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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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 Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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| sundubuman wrote: |
| His only parent (that raised him) is white. (why isn't he seen as at least 1/2 white??) |
Don't blame him, blame society. He didn't come up with the one-drop rule.
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| Yet he willfully chose to birth his own political career within a "black" Chicago district. |
First, he moved to Chicago 11 years before becoming a state senator. And that was to do communiy work. He returned to continue this work and teach at the UofC Law School.
Second, he didn't get a elected from a "black" district. It's a multiracial district.
The third, why do you assume that black people will elect any black guy who comes along. Ha.
What about 2000?
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| In 2000, he [Obama] challenged incumbent congressman Bobby Rush, a one-time Black Panther who now pastors a South Side church on the weekends. Characterizing Obama as an elite from Harvard University, Rush questioned his credentials to lead the historic black district and won with 61percent of the vote to Obama �s 30 percent. |
And of course, playing up the black card wouldn't have been too useful in running for US Senate. Or did the two black US Senators, ever, who proceeded him, open up the flood gates?
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| at this early point in his career, He remains a total fraud.....very possibly a well-meaning fraud.... |
Har har. You have shown no evidence to support your claims. Maybe you just hate him because he's a democrat. Or maybe it's because he's black. Which one is it? |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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| sundubuman wrote: |
back to Condi.....
why has she never felt the need to mention her skin color.....
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You aren't paying attention. She can hardly contain her black-Alabama heritage.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0505/11/lkl.01.html
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KING: We have a Second Amendment. People can own guns. By the way, what do you think about gun control?
RICE: The way I come out of my own personal experience, in which in Birmingham, Alabama, my father and his friends defended our community in 1962 and 1963 against White Knight Riders by going to the head of the community, the head of the cul-de-sac, and sitting there, armed. And so I'm very concerned about any abridgement of the Second Amendment. |
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| RICE: I -- I understood that something was deeply wrong in Birmingham, Alabama. When I didn't have a white classmate until we moved to Denver, Colorado. I knew that these were separate societies. Our parents -- I grew up in a very nice, sheltered little middle class community in Birmingham. My mother was a schoolteacher, and my father was a minister and a high school guidance counselor. And I'm still friends with a lot of the kids from that community. |
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/09/21/60minutes/main2029782.shtml?source=RSSattr=Politics_2029782
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| "I probably have at one level, a better understanding, or perhaps, let me say a more personal understanding of what the dark side of human beings can look like. I remember very well in 1963 when Birmingham was so violent. When it acquired the name "Bomb-ingham," Rice recalls. |
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| "Well, growing up in the South and having people underestimate you because one of the reasons for segregation, one of the reasons for the separation of the races was supposedly, the inferiority of one race to the other," she explains. "And so when I look around the world and I hear people say, 'Well, you know, they're just not ready for democracy,' it really does resonate. I hear echoes of, well, you know, blacks are kind of childlike. They really can't handle the vote. Or they really can't take care of themselves. It really does roil me. It makes me so angry because I think there are those echoes of what people once thought about black Americans." |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| A moron in a similar vein to the OP. |
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Hank Scorpio
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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| EFLtrainer wrote: |
| Or are you not aware that slander is a crime in most countries? |
"Most countries" being the inferior ones. |
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EFLtrainer
Joined: 04 May 2005
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Hank Scorpio wrote: |
| EFLtrainer wrote: |
| Or are you not aware that slander is a crime in most countries? |
"Most countries" being the inferior ones. |
Funny. Stupid, but funny. |
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sundubuman
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: seoul
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| Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 8:13 am Post subject: |
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[quote="huffdaddy"]
| sundubuman wrote: |
Har har. You have shown no evidence to support your claims. Maybe you just hate him because he's a democrat. Or maybe it's because he's black. Which one is it? |
No, I don't "hate" him...I just don't trust him. I don't trust that he is truly concerned about Illinois. In this he is very similar to Hilary, who chose to make her Senate career in NY, as if the welfare of the people of NY were more important than her own carpetbagging ego and ambition. (she had never even resided in the state)
And for the record, I supported both Harold Washington and Carol Mosely Braun. Yet have always despised Jesse Jackson and Louis Farrakhan. Does that make me a racist?
Read Obama's speech, notice how his father (who abandoned he and his mother) and his African heritage (DNA) is highlighted first.....before coming to his mother and maternal Kansan grandparents (think white/boring) who follow......
