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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 2:39 am Post subject: |
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You're forgiven, ratslash. The guy on the left side of your avatar is so cute I can't stay angry long.  |
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kiwiboy_nz_99
Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Location: ...Enlightenment...
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 4:59 am Post subject: |
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Liking to watch hockey is ok, if you actually PLAY hockey, well let's just say that's a little on the butch side for me!
But, you said you like action movies, so go up two hundred points. If that includes Mafia movies then you really will have to hurry up with that divorce! |
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shevek
Joined: 29 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:05 am Post subject: |
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"Don't hate us just because we have the freedom to do what we want.
Don't hate us just because we're not afraid of standing out from the crowd and being different. "
Corporal,
I think your post is a nice idea, but not everything you said is really very true about Westerners in general or specific, even if you're only meaning realitve to Koreans. We absolutely do not have the freedom to do what we want. If you want to look at out freedom on a scale and say we're closer to being able to do anything we want, that we can do more things that we want when we want to than Koreans, than I must comment that it's like choosing to smoke lights rather than mediums because you're worried about your lungs' health. Cigarettes aren't healthy no matter how light and people in the west and east aren't free to do what they want.
Also, we seem pretty conformist to me.
Sparx, I agree with your comments about looking at others' comments on the nature of freedom even though, being a non-philosophy major I can't hope to reach the understanding of their ideas that you no doubt have.
But I think that the request to not hate us just because we don't tend to have fat filled skin folds over our eyelids could be added at this point. |
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kingleo
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Anyang, Korea
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:48 am Post subject: |
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Corporal,
Do Koreans hate us? I think they just have GDP envy. About your list,
1. Are we all white?
2. Do we speak our minds or do we speak what we think should be on our minds.
3. An irreverent statement of an irreverent generation
4. Maybe this one's aimed at the Korean chics; an apt generalisation
5. All the people standing out from the crowd simply make a few new crowds
Koreans may be exacting at times but hell! This is Korea. |
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ratslash
Joined: 08 May 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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| he's michael owen. famous footba... soccer player. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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Well, he's a damn fine male specimen, that is all I can say. Kiwiboy is sliding to the #3 spot. If he wants to stay in #2 he'd better do some pretty blatant complimenting.
(And the only reason I really watch hockey is because of the cute players. So I guess that makes me pretty girly after all.) |
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Butterfly
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:53 pm Post subject: Re: Here's a generalization... |
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| Corporal wrote: |
| All Koreans should learn from all Westerners. I propose: |
All Koreans CAN learn from SOME westerners and vice versa.
| Corporal wrote: |
| Don't hate us just because we sometimes make more money with less effort than you. Hey, we can't help being white. |
I don�t think I have experienced a Korean person hating me for this reason; when in truth on occasion they would be just in doing so towards some among our community of foreigners in this country. My Korean boss however, on occasion has asked me to calm down from my rage at flakey colleagues when I have to cover their classes again. I hate bad teachers more than he does. I do concede that some 'teachers' will be truly hated by their bosses when they get a poor return on the investment they have made in said teacher, when that teacher is lazy, inefective, tardy, demanding and arrogant, especially the small hakwons which have reputations that hinge on the quality of the teacher they hired.
| Corporal wrote: |
| Don't hate us just because we speak our minds and say what we think. |
I haven�t experienced anyone hate me for this reason. I think it is something Korean people often quite admire about westerners and aspire to. Perhaps like me, most Korean people can discern between those �speaking their minds� and those just whining. Koreans remember, seem to have a much higher threshold for what they can tolerate. Westerners often seem to drop their tools and shout and holler at the smallest inconvenience, I don�t think Koreans necessarily hate that, they just find it a bit confusing.
