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jaderedux
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Lurking outside Seoul
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 Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:01 am Post subject: |
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| Homer wrote: |
Maybe I am missing something here and I do not wish to offend you CLG but what is the big deal about two open classes a year if you (as you profess) really like your job?
Isn't an open class just a lesson you teach in front of parents and teachers?
That does not seem to be too bad (especially 2 times a year). As a former HS teacher back home it certainly does not seem abusive to me (even if it can be annoying!) when I compare it to teacher-parent nights that happened 6-8 times a year....
If I miss-interpreted your post CLG then you have my apologies. I just think you are making a big deal out of something pretty routine and perhaps tossing out a good job because of a small annoyance.... |
It isn't so much the open class. It is the fact that we then have to attend all of these classes that are not helping me teach in the slightest. I am part of my schools English lesson plan. I am responsible for a part of the book. They get tested on the material I cover and I also write questions for the test. These classes will take me out of the school for entire afternoons anywhere from 10 to 12 times.
Some of the schools have banging IT and yowsa that's great but if you have chalk and a chalk board all the banging IT dog and pony shows don't mean squat. We have to figure out how to make it interesting, fun and get the job done with chalk.
I don't relish travelling to a school for 45 minutes to see a class in a school that has a SPECIAL English building with interactive whiteboards and computers on each desk with internet access. I mean it is nice and all but it just doesn't apply to me or my school.
I have no problem going to see 1 or 2 classes within my city at like schools to improve my teaching. In fact there are 3 of us that share ideas and materials alot and our students benefit from our frequent collaborations.
But it is not a SMALL THING. It takes us out of the schools and many of us are on really tight schedules with getting through the book, speaking tests that we administer. So one or two afternoons I understand I can deal with but trotting all over hell and half acre to see someone I saw 2 months ago is ineffective and downright stupid.
I too abhor the dog and pony shows. Show me a class that you REALLY DO. I want to learn something. Maybe I can garner a few ideas. But scripted and rehearsed. When the students are shouting out answers that are on the lesson plan verbatim ...um just send me the lesson plan and don't make me travel for an hour and miss 2 classes so I can see your "play" class.
If that sounds harsh and unfair sorry. But any class you walk into of mine is worthy of a audience. I don't need to rehearse or script my classes and make sure my students answer in unison like a bunch of trained seals. My classes are active, interactive and I invite any of you to come to see one. And if you are in my area you are going to see one of my regular classes not some scripted, rehearsed "pretend" class.
Jade |
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flotsam
Joined: 28 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:01 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
One thing here Mr. Homer. I think the term open classes may have confused you. These are events where the foreigners in one area go to a choosen school along with their Korean co-teachers and a number of Gyeonggi-Do officials. They sit and watch a foreign teacher and a Korean co-teacher teach a lesson in class. Afterwards they critique the lesson. The next time it's someone else's turn. No parents involved (at least for me). Usually the parents come alone and peer in through the window of the classroom while my principal proudly shows off the foreigner. |
There it is.
And like you said Homes, if it is done right. Sure, practicing in front of other people, having a little performance pressure to make you focus on your lesson and the comments of peers/supervisors/students(not that that happens here) is of great value.
It's just not done right. And I'll throw in an optomistic, yet. |
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bigscott
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Location: Incheon
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:05 am Post subject: |
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I have also been involved in these "demo classes" at public schools. I looked at them in a completely different way to CLG. I saw these as a chance to pick up some outside tips and improve my teaching method. I think it is a mistake to object too much and "bite the hand that feeds you".
Don't think of it as a chance for them to cut you down, think of it as a way to improve yourself. |
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flotsam
Joined: 28 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:16 am Post subject: |
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| jaderedux wrote: |
It isn't so much the open class. It is the fact that we then have to attend all of these classes that are not helping me teach in the slightest. I am part of my schools English lesson plan. I am responsible for a part of the book. They get tested on the material I cover and I also write questions for the test. These classes will take me out of the school for entire afternoons anywhere from 10 to 12 times.
Some of the schools have banging IT and yowsa that's great but if you have chalk and a chalk board all the banging IT dog and pony shows don't mean squat. We have to figure out how to make it interesting, fun and get the job done with chalk.
I have no problem going to see 1 or 2 classes within my city at like schools to improve my teaching. In fact there are 3 of us that share ideas and materials alot and our students benefit from our frequent collaborations.