And also note that it was his maternal grandparents who largely raised him in Hawaii, yet they don't merit being mentioned prior to his totally uninvolved African grandfather in his Convention speech.
If this isn't USING ONE'S skin color for MAXIMUM Democratic Party effect, I have no idea what is.
Funny thing though, is Kerry still lost, go figure..... |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| sundubuman wrote: |
| huffdaddy wrote: |
Har har. You have shown no evidence to support your claims. Maybe you just hate him because he's a democrat. Or maybe it's because he's black. Which one is it? |
No, I don't "hate" him...I just don't trust him. I don't trust that he is truly concerned about Illinois. In this he is very similar to Hilary, who chose to make her Senate career in NY, as if the welfare of the people of NY were more important than her own carpetbagging ego and ambition. (she had never even resided in the state) |
He isn't similar to Hillary. He first moved to Chicago right after college, in 1985, when he was 23. He didn't even run for public office until 1996. He's spent most of his adult life in Chicago. You must be confusing Obama with Keyes in this regard.
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And for the record, I supported both Harold Washington and Carol Mosely Braun. Yet have always despised Jesse Jackson and Louis Farrakhan. Does that make me a racist? |
Ok, just asking. An awful lot of people voted Republican when Washington ran for mayor.
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Read Obama's speech, notice how his father (who abandoned he and his mother) and his African heritage (DNA) is highlighted first.....before coming to his mother and maternal Kansan grandparents (think white/boring) who follow......
And also note that it was his maternal grandparents who largely raised him in Hawaii, yet they don't merit being mentioned prior to his totally uninvolved African grandfather in his Convention speech. |
Puhlease. And look, the first thing he says is he's from Illinois. Ergo, Illinois is the most important thing to him.
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| If this isn't USING ONE'S skin color for MAXIMUM Democratic Party effect, I have no idea what is. |
Yea, that makes sense. Blacks already overwhelmingly support the Democratic party. And the majority white population is much more likely to vote against a black candidate, merely because he's black, than they are to vote for a candidate, merely because he's black. So why not trot out the new black face of the Democratic Party to hustle up some sympathy votes. Sure thing. How about considering the main reason why he was chosen. Hint: If Obama spoke like GWB, do you think he could even carry Chicago? |
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sundubuman
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: seoul
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:02 am Post subject: |
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btw, I agree that Obama had more Illnois roots than Keyes, that's a no-brainer. But I truly think that this man is smart enough to chart a course for his ambition a decade ahead of time. Seriously.
And I don not think that most Americans care about one's race these days, be they Democrat or Republican. However, it is on;y the Democratic side of the divide that could be energized by such blatant pandering to inclusivity and "coolness" ie. "He's great, you know his Dad's from AFRICA!! Isn't that cool!", said one moveon volunteer to another.
And as I said, his father abandoned him and his mother. |
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sundubuman
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: seoul
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:11 am Post subject: |
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think of it this way.......your father is an American from Texas. He's a cowboy/rancher/line dancer who makes amazing bbq ribs and he once played the banjo professionally.
He met your mother in Mexico while studying. Your mother is, a hippy Canadian organic farmer originally from British Columbia. When you were 2 years old, your Texan father leaves you and your mother, and you are subsequently raised by your loving Canadian grandparents.
However, when you grow up, you find it advantageous to highlight your Texas parentage over and above your Canadian mother's.
Now why would anyone do this?
Ask Barack...he's a wily guy. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:30 am Post subject: |
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| sundubuman wrote: |
| btw, I agree that Obama had more Illnois roots than Keyes, that's a no-brainer. But I truly think that this man is smart enough to chart a course for his ambition a decade ahead of time. Seriously. |
And if so, what of? Like it's a negative to plan your life out? And succeed at it? He was a success as a community organizer. A success at Harvard. A success as a state senator. And, so far, a success as a US senator. The only thing stopping him from going further is the difficulty of being elected President from the Senate and American racism. Would you rather have someone who just fell into power, like GWB?
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| And I don not think that most Americans care about one's race these days, be they Democrat or Republican. |
Which is why there's been such a flood of black governors and congressman lately. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:37 am Post subject: |
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Here are an article about Obama from The Economist. For those of you without a sub, I'll just post it here.