| Corporal wrote: |
| Don't hate us just because we don't have to bow to our parents and show obeisance to all those who are older simply because of age. |
No, I don�t think there is anyone who hates me for this reason. Among my Korean friends with whom I have discussed family matters, they fully understand and anticipate that I respect my mother, father and older relatives every bit as much as they respect theirs. I speak respectfully towards my parents and value what they say, I�m sure you do. Koreans bow as a ceremonial display of this and it is nothing more than a cultural nuance. As people we are no different.
| Corporal wrote: |
| Don't hate us just because we have the freedom to do what we want. |
Nobody hates me for this. All I have experienced is envy in this regard and into the new millennium we see Koreans enjoying more freedoms - more leisure time (5 day week) and more freedom of speech than ever before in modern Korea. There is a misperception that westerners are more free than we actually are. We are all slaves to money, regardless of which continent you live on.
| Corporal wrote: |
| Don't hate us just because we're not afraid of standing out from the crowd and being different. |
Nobody hates me for this, in fact I have a lot of Korean people who look up to me for it. Westerners aren�t hated for standing out in the crowd, Koreans are, by Koreans. It is a cultural trait that I find unpleasant about Korea, and stifling for true creativity and slowly I believe things are changing. But its their deal and their job to change it. Don�t imagine that we are included in that, we aren�t.
| Corporal wrote: |
| Hmmm...is that everything? anyone who can think of more feel free to add... |
Thank you.
Koreans:
Don�t hate me because some among our community hate every last one of you because they had a bad experience with a tiny few from your community. I can�t explain it and it�s not my fault. I will regard each one of you as an individual and judge you accordingly. Please do the same for me.
Corporal I have just read o another thread you posted that you are only 24. Thus I apologize for being rather glib with you. I can only encourage you to scratch a little deeper into this, your host country. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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How do you know they don't hate you? You think because they smile and are friendly and take you out to eat, that they're your best friend?
Ah, a gullible Westerner. Koreans do love those, I'll tell ya that.
And, before anyone else continues take the OP out of context, it was written a long time ago, in response to another thread, I can't remember which, but it wasn't intended to be taken alone. |
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Butterfly
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait
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| Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Corporal wrote: |
How do you know they don't hate you? You think because they smile and are friendly and take you out to eat, that they're your best friend?
Ah, a gullible Westerner. Koreans do love those, I'll tell ya that.
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How do you know that they DO hate you lady? It's you who wrote the OP not me, with all your assumptions about who hates us. It's you who made the first claim, that Koreans hate us.
Gullible or over cynical? (And gullible would imply that I'm being duped in some way, wtf??) What is the difference in perception terms? So I'll put it that you're the sucker for missing out on so many beautiful people by presuming that they all hate you, because you have built a set of assumptions in your mind about 'them' and their belief systems. All I can say is that if what you say is true Koreans have the nicest way to express hatred I've ever come across. Back home when people invite me to their houses, ask me to join them for lunch, buy me stuff, or just say hi or chat with me on the subway (in any available language) I generally assume they dont hate me. Maybe its different where you come from. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| Whatever. |
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kiwiboy_nz_99
Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Location: ...Enlightenment...
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 4:11 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
. Cigarettes aren't healthy no matter how light and people in the west and east aren't free to do what they want.
Also, we seem pretty conformist to me.
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Nope, by any measure we are MUCH more free. Free to think and speak as we wish. Not free to break the law, but very very much freer. Can you imagine a 10 000 strong gay pride parade going down the main street of Seoul, attended by a goodly proportion of hetero's and the Mayor? Thought not.
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| 3. An irreverent statement of an irreverent generation |
Better irreverant than confucianically (new coinage!) numb.
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4. Maybe this one's aimed at the Korean chics; an apt generalisation
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Nope, it's aptly aimed at all.
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5. All the people standing out from the crowd simply make a few new crowds
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Meaningless, but I'll engage. At least there's a choice of crowd, and some of the crowds are interesting, and some of them produce new ideas.
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Don't hate us just because we sometimes make more money with less effort than you. Hey, we can't help being white.