If that sounds harsh and unfair sorry. But any class you walk into of mine is worthy of a audience. I don't need to rehearse or script my classes and make sure my students answer in unison like a bunch of trained seals. My classes are active, interactive and I invite any of you to come to see one. And if you are in my area you are going to see one of my regular classes not some scripted, rehearsed "pretend" class.
Jade |
What she said.
And here is the flip side to how I described my role: I have no evaluative impact, Jade does, and she gets dragged around for what are largely wastes of time.
I like to think of my classes the same way Jade described hers in the bold section above. My school also limits me to chalk and such, but you can make a hell of a class through research, relationships, planning and good old spontaneity. We NEVER train on or talk about these elements of our teaching. At one of the demo classes I went to the Brit teacher performing was asked, to the approving and serious nods of the education officials sitting about, what he thought about affecting a North American accent in the classroom. You could hear all of our(native-speakers) eyes knock into each other as they rolled around the room... |
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crazylemongirl
Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Location: almost there...
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:31 am Post subject: |
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The 'dog and pony shows' I'm referring to are the ones where it's obvious that the classes have been reheresed many times. I've been to open classes where the students responses have been scripted in the lesson plan and the students say exactly what's on the lesson plan (how do they know what students are going to say, unless the students are all perfect someone has given them lines to memorize). I've also seen students start working on tasks before they've even been assigned, how can they complete a task if they haven't been given the information yet? Dragging me along to that sort of crap is an insult to my intelligence and taking me away from my students.
At the moment my school is already behind on the cirrculum and we are having to rearrange timetables so that I can do the speaking tests with my 3rd years, because I only see them every fortnight. I also have to get through the material that they'll be tested on for finals before the first week of July. At the moment some classes are going to have two classes jammed into one because we're running out of time just factoring in the days off we already know about. It's not that I have a lot of classes (29), but between now and tesst I have only one teaching week that won't be interupted by days off, tests and open classes. So I ask how is it benefical to my students to have me pulled out of even more classes so that I can see something that has no relevance? Not very much at all.
I don't mind doing a yearly open class. But I really want to show what I do (for better or for worse) my teaching. I want to hear critques about what I'm doing in class, with the teaching materials I normally have available (chalk, photocopier, printer and a laminator). So to do a class where all of a sudden I'm getting access to stuff I don't have in order to get a good evaluation seems dishonest to me. I'll gladly put my classes up for constructive criticism because I want to be a better teacher. How am I supposed to get valid criticism of my classes if I'm not presenting as accurate picture as possible of what goes on in my classroom? I'm curious as to why people would advocate that I not present as accurate picture of my classes.
Just for the record, I also like going to open classes where I can use what I see what really happens in a classroom and use those ideas in my classes and improving my lessons. However when I go to scripted classes that have activities and content that are so complicated they need to be rehearsed beforehand, then what relevance are they to my classes where I don't get the luxury? Given the time constraints that I mentioned eariler, perhaps people can understand why I'm more than a little annoyed about this. It's not so much that I have to do another class (which is outside of my contract), but this means I'm spending time away from my students (which I thought was my reason for being here) in order to help some idiot in teh education office justify their wage.
Just as an aside, I'm really disappointed with the posters who's contribution to this thread just seems to be attacking me. I do take my job seriously, and I don't see how kicking sand in my face has raised the standard of debate on this thread. |
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Homer
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:49 am Post subject: |
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CLG,
I do hope you did not consider my contribution to this thread as an attack on you!
If so, rest assured it was not my intent and I apologize.
As it was pointed out, I had a different idea of what open class was about.
In summary,
I agree that overly compklex and oft rehearsed mock lessons achieve nothing pedagologically wise and are too artificial to be an accurate measurement of a teacher.
I do think that sit ins are a better method when unnanounced and if done properly. The person doing the evaluation has to know what they are doing here.
Much like jade, when I was in a public school, an evaluator could have (and did!!) walked in to any of my classes at any time and I would not have been irked about it or scared about the outcome. |
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Francis-Pax
Joined: 20 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 7:10 am Post subject: Re: 2 Open Classes a Year? WTF? |
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| crazylemongirl wrote: |
My school is super annoyed as apparently some offical is trying to justify his wages by insisting on two open classes a year, by the foreign teachers. I've been in my district for two years already, when I submit my paperwork I always get glowing reports and my kids win awards. If I'm doing such a terrible job then they've had more than enough oppourtunity to give my marching orders.
