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time to invade burma?
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chris_J2



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 4:13 am    Post subject: Myanmar Reply with quote

Looks like Myanmar is now prepared to accept ASEAN, acting as an intermediary, for Western powers it distrusts. (Paranoia is alive & well).

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601091&sid=abq_dld28HX8&refer=india

Not an ideal situation, but better than nothing. In view of past corruption by Myanmar thugs (swapping high quality relief aid food for low quality rotting food & stamping it's own name, over the top of International relief), I worry how much aid will actually get through?
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Grab the Chickens Levi



Joined: 29 Apr 2008
Location: Ilsan

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 4:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Myanmar Reply with quote

chris_J2 wrote:
Looks like Myanmar is now prepared to accept ASEAN, acting as an intermediary, for Western powers it distrusts. (Paranoia is alive & well).

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601091&sid=abq_dld28HX8&refer=india

Not an ideal situation, but better than nothing. In view of past corruption by Myanmar thugs (swapping high quality relief aid food for low quality rotting food & stamping it's own name, over the top of International relief), I worry how much aid will actually get through?


This is why we should just let them sort themselves out. Really. You think for one second if their was a simmilar crisis in the Uk or US - countries like Myanmar would be wanting to help out....? Help the people who roll equally with you, leave the rest to it.
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mises



Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The reason it will accept ASEAN is because of the Junta's close relationship with the PAP in Singapore. The generals only trust the Singaporeans. The Singaporeans are the leading arms supplier to Burma. The Singaporeans built the Burmese IT infrastructure (modeled after their own, to ensure total control). The kids of the Junta study in Singapore and the Generals use the private medical facilities in Singapore when they are ill. Any negotiated settlement that involves the Junta leaving will be brokered with Lee Kwan Yew. Lastly, the vast majority of plunder is in private Singaporean accounts.

Singapore will lean on the Junta because the relationship right now if very profitable for both.

The West doesn't run the world. We don't have to take care of every problem that jumps at us from every corner of the world. Burma is in Asia. Let the Asians handle it.
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mrgiles



Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sigh i always make poor judgements when i'm too hungover to do something more constructive. like weigh into an argument like this here. my hangover may also have something to do with my poor choice of words - it's a little inaccurate to call the afghan situation a "yank invasion." my bad. but i feel i shd respond anyways.

first of all i agree that the burmese situation is a monumental tragedy that shd be in all our minds, and something the entire international community should be deeply concerned with and involved in. still, i would stand by my opposition to an external military intervention. let's hope this small and ambiguous asean step helps.

now, to what i disagree with:

Quote:
So if a government under duress, as Kharzai's has been, no thanks to Musharaff's "truce" with the Pakistani border tribes and al-Qaeda operatives, isn't playing "nice," they're suspect. Wow, that's a brilliant deduction. Dang.


perhaps i was being too delicate with my "not nice" phrase. how about this afghani mp's description of the situation?

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/female-mp-tells-of-rights-catastrophe/2007/03/08/1173166861303.html

i.e. that there have been no significant changes in the human rights situation under the kharzai government. of course just one quote like this is unbalanced, but it does help to get something that goes beyond the official line. btw as u know, the military dictator musharaff, until recently, has been a good friend of the states. as were the taliban government of afghanistan during their "war on drugs". things only changed when the awe-inspiring rhetorical work achieved by the us goverment at the time used the boogeyman of bin-laden as a major incentive to lead a multinational force into the country. what i object to is the total flippancy in regard to international law that the instigation and progress of that war represented, and how the ramifications of it helped lead to the situation in iraq.

Quote:
So it is. By the time commonwealthers get done rendering themselves unemployable in modern labor markets via a 4 year and 40grand liberal arts degree, they have have also absorbed 4 years of American-centric nonsense that further leaves them unable to comment on any subject without bringing up those darn Americans.

"Hey, kiwi, did you hear about that terrible car accident in Suwon?" "Yeah, it reminded me of the Iraq war!". Etc.


ur characterisation of me is cute, if a little inaccurate. it made me giggle, anyway. sorry for going on about this here (i wish i hadn't ploughed into this now), but what i was reacting against was the heft of the op, which seemed to encourage a military invasion.
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chris_J2



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 10:24 pm    Post subject: Myanmar Reply with quote

GTCL wrote

Quote:
You think for one second if their (sic) was a simmilar (sic) crisis in the Uk or US - countries like Myanmar would be wanting to help out....?


