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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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 Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 8:00 am Post subject: Re: Beef dispute...SK vs USA |
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| KOREAN_MAN wrote: |
| superacidjax wrote: |
You are just plain wrong. You said the former president of Mexico lives in the US for protection presumably because he signed the NAFTA treaty? First of all President Carlos Salinas de Gortari lives in Europe AND Mexico. His brother Enrique was murdered in 2004 in an extortion plot involving members of mexico's federal police force. Nothing to to with a free trade agreement. |
All I know about the guy is from this documentary made by KBS:
http://www.kbs.co.kr/1tv/sisa/kbsspecial/vod/1398914_11686.html
It's in Korean, but you can still watch it by clicking the green 동영상 56k button. (You do need a registered ID though.) A quick search on Wiki says he lives in Europe now and travels to Mexico. But in the video I thought they said he lives in the U.S.
Who wrote that one-page document? A 7th grader??? I know it's a summary page, but geez...
Anyway, I'll say this again. FTA is NOT free trade. In realty, FTA is what is known as "Preferential Trade Agreement". (Yes, it's called "Free Trade Agreement" but hotdogs are not made of dogs either.)
Free trade has no tarrifs or quotas as you said. IMO, you shouldn't even put country-of-origin tags on imported goods. However, that's not what the U.S. and SK are trying to do right now.
Think about it. It's "free trade." How can you negotiate for something like that? You either have free trade or you don't. Negotiations are not necessary or even possible. But what these two countries are trying to do is to have "free trade" on selective items. I do not consider that free trade by nature. For example, if South Korea must import only U.S. beef without tariffs but nothing else, and the U.S. must accept Korean-made automobiles, clothes, computers, cellphones, wheat, fruit, films, and etc., would you call that free trade? It surely is not "fair" trade.
| superacidjax wrote: |
You don't know know what you're talking about regarding Mexico. Just flat out wrong (or perhaps trying to lay some anti-FTA propaganda.) I lived in Texas nearly my entire life. I have anecdotes about the benefits of NAFTA on the Mexican economy. But, how about listening to the experts:
Dr. Albert Fishlow of the of the Center for Latin American Studies at UC Berkeley said, "NAFTA has had enormous beneficial effects on Mexico�s growth and export profile. Since 1994, exports have grown at an average rate of around 20 percent per year and have changed in type from a concentration in petroleum-based products to manufactures. Contrary to expectations, the economic growth stimulated by NAFTA did not reduce the migration of Mexican labor to the U.S. Instead, during the 1990�s, this labor pool was a boon to U.S. production as well as an important release for Mexico from the pressures generated by a persistently high unemployment rate, the dislocation of rural economies and a growing population. While the U.S. economy was booming, this pattern helped to keep down inflation and wages in the U.S. and boosted Mexico�s economy with a massive inflow of dollars. Currently, for the first time in over a century, Mexico enjoys Latin America�s highest level of per capita income."
Did you read that? Mexico has the highest per capita in Latin America for the first time in over a century. Yeah, Free Trade is really hurting Mexico. I could find documentation all day long about NAFTAs benefits. But hopefully you get the point. |
Again, all I know about Mexico and NAFTA is from the video. Mexicans did not seem happy at all about NAFTA in it. Just watch the video. By the way, is Dr. Albert Fishlow American or Mexican?
| superacidjax wrote: |
Your claim that importing meat from other countries is a bad idea is scientifically and logically ignorant. Perhaps people shouldn't travel either. Humans spread more dangerous diseases than food ever would. Perhaps we should just stay locked up in our little villages and never buy anything from other villages. |
Read my second reply below.
| superacidjax wrote: |
There is no mad cow in the US.
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Believe what you will:
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/1224-06.htm |
Yes, you are right about one thing. The FTA is merely a trade agreement, and does not resemble "free trade". Koreans would never tolerate free trade as mercantilism is the ethnic religion of those people.
But it is necessary to stress that Koreans would still be walking behind oxen or ankle deep in water day in and day out if it were not for preferential American trade policy that allowed Chaebol to export to the USA while American firms not being able to export to Korea. You and your mercantilist peers need to understand that near 100% of your development would not have been possible if it were not for the big bad United States. Fuc%ing USA indeed.