Apparently this measure is being put in place to 'control the foreign teachers.' My district had a lot of long timers who built up a really good relationship with out students because we aren't part of the revolving door that most public school positions are these days. I've already told my school that much as I love the area and the students in it, I'm not re-sigining again due to this kind of behavior. While they've lost a number of good teachers already because of it. |
Usually I am sympathic but I have to object this time. Whatever their reasons for observing your class, you need to be open to allow others above you see you in action. Any professional teacher is observed periodically. Two times a year is no big deal. More than that I would be worried. You need to be a little more flexible. |
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rothkowitz
Joined: 27 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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Urban Myth,
Don't you have a school dance or something to organise? |
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Ekuboko
Joined: 22 Dec 2004
Location: ex-Gyeonggi
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 10:29 pm Post subject: Re: 2 Open Classes a Year? WTF? |
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| Francis-Pax wrote: |
| Any professional teacher is observed periodically. Two times a year is no big deal. More than that I would be worried. You need to be a little more flexible. |
You don't get it, do you?
I used to be observed by my superiors when I worked at an English school in NZ; of course that was stressful, but conducive to my professional development. I never did anything I wouldn't do in a normal class.
These "demonstration" classes are exactly that: DEMONSTRATIONS. They do not ressemble normal, every day classes. If they did, they would not be such a problem; however, both NET and KET are expected to script, practice and practice.. oh, and use as much technology as possible in a 45 minute lesson.
Then the visitors analyse the lesson in a post-mortem, which is a joke, because all are expected to critique something they all know does not ressemble a "real" lesson in Korean schools! |
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jaderedux
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Lurking outside Seoul
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 10:49 pm Post subject: Re: 2 Open Classes a Year? WTF? |
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| Francis-Pax wrote: |
| crazylemongirl wrote: |
My school is super annoyed as apparently some offical is trying to justify his wages by insisting on two open classes a year, by the foreign teachers. I've been in my district for two years already, when I submit my paperwork I always get glowing reports and my kids win awards. If I'm doing such a terrible job then they've had more than enough oppourtunity to give my marching orders.
Apparently this measure is being put in place to 'control the foreign teachers.' My district had a lot of long timers who built up a really good relationship with out students because we aren't part of the revolving door that most public school positions are these days. I've already told my school that much as I love the area and the students in it, I'm not re-sigining again due to this kind of behavior. While they've lost a number of good teachers already because of it. |
Usually I am sympathic but I have to object this time. Whatever their reasons for observing your class, you need to be open to allow others above you see you in action. Any professional teacher is observed periodically. Two times a year is no big deal. More than that I would be worried. You need to be a little more flexible. |
I think you are missing the point. None of us really object to the classes per se. But if each of us do do classes that means I could miss anywhere from 10 to 16 classes. Perhaps you are not a relevant part of your school's curriculum but I am lucky enough to be relevant in mine.
I have to get through speaking tests and 3 more chapters before the next term ends. I teach two parts of the chapter so that takes 2 weeks per chapter. I also admister speaking tests to all the students.
I have 27 classes and almost no free time in my schedule. I also teach a special class after school. Now if I am out of the school for at least 2 class periods a day because we have to drive or take the bus to a different school that means I could miss alot of classes that may or may not be able to be made up. If I am missing a class that means at least one or more of my collegues is also missing a class.
I DON'T CARE IF THEY COME AND VIEW MY CLASS EVERY DAMN DAY. They can tape the damn things and send weekly critiques.
But these so called open classes are ridiculous a good percent of the time. The Ed. Office officials ususally have little if no English skill. The forms for evaluation ARE ALWAYS PRINTED IN KOREAN. Not so bad for me because I can read them somewhat but what about the newbie who has been here 2 months. We have asked over and over again for these to be put in English so we can speak to the topics they want input on.
AGAIN, I have been at the same school for 5 years. I don't mind going to the schools near me and maybe once to each school but what possible good does it do ME to go twice a year to the same school? The rehearsed over practiced ones are the absolute worse. Yes, the interactive chalk board and the internet at the desks is wonderful. Yes the movie clips are great. And the fact that your students can repeat verbatim what is in the lesson plan you handed out is great. Next time just send me the lesson plan and save me 3 hours of travel.
