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What�s So Great About Seoul?
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nukeday

Joined: 13 May 2010

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:32 pm Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

nukeday wrote:

Yeah, so many jobs available for Koreans thanks to the weak won.....

You do realize that a strong currency is a bad thing for an export driven economy right?

Do you even know what having a strong and a weak currency means?

I know what it means. Even if I didn't, the same arguments come up with every currency exchange thread...Wait, is this a currency exchange thread? Whatever. Your statements

"People buying your stuff ensures employment and job opportunities.

Or you could have a strong currency and then have to go to a country with a weak currency to find a job. Ahem."

are rather strong for a country that while has a fairly low unemployment rate, has a massive underemployment problem.

nukeday

Joined: 13 May 2010

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:34 pm Post subject:

Yaya wrote:

nukeday wrote:

The subway is nice, but the lack of any express trains, in my view, makes it vastly inferior to New York's dirty, expensive system.

And a subway system is not a tourist attraction, so, good luck with that.

Uh, they have express trains on the No. 1 and 9 lines.

Yeah, mostly aimed at getting to the sticks, not around the city. Your point? It really shouldn't take an hour to get from Gangnam to Hongdae when there is not a single transfer involved.

Several lines in NY (and multiple other cities) have express trains.

Oh yeah, I forgot, NY is 24 hours too.

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 11:35 pm Post subject:

nukeday wrote:

Steelrails wrote:

nukeday wrote:

Yeah, so many jobs available for Koreans thanks to the weak won.....

You do realize that a strong currency is a bad thing for an export driven economy right?

Do you even know what having a strong and a weak currency means?

But then so does the country back home. So I'd rather take the one with low unemployment and massive underemployment than the one with high unemployment and high underemployment. It also helps that one pursues protectionist trade policies.

Bottom line is that I ain't hearing stories about Ulsan turning into a wasteland and thousands of shipping and auto manufacturing workers wondering where their jobs and their futures went. Keep in mind I come from Michigan.

So yeah, we had a strong dollar and could buy cheap imported crap at Wal-Mart. Whoop de doo.

I'd rather a weak dollar and having to pay a pretty penny for imported goods with the car companies churning out exports rather than the current wasteland.

But yeah, argue for a strong won and open trade policies see what that does to your Joe Ajosshi and Jane Ajumma who send your kids to the hagwon that pays your bills. But hey, you can always be a nomad and just move onto the next country.

But back to what makes Seoul Great- The Freedom you have as a non-Korean. Without the Thailand seediness to it, minus the uptightness of a more western locale.

Yaya

Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Location: Seoul

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 11:43 pm Post subject:

nukeday wrote:

Yaya wrote:

nukeday wrote:

Uh, they have express trains on the No. 1 and 9 lines.

The Seoul subway DOES have express lines, my point stands. You can get from Yeouido to the Gangnam station area (Shinnonhyeon on the No. 9 line) in just 15 minutes on the express.

jvalmer

Joined: 06 Jun 2003

Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:51 am Post subject:

Modernist wrote:

Quote:

I'd take ugly buildings anyday if it meant my country could have those things.

Quote:

Asians want to see what an affluent society would be like, hence the reason wanting to visit places like Korea

Missing the point. Is Korea the only model of becoming affluent in Asia? No. So for poor places like Cambodia, Laos, parts of Indonesia, etc, the question is why look to Korea [and Seoul, specifically] as a model, when Koreans have done such a poor job COMPARED TO other Asian countries and major cities?

Are you really going to argue that Cambodians, of all people, would look to Seoul instead of, I don't know, Singapore, which happens to be right on their doorstep? Singapore is cleaner, has far better architecture, better food, more cultural diversity, is a destination for travelers, on and on. THAT is a model for the poorer countries. Not even to speak of Bangkok, which is really the capital of SE Asia--I'm quite sure Cambodians would pick there over Seoul if you asked them about the future of Phnom Penh, with its lovely architecture and historic neighborhoods and character that Korea can only envy.

