wouldn't. |
A lot of families live in apartments between 30-60 pyeong. That's roughly 1000-2000 sqf. I grew up in a house that was maybe 2400 sqf (including the basement). Granted, you don't get the lawn space though. But you can buy cheaper land that is maybe two hours out of Seoul (that covers most of teh country) for a decent price, and build whatever you want on it. |
A 30-60 pyeong apartment in reality is only 700-1600 sqf.
And not many people live in 45-50+ pyeong apartments. Well under 10% of the population and probably even less than 5%. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Lazio wrote: |
| A 30-60 pyeong apartment in reality is only 700-1600 sqf. |
How so? Do they include the lobby space in that pyeong number?
I've been in many ct's homes and all of them live in huge spaces (4 rooms usually). When I visualize the space it's comparable to what I grew up in. But I've spent most of my time outside of Seoul. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lazio
Joined: 15 Dec 2010
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Lazio wrote: |
| A 30-60 pyeong apartment in reality is only 700-1600 sqf. |
How so? Do they include the lobby space in that pyeong number?
I've been in many ct's homes and all of them live in huge spaces (4 rooms usually). When I visualize the space it's comparable to what I grew up in. But I've spent most of my time outside of Seoul. |
Yepp, stairway, elevator, parking lot and who knows what else. I checked dozens of new villas (분양) and the realtor says “this apartment is 34 pyeong, that one is 32pyeong…” They have a paper with all the apartment sizes in square meters. The 34 pyeong which supposed to be 112sqm is in fact only 80sqm and so on. It’s like that everywhere.
3-4 rooms? Right, but look at their size. Usually only the master bedroom is decent sized and at least one is only 6-7 square meters and another one under 10sqm. You put a queen sized bed there and it’s essentially full.
Back home a room under 12 sqm is called “half-room”. I have a 3 bedroom villa apartment and I took the time to measure the rooms. The master bedroom is 11 sqm and the others are 9 and 6 sqm so none of them would qualify as a room back home. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Lazio wrote: |
3-4 rooms? Right, but look at their size. Usually only the master bedroom is decent sized and at least one is only 6-7 square meters and another one under 10sqm. You put a queen sized bed there and it’s essentially full.
Back home a room under 12 sqm is called “half-room”. I have a 3 bedroom villa apartment and I took the time to measure the rooms. The master bedroom is 11 sqm and the others are 9 and 6 sqm so none of them would qualify as a room back home. |
6-9 sqm are huge for me. The rooms are slightly bigger than what I grew up in. My room back home you can fit a bed, and maybe a person with a sleeping bag. Barely had space for a computer desk. But the home I grew up in was built in the 70's. Maybe you grew up in a newer house. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Yeah, hard to say that Korean homes are anywhere near comparable ones in Canada - meaning, Middle class houses in Canada vs Apts here. I'm a bit surprised you're taking that stance, jvalmer. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Captain Corea wrote: |
| Yeah, hard to say that Korean homes are anywhere near comparable ones in Canada - meaning, Middle class houses in Canada vs Apts here. I'm a bit surprised you're taking that stance, jvalmer. |
How are they not comparable? Both are living spaces? I guess it's the lousy lawn most people are hung-up on. The space is comparable. Maybe the design? The apartments are kind of designed like a traditional Korean home, where room doors open up into a common area. Is it the price? Because it's mostly just parts of Seoul, and Busan, that are ridiculously expensive.
I for one prefer apartments, and in some Canadian cities they are priced more/sq feet than houses. Wished they'd make them more affordable back home. But if you want to buy a house with land in Korea, you can, however it probably won't be in Seoul. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
Bascially some things are more expensive in Canada (it does vary from region to region) and some are more expensive in Korea. The common point is that prices have risen in each country.
I generally find that fruits and veggies tend to be cheaper in Canada vs Korea (talking about off season fruit & veggies). There are some exeptions.
When it comes to meat, it varies a lot beef is cheaper in Canada for example.
Where we live gas prices are lower than in Korea but that is not true everywhere in Canada.
Taxes are far higher in Canada, no contest! Insurance (life, house, car) costs us more than it did in Korea.
Housing can be cheaper than Korea if you compare buying property but that depends on where you want to buy in Canada (and Korea). City taxes are higher in Canada for your property.
Car maintenance is far higher in Canada (where we live anyway).
Education costs can be cheaper in Canada (public) vs Korea.
At the end of the day neither place is really cheap but where it starts to make a difference is if you compare comparables!
Compare a fresh graduate wanting to teach a language in Canada vs Korea and then Korea comes out ahead due to the nearly free housing that is provided, far, far lower taxes.
For professionals, it depends in which fields and hours would have to be factored in as well as take home pay. I think on my salary we could technically be more confortable in Korea in terms of disposable income. Then again with 2 kids, education costs would put a dent in this $$.
Now Captain, I will say that our former apt in Busan compared quite well to our house in Canada. While it did not have a yard, it had a lot to offer in terms of convenience and services.
I agree with jvalmer that preferences play a huge role here! I mean I actually prefer an apt / condo to a house because it is more convenient and in line with my preferences.
If you start comparing good apts in either country, it becomes an interesting discussion.
The debt ratio in Canada is pretty bad but Korea is not far behind nowadays. Most of our friends here are neck deep in debt and live above their means. My wife works in finance in the banking sector (Canada-wide) and what she sees is pretty damn astounding! Many people are one missed pay check away from financial trouble. Most have very little in terms of pension or retirement savings and carry far too much credit debt.
This is due to the crazy hike real estate prices went on from 2000 - 2010ish and to the rise in consumer goods prices. As a quick example, gas in our are doubled in price since 2005. That dents your budget if you have a car and considering how many families have 2 cars... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
| Yeah, hard to say that Korean homes are anywhere near comparable ones in Canada - meaning, Middle class houses in Canada vs Apts here. I'm a bit surprised you're taking that stance, jvalmer. |
How are they not comparable? Both are living spaces? I guess it's the lousy lawn most people are hung-up on. The space is comparable. Maybe the design? The apartments are kind of designed like a traditional Korean home, where room doors open up into a common area. Is it the price? Because it's mostly just parts of Seoul, and Busan, that are ridiculously expensive.
I for one prefer apartments, and in some Canadian cities they are priced more/sq feet than houses. Wished they'd make them more affordable back home. But if you want to buy a house with land in Korea, you can, however it probably won't be in Seoul. |
Sure, both are living spaces... but apparently we run in different circles. Most of the middle class ppl I know in Korea (Seoul) have apts ranging from 25-40 pyong. Keep in mind that those measurements almost always include some % of common area.
While most (actually, all) of my buds in Canada (Calgary) live in houses that are about 1700 sq ft to 2800 sq ft.
So, no. To me the sizes are not comparable.
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Lazio wrote: |
| A 30-60 pyeong apartment in reality is only 700-1600 sqf. |
How so? Do they include the lobby space in that pyeong number?
I've been in many ct's homes and all of them live in huge spaces (4 rooms usually). When I visualize the space it's comparable to what I grew up in. But I've spent most of my time outside of Seoul. |
I think this is key. 60 peyong apts are NOT common for middle class in Seoul. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
