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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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 Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| Adventurer wrote: |
| I was partially joking and partially serious about those who talk about California, Texas, and Arizona were for Mexico. By the time the US took those areas, Mexico, as a state, was only a few decades old... |
This partially reflects the usual U.S.-centric bias, among many other problems.
I recall reading one Mexican nationalist historian's work, where he claimed that the United States had seized Mexico's Far North/America's Southwest from the Mexican govt, which had inherited those lands from the Spanish govt, which in turn had "an ancient and peaceable claim" there. Not true.
For one thing, we all know that Spain seized everything it had in the western hemisphere through conquistadores and missionaries. These two forces, especially benefitting from the diseases they unknowingly carried, destroyed entire civilizations in their wake. And when necessary, such as during the Pueblo Revolt, imperial Spain enforced its hold through military retaliation re: indigenous inhabitants. Further, by the time nationalist Mexico emerged, these claims had become far more de jure than de facto. By the time nationalist America emerged, through market forces, it had developed a de facto hold there.
Newish book treats this, Adventurer. Check out Andres Resendez's Changing National Identities at the Frontier: Texas and New Mexico, 1800-1850.
Further, this entire discourse, mostly constructed for nationalist Mexicans, Mexican-Americans, Chicanos, and revisionist Americans to attack the American past, does not address how and why nationalist Mexico also lost Central America, more or less at the same time, which then fragmented into the five independent republics we see on today's map. And there were hemispheric wars stemming from a general decolonization crisis involving all the new nation-states which carved out their place's on today's map through seizing and holding lands others could not. In the Paraguay vs. Brazil, Uruguay, and Argentina wars, for one; Peru and Bolivia vs. Chile wars for another.
| Leslie Cheswyck wrote: |
| Mexico stole their land from the Indians, just like we did. So let's get off the soap box already. |
Do not forget that re: "the Indians": there were many different peoples and cultures. And they themselves had a long history of brutalizing each other and seizing each other's lands, while sacrificing, enslaving, and/or dispossessing large numbers.
I hope no one here is going to complain and/or allege that "Mexico" rightfully belongs to the Aztecs or before them the Toltecs, for instance...
Last edited by Gopher on Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:45 am; edited 1 time in total |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:45 am Post subject: |
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Nonsense. The Indians were singing with birds in a better than Eden setting, until white people arrived.
Anyways, who cares about how the South West became America. It is America, just as Canada is Canada. If the Mexicans in the US actually try to separate the primary outcome will be fields of dead Mexicans. Ask the Confederates how the Federal government deals with this. |
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