Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Hater Depot]

http://www.xanga.com/LiNKorea/485050575/item.html

LiNK is screening "Seoul Train", so if any of you can make, I recommend going.

[cubanlord]

[Zolt]

cubanlord, please stay cool. I don't dispute your point, but your choice of sources (both US) is not exactly the most unbiased one.

Here's one for a different point of view for a change
http://www.bekkoame.ne.jp/ro/renk/englishhome.htm
Not exactly unbiased either, but some interesting stories told without embellishment.

I'm sure a lot of ppl on this board have better sources to provide, including first hand accounts. Lesson is, don't take for granted what you see in the media, even the respected western ones. There's no such thing as unbiased data, so take a wide sample and decide for yourself what you believe in.

As for you sovietman, while you criticize other people's sources, I don't see you getting a lot of hard evidence on your side. I'm urging not only everyone else to snap out of their one-sided image of DPRK, but you too need to look at the whole mass of information available, and maybe consider that a little bit of it might be true.

[cubanlord]

[soviet_man]

In terms of state sponsored killing, the Library of Congress Country Studies and the CIA World Factbook (eg. your preferred sources) also indicate the number of executions committed in the DPRK during 2005 is estimated to be 40.

Got that? 40.

At the same time the USA were also having the world's biggest barbecue in Iraq with at a minimum 37,848 people killed by US forces.

Source: www.iraqbodycount.org

[ddeubel]

[cubanlord]

[Captain Corea]

The United States of America... hmmm

could be countable there Mr. Lord.

Edit: just saw yur "T".... with his lack of a big one (the "T" that is) maybe he could have been right with the "were".

[patchy]

Holland Kicks Out a Third Worlder
Filed under:

by Ian Mosley

Illegal Alien

The big racket that Third World immigrants use to get into European countries has always been �asylum seeking.� In many cases, black and brown illegals entering Europe are provided with a cover story by professional immigrant smugglers, usually involving alleged opposition political activity and torture in their countries of origin; the stories have become so similar that most European immigration and customs officers recognize them right off the bat. Women illegals seeking entry into Europe often have a �feminist version� ready about how the evil patriarchal males back home were going to force them into an arranged marriage.

These stories are perfectly well known to be almost all fake by the EU authorities, but since European capitalism is just as hungry for cheap non-white labor as the American version, these made-up stories are allowed to continue to tie the system up in knots, and the illegals are usually released into the population to disappear into the local Somali or Turkish or other Third World community. But on rare occasions, one of these liars gets caught, and this is what has occurred with a Somali woman in the Netherlands. A high-profile Somali �feminist� has managed to anger the Dutch authorities sufficiently so the normally spineless Amsterdam government is actually throwing her out of the country.

It turns out that Ayaan Hirsi Ali, aged 36, not only lied her way into Holland, she lied her way into Dutch citizenship and the Dutch Parliament. Ms. Ali has gained notoriety among European neo-conservatives by making a career out of attacking the Islamic religion. She partnered with Theo Van Gogh, a Dutch filmmaker, to produce a movie viciously attacking Islam, which resulted in Van Gogh being killed by an outraged Muslim two years ago. But Ms. Ali got hoisted on her own petard when a Dutch television documentary recently revealed that she repeatedly lied in order to claim asylum in the Netherlands, and also lied on her application for Dutch citizenship five years later. Now the Dutch government has threatened to revoke her citizenship and she is on the road again. Not back to Somalia, but�where else?�to the United States.

Ali arrived in Holland at age 22, claiming to have fled from her native Somalia in order to escape an arranged marriage. (The standard feminist version of the asylum story.) To begin with, she lied about her name�her real name is Hirsi Magan. It turns out there was no arranged marriage. She comes from a well-off family in Kenya. Apparently being an illegal alien in Holland is a more comfortable existence than being the top of the heap in Kenya.