I feel that an increasingly protectionist Democrat party might burst this bubble in a few years. |
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slow_life
Joined: 29 Dec 2006
Location: here
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| Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 11:00 am Post subject: Markhan |
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The many tons of beef shipped to Korea did not contain bone in the sense that we normally think of. The inspectors did a manual check and discovered eleven tiny bone chips the size of your fingernail.......so small that they would not appear on normal inspections done by xray.
Due to these chips found in a few packages, they rejected the entire shipments.
This policy is simply a clever way to keep US beef out of Korea.
I am strongly urging my senators and congressmen to immediately implement the same exact policy on all Korean cars coming into America.........find one flaw and send the entire shipment back.
Seems fair to me. If Koreans are worried about the dangers of mad cow disease from bone chips,,,,,,,,,I am worried about the safety of fellow Americans who drive Korean cars with flaws in them.
Who am I? Just a concerned American who would like to see equal trade treatment for us with our so-called ally, Korea. That's all. |
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4 months left
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: Markhan |
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| slow_life wrote: |
I am strongly urging my senators and congressmen to immediately implement the same exact policy on all Korean cars coming into America.........find one flaw and send the entire shipment back.
Seems fair to me. If Koreans are worried about the dangers of mad cow disease from bone chips,,,,,,,,,I am worried about the safety of fellow Americans who drive Korean cars with flaws in them.
Who am I? Just a concerned American who would like to see equal trade treatment for us with our so-called ally, Korea. That's all. |
The problem with that is there are Hyundai assembly plants in the U.S. I don't understand why U.S. and Canadian governments continue to let Korea and Japan have competitive advantages in the auto industry. |
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slow_life
Joined: 29 Dec 2006
Location: here
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| Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:27 pm Post subject: Re: Markhan |
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The new plants provide jobs in areas having high umemployment. I believe that very few of those operations are unionized. I know BMW is near Greenville, SC and Honda and Toyota have a number of facilities.
I have no problem with foreign auto firms locating in the States as it should motivate GM and Ford to do a better job in designing and selling high quality products.....and if not, sayonara.
What I can't stomach is this BS that Korea signed an agreement to import US beef knowing full well that they would block the beef by implementing stringent examination procedures. Damn, you can't even see these little chips of bone on xray machines.
So, we need to use the same type of procedures with their exported cars, tv's, cell phones, etc etc...........and be very slow in the process. |
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4 months left
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: Markhan |
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| slow_life wrote: |
| I have no problem with foreign auto firms locating in the States as it should motivate GM and Ford to do a better job in designing and selling high quality products.....and if not, sayonara. |
I have no problem either as long as GM and Ford can build and sell cars in Korea and Japan. What would the Korean gov't think if Ford and GM had plants here and sold the cars cheaper than in the U.S. and gave longer warranties....exactly what they are doing in North America. |
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superacidjax
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:44 pm Post subject: Re: Markhan |
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| slow_life wrote: |
| What I can't stomach is this BS that Korea signed an agreement to import US beef knowing full well that they would block the beef by implementing stringent examination procedures. Damn, you can't even see these little chips of bone on xray machines. . |
I think it's stupid that you can import meat with bones. After all the meat is safe for 200+ million Americans, I can't imagine Koreans being affected differently.
I don't know why the beef producers here are even complaining about US beef. SK should allow as much US beef as the US wants to send. Why? Because Korean beef is "the best in the world" right? So why would anyone buy American beef if Korean beef is just so darn superior? Why are Korean beef producers worried? Hmmm. |
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Milwaukiedave
Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Location: Goseong
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| Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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I tend to agree with what the majority of people are saying in this thread, which is that Korea's protectionism will only hurt their own economy.
I find the beef import ban rediculous and think it's just a scam to keep out American beef. So much for free trade.
Maybe it's time to start slapping import taxes on Korean electronic goods. |
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crsandus
Joined: 05 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 11:55 am Post subject: |
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So just last week when I was in Incheon visiting family, I had a beef with this guy's beef with American beef... So somehow in the course of a discussion, I mentioned that my family in states had gotten 214 lbs of beef (ground beef, steaks, roasts) basically 1/4 a cow for around ~$400. We had bought from a family friend who raises cows to get slaughtered. After a second or two, he proceeds to tell me that Korean beef is better than American beef.