After Katrina, a whole raft of impoverished nations offered (& gave) help to the US:

Afghanistan
Pledged $100,000 to the hurricane victims.

Bangladesh
Donated humanitarian aid worth $1 million and said it would send 160 disaster management experts, including doctors, nurses, engineers and others.

Cambodia
The king donated $20,000 to match the $20,000 Cambodian government donation.

People's Republic of China
On September 2, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that it will offer $5 million along with emergency supplies, including 1,000 tents, 600 generators, bed sheets, immediately for disaster relief. China also offered to send medical care and rescue workers if they were needed.[5] This aid package consisting of 104 tons of supplies later arrived in Little Rock, Arkansas.[6] A chartered plane carrying the supplies arrived on September 7.[7]

India
India offered to contribute $5 million to the United States Red Cross for relief and rehabilitation of the victims. They also offered to donate medicines and large water purification systems for use in households and small communities in the stricken areas, where potable water was a key concern.[15] India sent tarps, blankets and hygiene kits. An Indian Air Force IL-76 aircraft delivered 25 tonnes of relief supplies for the Hurricane Katrina victims at the Little Rock Air Force Base, Arkansas on September 13, 2005.[16]

Indonesia
Offered to send 45 doctors and 155 other medical staffers and 10,000 blankets to help survivors.

Iraq
Pledged $1 million to the Red Cross via the Red Crescent.

Malaysia
Pledged $1 million to American Red Cross.

Singapore
Main article: Singaporean response to Hurricane Katrina
Three Singaporean CH-47 Chinook helicopters and thirty-eight RSAF personnel from a training detachment based in Grand Prairie, Texas assisted in relief operations from 1 September. They had so far ferried about 700 evacuees and hauled tons of supplies in 39 sorties on 4 September. One more CH-47 Chinook helicopter was sent to aid in relief efforts.[27]

Thailand
Sent at least 60 doctors and nurses along with rice.

Vietnam
Pledged $100,000.

Myanmar was conspicuous by its absence. It also missed out on the widespread devastation caused by the tsunami in 2004.

What goes around, comes around. Many of the above nations, have not forgotten the outstanding help that the US gave them, post 2004 tsunami & the recovery effort.

The full list of donor countries & source here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_response_to_Hurricane_Katrina#Pledges_from_Countries


Last edited by chris_J2 on Tue May 20, 2008 5:32 am; edited 2 times in total
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wannago



Joined: 16 Apr 2004

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From the above website, I thought this was the most telling point of all:

Quote:
An article in the April 29, 2007 Washington Post claimed that of the $854 million offered by foreign countries, whom the article dubs "allies," to the US Government, only $40 million of the funds had been spent "for disaster victims or reconstruction" as of the date of publication (less than 5%).[42]

Additionally, a large portion of the $854 million in aid offered went uncollected, including over $400 million in oil (almost 50%).[43]

The report "Transforming the Aid Environment" argues that the "way in which the United States perceives foreign aid is perhaps best understood in the way in which the country acts when they are the recipient nation. When other countries offered the United States $854 million in cash and oil as foreign aid to help the areas devastated by Hurricane Katrina, they merely accepted 4.7% of the total aid offered, the rest went uncollected. There is no reason for not accepting the available resources, other than that aid is a political tool. The United States wanted to avoid the political influence aid has on the policies of the recipient nation."
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chris_J2



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.

PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 6:05 pm    Post subject: Myanmar Reply with quote

http://www.voanews.com/english/2008-05-27-voa68.cfm

"One Million Cyclone Victims Have Received Aid in Burma... Byrs says the U.N. has huge warehouses in Rangoon and Bangkok where they can store relief items. She says the so-called air bridge between Bangkok and Rangoon is working well with 10 to 15 humanitarian flights taking off every day."

That's the good news. Now, the bad news:

"It says nearly 1.5 million people in the hard-hit Irrawaddy Delta have not received any international aid."

"We estimate that still around one million people have not been reached at all in the Irrawaddy Delta and since we estimate that roughly 40 percent of them are children, we can estimate some 400,000 children are not reached at all," Klaus said. "We know that hundreds of unaccompanied children have been seen and registered, including infants, children under two years of age, who need urgent support."
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