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Lexington
Faith, race and Barack Obama
Jul 6th 2006
From The Economist print edition
There could be far more like him, if gerrymandering vanished
HOW can Americans overcome their divisions? Barack Obama, the son of a lapsed Kenyan Muslim, has some arresting thoughts. On the subject of tackling head-on �the mutual suspicion that sometimes exists between religious America and secular America�, the junior senator from Illinois delivered last week one of the best speeches of his brief career.
He told the story of a doctor who wrote to him when he was running for the Senate in 2004. The doctor said he might vote for Mr Obama, but was repelled by a line on his campaign website promising to fight �right-wing ideologues who want to take away a woman's right to choose�. The doctor wrote: �I sense that you have a strong sense of justice, [but] whatever your convictions, if you truly believe that those who oppose abortion are all ideologues driven by perverse desires to inflict suffering on women, then you, in my judgment, are not fair-minded.�
Mr Obama says he �felt a pang of shame�. The offending words, which he called �standard Democratic boilerplate language�, had been posted on his website by campaign staffers. He had them changed; not because he had changed his mind about abortion, but because he wanted to �extend the same presumption of good faith to others that the doctor had extended to me�.
Concerning the proper role of religion in politics, Mr Obama cautions against extremism of both stripes. Believers cannot abandon what they believe; but in a nation that includes Christians, Jews, Hindus, Muslims, Buddhists and non-believers, �democracy demands that the religiously motivated translate their concerns into universal, rather than religion-specific, values.� Even if all Americans were Christian, it would not be easy to decide which passages of scripture should guide public policy. �Should we go with Leviticus, which suggests slavery is OK and that eating shellfish is abomination?� he asks. �Or should we just stick to the Sermon on the Mount�a passage that is so radical that it's doubtful that our own Defence Department would survive its application?� His elegantly non-committal answer: �Before we get carried away, let's read our Bibles.�
For someone so inexperienced, and whose policies are so ill-defined, Mr Obama is extraordinarily popular. He is only 44, but people are already begging him to run for president. Something about him fills a gap in American politics: he seems not to be faking when he talks of mending America's religious and racial divides. He is that rare thing, a black politician who addresses the whole nation, not just an ethnic enclave.
That this is rare is tragic. It is also virtually inevitable, given the way the electoral system works. As a senator, Mr Obama is accountable to an entire state's voters. But every other black member of Congress sits in the House of Representatives, where most represent gerrymandered majority-black districts. Unlike Mr Obama, they need not bother appealing to whites. They need not worry about the ideological centre ground, either; since no Republican can win a majority-black district, the crucial contest is the Democratic primary, in which only the most passionate Democrats vote.
Racial gerrymandering has two effects. First, and most conspicuously, it allows some crummy candidates to win by prodding racial sore spots. Cynthia McKinney, for example, a congresswoman from Georgia, seems to believe that every misfortune that befalls her or America is somehow rooted in racism. When she was reproached for punching a policeman in March, the real issue, she said, was that he was a racist for not recognising her. Had he realised her rank, he would not have stopped her as she strode past him. Ms McKinney is also known for her interest in conspiracy theories about the murders of Martin Luther King and the rapper Tupac Shakur, and about President George Bush's supposed foreknowledge of the attacks of September 11th 2001. That last enthusiasm cost her her seat in 2002, a misfortune her father blamed on the Jews. But she won it back in 2004.
The second effect of racial gerrymandering is less obvious, but more important. Most members of the congressional black caucus are fine politicians. But the process by which they are chosen practically guarantees that they cluster near one pole of American politics, to the left of most Democrats and indeed most blacks. This makes them less influential than they should be, even when Democrats control the House. And they find the House a rotten launching pad for higher office, because running in a 60% black district is poor preparation for a statewide campaign. Mr Obama is the only black senator, and there are no black governors.
Why polarisers prevail
Fans of racial gerrymandering argue that the Voting Rights Act of 1965 requires it. This is not obvious from the text, but bureaucrats and judges have read it that way. Fretting that racially separate voting districts depend on the �demeaning assumption that voters of a particular race...think alike,� the Supreme Court has occasionally struck down the most contorted gerrymanders (including, in 1995, the first district in Georgia to elect Ms McKinney). But most pass muster, and the civil-rights establishment is zealous in their defence. There was a big hoo-hah two weeks ago when House Republicans postponed a vote to renew for another 25 years certain emergency provisions of the Voting Rights Act�provisions that had originally been due to expire in 1970. This was wrongly portrayed as a reluctance to renew the act itself, which is permanent.