I don’t think I have experienced a Korean person hating me for this reason; |
You would never know, it's those you are aquainted with that will be holding these feelings. And they're not going to explain anything to you.
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I haven’t experienced anyone hate me for this reason. I think it is something Korean people often quite admire about westerners and aspire to. Perhaps like me, most Korean people can discern between those ‘speaking their minds’ and those just whining. Koreans remember, seem to have a much higher threshold for what they can tolerate. Westerners often seem to drop their tools and shout and holler at the smallest inconvenience, I don’t think Koreans necessarily hate that, they just find it a bit confusing.
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You wouldn't know. No, they don't admire it when it involves questioning thier archaic values. What you call tolerance and whining I call numbing conformist servitude and standing up for standards.
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No, I don’t think there is anyone who hates me for this reason. Among my Korean friends with whom I have discussed family matters, they fully understand and anticipate that I respect my mother, father and older relatives every bit as much as they respect theirs. I speak respectfully towards my parents and value what they say, I’m sure you do. Koreans bow as a ceremonial display of this and it is nothing more than a cultural nuance. As people we are no different.
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You wouldn't know. They not going to tell you how much they resent having to fork over 20% of thier wage to thier inlaws for at least 5 years after thier marriage.
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Nobody hates me for this. All I have experienced is envy in this regard and into the new millennium we see Koreans enjoying more freedoms - more leisure time (5 day week) and more freedom of speech than ever before in modern Korea. There is a misperception that westerners are more free than we actually are. We are all slaves to money, regardless of which continent you live on.
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You wouldn't know. We're all slaves to money, but we're not all slaves to confusianism.
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Nobody hates me for this, in fact I have a lot of Korean people who look up to me for it. Westerners aren’t hated for standing out in the crowd, Koreans are, by Koreans. It is a cultural trait that I find unpleasant about Korea, and stifling for true creativity and slowly I believe things are changing. But its their deal and their job to change it. Don’t imagine that we are included in that, we aren’t.
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You wouldn't know. And when you stand out by flauting thier values even if you're expressing your own, some of them they hate you too.
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Don’t hate me because some among our community hate every last one of you because they had a bad experience with a tiny few from your community. I can’t explain it and it’s not my fault. I will regard each one of you as an individual and judge you accordingly. Please do the same for me.
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Foreigners. Don't hate me because some of us are so desperate to fit in here that they stifle thier sense of self-worth and accept stone-age thinking and profound racism here. They didn't make it back home and thus are desperate to make things work here even if they have to turn the other cheek to reason.
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| Gullible or over cynical? (And gullible would imply that I'm being duped in some way, wtf??) What is the difference in perception terms? |
Gullible, because you let a few personal ( and very surface ) good experiences blind you to the background dynamic of racism in this country.
PS Oh yeah, and Corporal's a honey-babe. |
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Homer
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 4:32 am Post subject: |
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come on now Corporal,
You can bring up a better defence then "Whatever" to back up your ill fated list no? |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 4:49 am Post subject: |
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Nope, sorry Homer, I can't.
*side note: Kiwiboy is slowly making his way back up to the #2 spot. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 5:21 am Post subject: |
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| Homer wrote: |
come on now Corporal,
You can bring up a better defence then "Whatever" to back up your ill fated list no? |
Sounds like Kiwiboy did a good job of that already.
Anyway who cares whether people hate you or not? 99% of people here Korean or foreigner I am never going to see again (likely) so what does it really matter? Do your own stuff, don't step on people's "toes" (unless they p**s you off) and let the chips fall where they may. |
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Homer
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 5:23 am Post subject: |
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Sure ya can Corp...buck up and marshal the troops..you can counter attack, i know you can!
Your list was taken out of context of course but that doesn't matter.
You can come up with a totally unrelated sarcastic remark I am sure.
I have all confidance in you 
Then again the list was ill fated to begin with and not very sustainable but the hell with that, full steam ahead |
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