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jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:59 am Post subject: |
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Forgot to mention the nationalism and anti-American sentiment which basically means all white people to many Koreans. These too can lead one to the crazy house.
The good things are the somewhat easy money and free housing, perhaps, and I guess if you got good friends you can have a good time, and not feel so isolated.
Do many other foreign cultures receive the volume of complaints that Korea does?
Also true, many Koreans don't like it either. Many wish to go abroad. Many who return see problems and miss where they were. But many abroad miss home, no matter who they are. |
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Barking Mad Lord Snapcase
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 8:11 am Post subject: |
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| Demophobe wrote: |
If you don't like it, get off your apathetic butt and do what you can to change it, or again, leave.
If it's so bad, go home or to a different place. If you can't leave because of the money or some other hole that Korea is helping to fill, then don't bite the hand that feeds you. |
And Korealife Blog is subjective conjecture because ...? |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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One aspect no one has mentioned so far is the greater degree of unpredictability of daily life here.
I mean things like finding tomato sauce. I memorize which store has it and where in the store it is located. I go back and it has disappeared. Or been moved. Or the store has disappeared.
The frequency that I see drivers turn right from the left hand lane makes me nervous about all the other drivers when I'm in my car.
The last minute changes in schedules at work and placement of students in a class for unexpected reasons, like he wants to be with his friends.
My apartment manager posts a sign on the main entrance door saying water will be turned off for two hours on Saturday. Fine. Then it doesn't happen, but it does happen on Tuesday evening with no notice.
I turn down a narrow street and find the end of it blocked with construction. There was no Men at Work sign.
I see a nice shirt in a shop window. I go in and they don't have my size (105).
As I said, it is a matter of degree. Life is stressful everywhere. |
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Barking Mad Lord Snapcase
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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| chronicpride wrote: |
| If I picked up and went to Egypt, for job or not, I expect to sink right in there. To get my hands dirty and get as close to experiencing the essence of how they live and try to see life from their perspective. I don't feel that I'd be utilizing my time well to gain this cultural exposure through an internet cafe, eating McDonald's, trying to build up a network of expats to go clubbing every night, and trying to surround myself with as much western influences as possible. Unless I was solely there for financial reasons and a job. |
Just how quickly would you expect to sink right into Egypt? Perhaps you could adjust to the lifestyle, but - realistically - how close could you conform to the modern Egyptian worldview? You may learn about it (which would be a good thing), but would you feel obliged to adjust your own way of thinking to closely match the Egyptian way of thinking - not just for pragmatism, survival or intellectual and aesthetic stimulation, but the "life enriching" conversion that many travellers seem to wax lyrical about? Would you feel obliged to agree with your Egyptian peers - not just pretend to agree or meditate on the philosophy of their dialogues, but actually agree as much as possible to avoid that sticky feeling that you are still a (shock! horror!) touristy Westerner dragging around the guilt of technological privilege and "excessive" freedom?
If your Egyptian peers spoke disparagingly about Western democracy, homosexuals and women, would you believe (as I would) that they were talking rubbish? Would you calmly explain the Western liberal point of view?
Also - and this is a more important question that it may seem - would you ever visit the Pyramids, or at least plan to? |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:10 am Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
One aspect no one has mentioned so far is the greater degree of unpredictability of daily life here.
I mean things like finding tomato sauce. I memorize which store has it and where in the store it is located. I go back and it has disappeared. Or been moved. Or the store has disappeared.
The frequency that I see drivers turn right from the left hand lane makes me nervous about all the other drivers when I'm in my car.
The last minute changes in schedules at work and placement of students in a class for unexpected reasons, like he wants to be with his friends.
My apartment manager posts a sign on the main entrance door saying water will be turned off for two hours on Saturday. Fine. Then it doesn't happen, but it does happen on Tuesday evening with no notice.
I turn down a narrow street and find the end of it blocked with construction. There was no Men at Work sign.
I see a nice shirt in a shop window. I go in and they don't have my size (105).