Japan is a model [did you think Korea thought of the KTX on its own?]. Hong Kong is a model. The wealthiest cities in China, like Guangzhou, are becoming models as we speak. Korea, and Seoul, are NOT models of development for anyone in this hemisphere, and their lack of a global identity proves it. Hyundai and Samsung and big shipyards don't add up to a place the world wants to go, or be. Buy their stuff, sure. But there's more to life and living than swiping a credit card. At least, if you DON'T live in Korea.

I think you're reading a little too deep into what I'm saying. I'm just saying that Korea is an affluent country, and poorer Asians like seeing that. That's all. They see some fancy TV show and just want to go shopping without seeing some kid begging for money. Seoul can offer that. Nothing about Korea, or Seoul, being a model, although they aren't doing too bad in that.

rainism

Joined: 13 Apr 2011

Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:33 am Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

nukeday wrote:

Yeah, so many jobs available for Koreans thanks to the weak won.....

You do realize that a strong currency is a bad thing for an export driven economy right?

Do you even know what having a strong and a weak currency means?

it also means you're fanning the flames of inflation, which given its usual Korean levels is a very dangerous thing to do. Even the "official" inflation levels (easily understated by a factor of two or more) have been flashing "red" for the last 6 months. Do you think the govt intervention to keep the won weak in 2010 may have had something do to with it?

try buying anything non Korean made in Korea. How's that feel?

finally. Korea has to import all of its energy. It pays more for its oil because it keeps its own currency artificially weak. This also means that transport prices are more expensive, which is passed down to the consumer.

enjoying your humid Korean summer without any decent AC because your school is trying to "save energy"?

Rolling Eyes

Modernist

Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: The 90s

Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 4:38 am Post subject:

Quote:

I think you're reading a little too deep into what I'm saying.

Fair enough, but I was more responding to the other guy's rambling than your post. I'm really just asking people to look at Seoul and what it is today REASONABLY compared to other major Asian metros/capitals, and tell me it isn't wanting in a LOT of areas where you might expect better considering its wealth and level of development. No, there's not begging on the streets [but I hope the 'poor Asians' are prepared when they come out of Seoul Station the first time], but there is far less culture, far less beauty, far less distinctiveness than Koreans [and foreign defenders] like to imagine. Maybe you don't care about the block architecture, but this deficit shows itself in many other ways if you care to look for it.

It's a shame and a disappointment and it will have to be acknowledged and addressed if Seoul wants to have an identity and tout anything beyond its malls, its subway and K-Wave.

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 5:01 am Post subject:

rainism wrote:

Steelrails wrote:

nukeday wrote:

Yeah, so many jobs available for Koreans thanks to the weak won.....

You do realize that a strong currency is a bad thing for an export driven economy right?

Do you even know what having a strong and a weak currency means?

But the fact at the end of the day is that we are working here because that is our best bet for employment.

I can live without foreign goods. I treat them as luxuries, not necessities.

And yes it has to import its energy. So do other countries. Given its lack of natural resources and it being for all intents and purposes, this is not surprising. But better it does that that with plenty of manufacturing jobs available than not.

At the end of the day give me exports over cheap imported consumer goods.

My foreign smokes are cheap.
S.Korea's economy is flawed, don't get me wrong. But as long as they have a manufacturing base, I think they're pursuing the right course. You have to have decent paying jobs for people who don't go to college.

Highwayman

Joined: 22 May 2011

Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 5:27 pm Post subject:

Modernist wrote:

Are you really going to argue that Cambodians, of all people, would look to Seoul instead of, I don't know, Singapore, which happens to be right on their doorstep? Singapore is cleaner, has far better architecture, better food, more cultural diversity, is a destination for travelers, on and on. THAT is a model for the poorer countries. Not even to speak of Bangkok, which is really the capital of SE Asia--I'm quite sure Cambodians would pick there over Seoul if you asked them about the future of Phnom Penh, with its lovely architecture and historic neighborhoods and character that Korea can only envy.

Having lived in Phnom Penh for ten years, I can confidently say you're completely wrong about Cambodians.

cwflaneur

Joined: 04 Aug 2009

Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 6:49 pm Post subject:

Four season.

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