Please feel free to come to any class of mine. Tape it, critique it, tell me how I can be a better teacher. I welcome that. But that much time away from my school is a hardship on my students and is a hardship on the korean teachers.
Jade |
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rothkowitz
Joined: 27 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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I went to some high school demo classes in Kyonggi do last year and they were scripted to a frustrating degree.
A good couple of months must have been spent rehearsing which left me with absolutely no idea as to how the students actually GOT to that stage of being able to respond to the material.If thats a dog and pony show I'm not going to do so for mine in July.
I'm not re-doing my teaching cert.I'm just doing a class.A normal one.Just a little more polished.Without the 25 page handout.
Out of curiosity what are other teachers considering doing for it?I'm thinking just pronunciation with a couple of activities.45 minutes with 40 students...there's a limit to what one can do in a class anyways.So...I figure I'll make the class a demo of what I can do in that situation.Too much stuff merely overloads the students anyway. |
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ilovebdt
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Location: Nr Seoul
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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| rothkowitz wrote: |
I went to some high school demo classes in Kyonggi do last year and they were scripted to a frustrating degree.
A good couple of months must have been spent rehearsing which left me with absolutely no idea as to how the students actually GOT to that stage of being able to respond to the material.If thats a dog and pony show I'm not going to do so for mine in July.
I'm not re-doing my teaching cert.I'm just doing a class.A normal one.Just a little more polished.Without the 25 page handout.
Out of curiosity what are other teachers considering doing for it?I'm thinking just pronunciation with a couple of activities.45 minutes with 40 students...there's a limit to what one can do in a class anyways.So...I figure I'll make the class a demo of what I can do in that situation.Too much stuff merely overloads the students anyway. |
I have no idea. But, I don't think I will have much of a choice and, sorry guys, it'll probably be a D and P.
Ilovebdt |
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Francis-Pax
Joined: 20 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 11:41 pm Post subject: Re: 2 Open Classes a Year? WTF? |
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| Ekuboko wrote: |
| Francis-Pax wrote: |
| Any professional teacher is observed periodically. Two times a year is no big deal. More than that I would be worried. You need to be a little more flexible. |
You don't get it, do you?
I used to be observed by my superiors when I worked at an English school in NZ; of course that was stressful, but conducive to my professional development. I never did anything I wouldn't do in a normal class.
These "demonstration" classes are exactly that: DEMONSTRATIONS. They do not ressemble normal, every day classes. If they did, they would not be such a problem; however, both NET and KET are expected to script, practice and practice.. oh, and use as much technology as possible in a 45 minute lesson.
Then the visitors analyse the lesson in a post-mortem, which is a joke, because all are expected to critique something they all know does not ressemble a "real" lesson in Korean schools! |
How can I not get it? I have taught in public schools in Korea for about two years now, in Seoul and Kyounggido. At my current school I am teaching 30 classes a week and I need to open class next month.
Maybe you don't get it. |
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livinginkorea
Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Location: Korea, South of the border
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| Posted: Wed May 03, 2006 12:57 am Post subject: |
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My open class has been arranged for June and apart from working a little bit more on a good idea for an activity for the children, it will be the exact same as all my other classes.
Here we go...
Intro,
Check the homework (photocopied phonics sheets and book signed by mummy and daddy),
Step and Jump (I'm in the GEPIK),
Check the story book (this is a page that is photocopied for more homework),
On to the book,
Activity,
Finish up.
That's basically it and I know that I do a lot of extra work in the class 'cas the book isn't great. I still use the book in every class but only the parts that I think are decent enough to do.
I have a super cool activity for 5th graders and that will be all. No demos or shows. There was none at my last class and there will be none at this either. I saw some in other schools and one in particular sucked. That Korean teacher is working anymore 
I'm looking forward to my open class as it will be a chance to meet more people. Last year a friend of mine made my co-teacher look stupid (which she was) and thankfully I'm not working with her this year. |
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livinginkorea
Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Location: Korea, South of the border
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| Posted: Wed May 03, 2006 1:02 am Post subject: |
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Last year I saw one class which was too well prepared but the teacher kept screwing up with the remote for the screen. He never used it before so why did he decide to suddenly use it? Simply 'cas he thought that it would look cool and make him look great. But it ended up looking really really stupid.
If you prepare too much then it looks so fake. Don't Koreans understand this?
But then again in Korea - if the rice cake looks good..... |
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