As I said, it is a matter of degree. Life is stressful everywhere. |
Good post. It can be frustrating trying to get relatively simple things done here. Added to this, there are many things out of your control, which cause you much discomfort...and a lot of plain stupid things that make you mad.For eaxample, I had a bill posted on my door last week- I couldn't read all the fine print but knew it was from the electric. So I paid it. Later I realise I have paid someone elses, the idiot posts bills on the wrong doors slapdash style. And then the long tiome taken to explain how this came about and the struggle to get the right person to pay it.. Add to this the daily pressure from work and all of its stupidities, and the recipe for madness is there loud and clear. |
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chronicpride
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:24 am Post subject: |
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| Barking Mad Lord Snapcase wrote: |
| chronicpride wrote: |
| If I picked up and went to Egypt, for job or not, I expect to sink right in there. To get my hands dirty and get as close to experiencing the essence of how they live and try to see life from their perspective. I don't feel that I'd be utilizing my time well to gain this cultural exposure through an internet cafe, eating McDonald's, trying to build up a network of expats to go clubbing every night, and trying to surround myself with as much western influences as possible. Unless I was solely there for financial reasons and a job. |
Just how quickly would you expect to sink right into Egypt? Perhaps you could adjust to the lifestyle, but - realistically - how close could you conform to the modern Egyptian worldview? You may learn about it (which would be a good thing), but would you feel obliged to adjust your own way of thinking to closely match the Egyptian way of thinking - not just for pragmatism, survival or intellectual and aesthetic stimulation, but the "life enriching" conversion that many travellers seem to wax lyrical about? Would you feel obliged to agree with your Egyptian peers - not just pretend to agree or meditate on the philosophy of their dialogues, but actually agree as much as possible to avoid that sticky feeling that you are still a (shock! horror!) touristy Westerner dragging around the guilt of technological privilege and "excessive" freedom?
If your Egyptian peers spoke disparagingly about Western democracy, homosexuals and women, would you believe (as I would) that they were talking rubbish? Would you calmly explain the Western liberal point of view?
Also - and this is a more important question that it may seem - would you ever visit the Pyramids, or at least plan to? |
My Egypt reference was intended to be as an example, not literal. It was a more elaborate way of saying 'when in Rome...' It looks like the larger aim of my point, was lost in the distraction of the poor example that I chose.  |
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jazblanc77
Joined: 22 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:27 am Post subject: |
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| Demophobe wrote: |
Some people adapt well for various reasons, and some don't.
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Are you trying to hypnotise us with your new avatar or make us GO CRAZY?  |
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Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:46 am Post subject: |
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| Barking Mad Lord Snapcase wrote: |
And Korealife Blog is subjective conjecture because ...? |
Perhaps you are right. I don't intend however, to pretend my drivel is book-worthy.  |
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Barking Mad Lord Snapcase
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 5:43 am Post subject: |
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| chronicpride wrote: |
| My Egypt reference was intended to be as an example, not literal. It was a more elaborate way of saying 'when in Rome...' It looks like the larger aim of my point, was lost in the distraction of the poor example that I chose. |
No, I knew that your example wasn't literal. It was quite an interesting example, though, considering the cultural difference implied (although Iran, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia would probably be even more culturally alienating for Westerners). The "when in Rome" proverb is a highly relevent one for expats and travellers. It raises the issue of degree, however. Do you do everything the "Romans" do? Do you pretend to be "Roman"? When in another culture, it is important to try your best to make your newfound colleagues feel comfortable around you - but does that mean hiding your origin and identity as deeply as possible, even from yourself? |
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chronicpride
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 6:04 am Post subject: |
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I don't think that I'd necessarily look at my desire to travel and sink into other cultures as an insecurity that I have with my self-identity, per se. I actually feel more right with myself when I'm learning something and being bombarded on all sides in a learning and growth-rich environment. I find it intoxicating, to walk into something completely new and challenging myself to learn, adapt, and grow. Once I achieve a feeling of spinning tires and been there-done that, I get bored and I then feel that it's time to move on and try something new.
So since I'm on the couch and looking to isolate a character flaw within myself, regarding my MO, it's that I get bored very easy and need constant stimulus. Product of being raised in front of channel-changing TVs, I suppose.  |
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Real Reality
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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nev
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Location: ch7t
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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I think Koreans are under a different kind of stress than foreigners. Communication problems and adapting to a different environment are two of the most stressful things for incoming foreigners; something faced when settling in in any foreign nation.
Also, if life in Korea ever gets too unbearable for a Western foreigner, they usually have the option of going home. A Korean doesn't have that easy option.
Are you on commission for this link, Real Reality?  |
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Barking Mad Lord Snapcase
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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| chronicpride wrote: |
| So since I'm on the couch and looking to isolate a character flaw within myself, regarding my MO, it's that I get bored very easy and need constant stimulus. Product of being raised in front of channel-changing TVs, I suppose. |
My questions were more general than personal, but it is clear that you are travelling for all the right reasons. |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 9:12 pm Post subject: korea |
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When I first came to Korea I expected to experience Asia, I was quite surprised to find out that Korea is Korea....the hermit kingdom is an apt name.
Now after two years I know a fair bit about it but am still surprised and sometimes angered by some of the cultural differences.
Changing schedules without telling anyone.
Korean drivers...that says it all
Rudeness
Being gawked at by the old and young alike.
But for everything that drives me nuts here there are things that I love.
Korean people
The public transit system
Being a star
All in all it balances out in my view, its just how you percieve it. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:06 am Post subject: |
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| jajdude wrote: |
Do many other foreign cultures receive the volume of complaints that Korea does?
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Do many other foreign cultures have the availability and cheapness of the high speed internet cafes that we have in Korea? |
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