The right of black Americans to vote is no longer up for debate. Unfortunately, there is not much debate about gerrymandering either. Incumbents like picking their voters, whether they are black, white, Republican or Democratic. The practice may help polarise America along racial, religious and political lines, but it also helps them keep their jobs. |
http://www.economist.com/world/na/displaystory.cfm?story_id=E1_STQTRDR |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:39 am Post subject: |
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| sundubuman wrote: |
Now why would anyone do this? |
Why don't you ask GWB why he claims to be from Texas? Or Jeb Bush why he claims to be from Florida? Those guys are pretty wily themselves. Do you have a grudge against them as well? |
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sundubuman
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: seoul
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:53 am Post subject: |
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| huffdaddy wrote: |
| sundubuman wrote: |
Now why would anyone do this? |
Why don't you ask GWB why he claims to be from Texas? Or Jeb Bush why he claims to be from Florida? Those guys are pretty wily themselves. Do you have a grudge against them as well? |
Obviously, I've struck a bit of a nerve with you here.
Let me make this clear. I (so far) have absolutely no problem with Obama in terms of his actions in the Senate (and I voted for him btw). I just have a problem with the way he uses the color of his skin.
Compare him to another famous mixed-race American, Tiger Woods, who married a white girl and never felt the need to wrap himself in his father's DNA (ie, skin color).
And btw, remember, Tiger Woods' father, who recently passed away, never abandoned he and his Thai-American mother.
I'm wondering if Tiger, if he were to decide to enter politics later in life, would choose to move to a majority black district somewhere in Georgia, for strategic reasons. Probably not, because my guess is that he is more of a Republican, so he might take his chances with those racist Republican types in Connecticut or Florida. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| sundubuman wrote: |
| huffdaddy wrote: |
| sundubuman wrote: |
Now why would anyone do this? |
Why don't you ask GWB why he claims to be from Texas? Or Jeb Bush why he claims to be from Florida? Those guys are pretty wily themselves. Do you have a grudge against them as well? |
Obviously, I've struck a bit of a nerve with you here. |
I'm just trying to figure out your double standard. You call Obama a carpet bagger, when you ignore, for one, the B*sh clan. How about Elizabeth Dole? How long was it between her North Carolina stints?
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| Let me make this clear. I (so far) have absolutely no problem with Obama in terms of his actions in the Senate (and I voted for him btw) |
So you didn't vote for Keyes. That's not saying much.
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Let me make this clear. I (so far) have absolutely no problem with Obama in terms of his actions in the Senate (and I voted for him btw). I just have a problem with the way he uses the color of his skin. |
You're ignoring the fact that it's not his choice to highlight his race. People look at him and consider him black. I'd consider it an issue if he looked like Mariah Carey and called himself African-American, but he's identified as black whether he likes it or not. And even in this day and age, black is rarely a political asset.
And so far, the only evidence that you've given that he "uses the color of his skin" is that he recognizes his father, and mentioned him before his mother in his DNC speech. It's not like he trots out the "when I grew up in Birmingham" story to justify all the Dems policies.
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| I'm wondering if Tiger, if he were to decide to enter politics later in life, would choose to move to a majority black district somewhere in Georgia, for strategic reasons. Probably not, because my guess is that he is more of a Republican, so he might take his chances with those racist Republican types in Connecticut or Florida. |
So you'd feel better if he moved to Winnetka? At least then he'd be hanging out with his fellow Harvard Law grads. Would that make him less overtly black? Instead, he moved to an area where he could help people out. People who just happened to be black. And you consider that a negative. |
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EFLtrainer
Joined: 04 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 5:35 am Post subject: |
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Perjorative crap. This is just like Bush calling Democrats and others who oppose him "cut n runners" or saying, as he has over the last week, that the Democrats just want to wait for another attack.
Your comments are no different. There is nothing immoral or unethical in making your heritage part of who and what you are... and what you do. If he were being bigoted in doing so or hypocritical, you'd ahve a point. But I"ve seennothing to show he is.
You, however, have been shown to misrepresent him, if not outright lie about his history. So, do we care what you think about Obama? No.
This is just you trying to change the subject. |
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