I was thisclose to telling him that any superiority of the Korean beef was ruined by the fact that they can't cook beef woth s**t and ruin it but then I figured that it would be childish and it'd be arguing about opinion vs opinion with no real set facts to support either argument... It just really bothered me when he said that Korean beef was better as matter of fact.
Anyway, it's obvious that the Korean government is being dumb about the beef embargo. While mad cow has been discovered in America, the primary method of spreading the disease (eg. using cow parts as protein feed for other cows) has been virtually eliminated and it wasn't all the common in the states from the get go. I'd maybe listen to the arguments if the US had some case of mad cow hitting the human population.
Last edited by crsandus on Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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JeJuJitsu
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Location: McDonald's
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Korean beef is awful. |
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JeJuJitsu
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Location: McDonald's
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 4:56 pm Post subject: Re: Markhan |
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| slow_life wrote: |
The many tons of beef shipped to Korea did not contain bone in the sense that we normally think of. The inspectors did a manual check and discovered eleven tiny bone chips the size of your fingernail.......so small that they would not appear on normal inspections done by xray.
Due to these chips found in a few packages, they rejected the entire shipments.
This policy is simply a clever way to keep US beef out of Korea.
I am strongly urging my senators and congressmen to immediately implement the same exact policy on all Korean cars coming into America.........find one flaw and send the entire shipment back.
Seems fair to me. If Koreans are worried about the dangers of mad cow disease from bone chips,,,,,,,,,I am worried about the safety of fellow Americans who drive Korean cars with flaws in them.
Who am I? Just a concerned American who would like to see equal trade treatment for us with our so-called ally, Korea. That's all. |
I read that the US guys' want the bones fragments because they think they were planted, but the Korean guys won't turn over the fragments for testing...hmmm...now why wouldn't you allow bone fragments to be tested? Hmmm... |
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superacidjax
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| crsandus wrote: |
After a second or two, he proceeds to tell me that Korean beef is better than American beef
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With the difficulties in getting American beef over here, I wonder how the hell anyone knows Korean beef is better? Ever had Kobe beef? If the Koreans got ahold of that stuff, there would be a serious problem. The best beef in the world coming from, (gasp!) Japan. They'd probably start a war over it. Or claim that Koreans invented it.
Of course Kobe beef is only about 700 gazillion dollars a kilo. So it might be cheaper than Korean beef..  |
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RACETRAITOR
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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The Americans get no sympathy from me over beef bans.
I think it shows how much Korea is the US' biatch that they opened up their borders to American beef at all, yet still no mention of Canadian beef. |
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ChuckECheese
Joined: 20 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| ..... yet still no mention of Canadian beef. |
Canadians produce and export beef?  |
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superacidjax
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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| I want steak right now. I might have to go to the Miguem Outback? Anyone want to come? See you in 15 minutes! |
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rothkowitz
Joined: 27 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| superacidjax wrote: |
| crsandus wrote: |
After a second or two, he proceeds to tell me that Korean beef is better than American beef
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With the difficulties in getting American beef over here, I wonder how the hell anyone knows Korean beef is better? Ever had Kobe beef? If the Koreans got ahold of that stuff, there would be a serious problem. The best beef in the world coming from, (gasp!) Japan. They'd probably start a war over it. Or claim that Koreans invented it.
Of course Kobe beef is only about 700 gazillion dollars a kilo. So it might be cheaper than Korean beef.. |
If you're talking about the cattle that are pampered and fed beer that's way out of most people's budget.
I think the type of cattle though is Wagye
The fat is finely marbled through the meat ,so,when you fry it it just nicely melts through the flesh.By contrast the cheap Ozzie beef,whilst OK by quanity,is only really fit for stewing as the fat is really hard and the flesh itself pretty dry.
The nice Ozzie beef will cost you a lot(unless you shop at Costco).
A combination of Wagye(with domestic cattle) and grass feed could make some darn fine stuff.
It probably won't become generally available though(it'll still cost a lot)but if there's a beef night at a hotel restaurant it could be worth checking out.Make mine bloody. |
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