There is some evidence that the Dutch government and people were getting a bit tired of Ms. Ali�s high profile Muslim-baiting, in view of the country�s large Muslim population (which shouldn�t be there in the first place �and neither should she.) Ali also publicly supported and encouraged the offensive caricatures of the Prophet Mohammed which appeared in European newspapers last year and caused rioting throughout the Muslim world. Since the anti-Muslim movie she made with Van Gogh came out and caused riots, she has had to be afforded a constant police guard, and last August a Dutch court ruled that she had to vacate her home in Amsterdam because the constant police presence and security risk was causing all kinds of problems and annoyances for her neighbors. The Dutch documentary crew discovered that her entire presence in the country was based on a fraud.

Now where does a Third World freeloader go after being kicked out of Europe? The United States of course. She has been offered a job with the neo-conservative �think tank,� the American Enterprise Institute, where she will doubtless pursue a long and fruitful career bashing the land and the religion of her birth. After all she has no other useful skills and would otherwise be a welfare case if not for politics.


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Sob story below:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/3322399.stm

She is getting asylum in the US because she is a Muslim-basher even though she lied about her history to the Dutch.

[cubanlord]

[noguri]

Captain Corea and Jinju and the others have intentionally misinterpreted Patchy's argument.

On the other hand Patchy should not have compared those fleeing North Korea with both the Falun Gong and the Marielitos. The Marielitos are just misfits or sociopaths who did not have any particular political or social stance in Cuba. But the Falun Gong are a different case. Falun Gong are in fact Chinese dissidents of a sort, although they are not the Tiennemen Square ["pro-democracy"] type of dissident.

What is a "dissident"? Someone who claims to be oppressed politically; and who also opposes the political regime under which she or he lives.

The important thing to ask, is does a particular individual dissident represent the opinions of an entire nation? Or merely a certain discontented segment of the country?

Clearly the North Koreans who are invited to dine at the White House are dissidents. I do not doubt their sincerity. However, it must be pointed out that by fleeing to the U.S., they receive money, expedited green card status, and they are treated as heroes or princes.

Are there dissidents in the United States? Of course. They are primarily African Americans and also people of Latin American descent, they have embraced the revolutionary ideals of Malcom X and Ernesto "Che" Guevara. Many of them are convicts in prison who grew up in brutal poverty and have embraced the teachings of Islam.

The political dissidents in the U.S. do not receive money, they are not warmly toasted by President Bush. They are just treated as convicts and scum. So I conclude that it takes a lot more guts to be a U.S. dissident in the United States than it does to be a North Korean dissident in the United States.

This reminds me of a conversation I had with a group of graduate students from the People's Republic of China back in the late 90s. The young and ambitious student named Feng told me that he is a dissident who wants political reform in China. He said that the U.S. government should provide him with money to work for change in China. Feng's friends then snickered and they added that Feng will not receive money because even though he calls himself a "dissdent," nobody has heard of Feng. He's just a nobody!

I thought, "But, he really IS a dissident in his own mind." "Just being an unknown doesn't mean his viewpoint is without value."

Hence, what makes a DISSIDENT achieve recognition is the sponsorship of powerful political interests and the mass media. So the author of "The Aquariums of Pyongyang" enjoys U.S. gov't sponsorship but the followers of Malcolm X get life in prison.

I don't think that one can characterize the thoughts and feelings of every African-American in the USA based on the teachings of Nation of Islam, Luis Farrakhan, etcetera. Nor can one extrapolate that all North Koreans think and feel as does the author of "Aquariums of Pyongyang."

[KittyLover]

I think that in these arguments we forget to think of people as individuals. Yes, it's probable that a lot of people who defect from N. Korea are criminals or social misfits. Does that mean that they all are? Yes western countries (including the US) are responsible for a large number of the world's problems. Does that mean that they can't help others out? Maybe the special status that we give to the defectors of our enemies is hypocritical, but if we are giving a few people a break who really need it, is it really all bad?