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cabeza
Joined: 29 Sep 2012
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 Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Threequalseven wrote: |
| I'm genuinely curious what values are instilled in Korean households. I'm not trying to be snide.....What principles are taught here? |
A very good question.
Study hard would be near top of the list.
I used the line "Your mothers would be so disappointed in you" after I caught a bunch of university aged "kids" cheating on a poxy, no credit test. The reply I got was "No they wouldn't. They want me to do anything to get good grade". |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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This article isn't about foreign mothers. People should stop slagging on Korean mothers here. I may not agree with a lot of parenting I see here, and I think the high suicide rate, rampant alcoholism and general distaste for life found here in Korea attests to that (I like being here as a foreigner, but I think I'd hate being a Korean in Korea). Despite all that, I don't think there's any question that the majority of mothers in every corner of the world do what they believe is best for their children. I think it's fine to mock anyone and give a little when you get a little. But at the end of the day going on and on about Korean mothers is doing exactly what this hack writer was doing.
Naw, this article was about the standard nationalism and ethnocentricism in Korea, with a heaping dose of conformity. There is only one way to do things in Korea, the "Korean way", and any deviation from that is "bad". This conformity used to just be a hammer to force the errand nails of this society down, but in modern times it's used more as tool for keeping the outside world at bay.
Anyone who's been here for more than a week has experienced that. To this day I'm told regularly that I eat galbi wrong, for example. Like meat on fire is an exclusive Korean invention and any way but the standard way of doing it is an affront to the norms Koreans have accepted. But really, it's not about me eating galbi. It's about reinforcing hundreds of years of conformity. Again, to me it's very simple minded and ultimately harms a society. But, again, it's not my country and I'm not an expert.
So, basically, this article has nothing to do with foreign mothers. It has everything to do to remind Koreans that they are doing it the right way and if they start giving into these evil foreign ideas then they are betraying their home. It's not about us. It's about them. |
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cabeza
Joined: 29 Sep 2012
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| Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
This article isn't about foreign mothers. People should stop slagging on Korean mothers here. I may not agree with a lot of parenting I see here, and I think the high suicide rate, rampant alcoholism and general distaste for life found here in Korea attests to that (I like being here as a foreigner, but I think I'd hate being a Korean in Korea). Despite all that, I don't think there's any question that the majority of mothers in every corner of the world do what they believe is best for their children. I think it's fine to mock anyone and give a little when you get a little. But at the end of the day going on and on about Korean mothers is doing exactly what this hack writer was doing.
Naw, this article was about the standard nationalism and ethnocentricism in Korea, with a heaping dose of conformity. There is only one way to do things in Korea, the "Korean way", and any deviation from that is "bad". This conformity used to just be a hammer to force the errand nails of this society down, but in modern times it's used more as tool for keeping the outside world at bay.
Anyone who's been here for more than a week has experienced that. To this day I'm told regularly that I eat galbi wrong, for example. Like meat on fire is an exclusive Korean invention and any way but the standard way of doing it is an affront to the norms Koreans have accepted. But really, it's not about me eating galbi. It's about reinforcing hundreds of years of conformity. Again, to me it's very simple minded and ultimately harms a society. But, again, it's not my country and I'm not an expert.
So, basically, this article has nothing to do with foreign mothers. It has everything to do to remind Koreans that they are doing it the right way and if they start giving into these evil foreign ideas then they are betraying their home. It's not about us. It's about them. |
You are right of course. But:
Increased IQ from using chopsticks
The only country with 4 distinct seasons
The spiciest food in the world
Do you know kimchi?
Kpop is popular everywhere
I can laugh those ones off and find them funny more than annoying
Saying that Korean mothers love their children more than any other mothers is just offensive. And dumb. That one gets on my *beep* more than any other. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
| It has everything to do to remind Koreans that they are doing it the right way and if they start giving into these evil foreign ideas then they are betraying their home. It's not about us. It's about them. |
So why is it written in English and in the Korea Herald? |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| cabeza wrote: |
The only country with 4 distinct seasons
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One of my Korean listening practice pieces recently was a discussion of things Koreans do which embarrass other Koreans. The four seasons thing was mentioned as an example. The speaker explained it in terms of historic comparisons between Korea and tropical regions having resulted in a cultural habit which simply stuck. Whether that's true or not I don't know, but it's definitely something of which Koreans are aware. I actually haven't heard the "four seasons" bit in quite some time, now that I think about it. |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Scorpion wrote: |
| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
| It has everything to do to remind Koreans that they are doing it the right way and if they start giving into these evil foreign ideas then they are betraying their home. It's not about us. It's about them. |
So why is it written in English and in the Korea Herald? |
I think it's a subconscious thing. I meant that talking about this stuff is a need in many Koreans to reaffirm their idea of right and wrong, conformity and anarchy, etc. I know I wasn't clear (and still may not be), but what I meant was saying this sort of stuff helps many Koreans feel good about how they see the world. Like the ajoshi who 'corrects' my galbi eating, I'll never eat it 'right' in his eyes because it has nothing to do with me and my galbi eating style (and yes, I have a galbi eating style). He's just saying that stuff to let himself know that he is right and that others are wrong. It's how he handles what he perceives to be the threat of change and new ideas.
This isn't unique to Korea or Koreans, either. It's the old "making fun of others makes me feel better about myself" rule. The bully doesn't care about the bullied. He cares about reinforcing his worldview and strengthening his own self-image through the damage of another's. Nothing the bullied kid does will correct the situation, it's all in the bully's head. |
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Juregen
Joined: 30 May 2006
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| Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| misher wrote: |
Dedicate time for their children for what?
Not sayimg the western way is perfect. The hands off, everyone is a winner, you can be a flower if you want to be a flower is actually pretty bad for many reasons but I actually think the Korean way is worse and incredibly selfish because it's entirely about image. |
That is not typical Western, American, maybe, but not Western. |
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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 12:11 am Post subject: |
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| Juregen wrote: |
| misher wrote: |
Dedicate time for their children for what?
Not sayimg the western way is perfect. The hands off, everyone is a winner, you can be a flower if you want to be a flower is actually pretty bad for many reasons but I actually think the Korean way is worse and incredibly selfish because it's entirely about image. |
That is not typical Western, American, maybe, but not Western. |
Not my part of America. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 12:27 am Post subject: |
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| He's coming at it the wrong way. A country can't create its own cultural icons in this way it has to get a reputation naturally. When I lived in Italy, for example, Italian people didn't go around claiming Italian men were more handsome or stylish but they somehow still got the reputation for it in the UK and other countries (despite not really living up to it in the main - outside Milan) This guy claiming Korean mothers are ace is like Paul Ince giving himself the nickname 'the governor'. People will just take the piss. |
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meangradin
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 3:44 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Seriously? The Korean NYTimes book buying conspiracy? |
Actually, I was challenging and offering a different reason than the author's assertion that because the book sold well in the States, that people (non Korean- Americans) are interested in the Korean mother. No conspiracy here! Just a possible third variable explanation. But I guess the paranoid mind sees conspiracy in everything. |
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gforce645
Joined: 02 May 2011
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 3:53 am Post subject: |
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This is how I imagine most Korean guys are after they leave home or move out of Korea. Note - Click on the link if youre a fan of Arrested Development
http://i.qkme.me/3ud5r7.jpg |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 5:20 am Post subject: |
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This is how I imagine most Korean guys are after they leave home or move out of Korea. Note - Click on the link if youre a fan of Arrested Development
http://i.qkme.me/3ud5r7.jpg |
Only in today's depressing, valueless society both in Korea and here can the idea of thinking that mom is great and wanting to give her a call be an object of derision. It's sad that people who leave the coop want to forget their mother hen.
You only have one mother and family. Show them some love and respect. Grow up, we aren't in high school anymore. What if your mom gets cancer or something? What if you get cancer? Are you just going to want to fight it on your own and receive no support?
Sorry, but the people who bother to give mom a phone call are NOT the ones who are immature and irresponsible.
Last edited by Steelrails on Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:08 am; edited 2 times in total |
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faeriehazel
Joined: 04 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 5:59 am Post subject: |
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| Threequalseven wrote: |
I personally think these mothers who send their kids to academies, where they're beaten by their teachers, and spend their own time relaxing at coffee shops and bragging to other moms about how good of a parent they are because their kids are getting a good education should be jailed for child abuse.
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Look, I disagree with the Korean education system as much as the next person, and I would never in a million years subject my kids to that shit. But most Korean moms don't just send their kids to hakwon and then sit around "relaxing at coffee shops." They work very hard to get their kids what they consider good opportunities. They are constantly networking with other moms to try and find the best teachers, the best hakwons, the best afterschool activities that would look good on a college application. They are misguided, certainly, but the same is true of many moms in the US. If you look at places like NYC they have moms with 6 year olds already worrying about how they're going to send their kids to Harvard. It's not a phenomenon unique to Korea; it's just more widespread here.
I'm more annoyed at the constant need for Koreans to elevate the mother to perfect angel status. It does no one in the family any favors. Korean families would be a lot healthier if the mom wasn't expected to be some kind of martyr for the sake of her children. |
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cdninkorea
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:03 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Only in today's depressing, valueless society can the idea of thinking that mom is great and wanting to give her a call be an object of derision. |
No one is saying that there's anything wrong with Koreans thinking their moms are great. It's just that the author of this article pretends all Korean mothers are the best (no neglect or abuse in Korea?), ignores and even denigrates fathers (by saying a home without a mother isn't really a home), only compares Korea to the US, and only uses an anecdotal case (his friend) and a comedy show (The Big Bang Theory) to support his claims. And this is an academic at a top Korean school?! |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:06 am Post subject: |
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| cdninkorea wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| Only in today's depressing, valueless society can the idea of thinking that mom is great and wanting to give her a call be an object of derision. |
No one is saying that there's anything wrong with Koreans thinking their moms are great. It's just that the author of this article pretends all Korean mothers are the best (no neglect or abuse in Korea?), ignores and even denigrates fathers (by saying a home without a mother isn't really a home), only compares Korea to the US, and only uses an anecdotal case (his friend) and a comedy show (The Big Bang Theory) to support his claims. And this is an academic at a top Korean school?! |
Wasn't talking about the article. I was talking about the post above mine. I'll edit my post to make it more clear.
Yeah, the article sucks. |
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