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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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 Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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And from the article you referenced:
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Hindu numerals in the first century AD
The first inscriptions using 0 in India have been traced to approximately AD 400. Aryabhata's numerical code also represents a full knowledge of the zero symbol. By the time of Bhaskara I (i.e., the seventh century AD) a base 10 numeral system with 9 symbols was widely used in India, and the concept of zero (represented by a dot) was known (see the Vāsavadattā of Subandhu, or the definition by Brahmagupta). It is possible, however, that the invention of the zero sign took place sometime in the first century when the Buddhist philosophy of shunyata (zero-ness) gained ascendancy.
How the numbers came to the Arabs can be read in the work of al-Qifti's "Chronology of the scholars", which was written around the end the 12th century but quoted earlier sources (see [1]):
... a person from India presented himself before the Caliph al-Mansur in the year 776 CE who was well versed in the siddhanta method of calculation related to the movement of the heavenly bodies, and having ways of calculating equations based on the half-chord [essentially the sine] calculated in half-degrees ... Al-Mansur ordered this book to be translated into Arabic, and a work to be written, based on the translation, to give the Arabs a solid base for calculating the movements of the planets ...
This book, which the Indian scholar presented from, was likely Brahmasphutasiddhanta (The Opening of the Universe) which was written in 628 CE by the Indian mathematician Brahmagupta and had used the Hindu Numerals with the zero sign.
The numeral system came to be known to both the Persian mathematician Al-Khwarizmi, whose book On the Calculation with Hindu Numerals written about 825, and the Arab mathematician Al-Kindi, who wrote four volumes (see [2]) "On the Use of the Indian Numerals" (Ketab fi Isti'mal al-'Adad al-Hindi) about 830, are principally responsible for the diffusion of the Indian system of numeration in the Middle-East and the West . In the tenth century AD, Middle-Eastern mathematicians extended the decimal numeral system to include fractions, as recorded in a treatise by Syrian mathematician Abu'l-Hasan al-Uqlidisi in 952-3.
Fibonacci, an Italian mathematician who had studied in Bejaia (Bougie), Algeria, promoted the Arabic numeral system in Europe with his book Liber Abaci, which was published in 1202. The system did not come into wide use in Europe, however, until the invention of printing (See, for example, the 1482 Ptolemaeus map of the world printed by Lienhart Holle in Ulm, and other examples in the Gutenberg Museum in Mainz, Germany.)
It should be noted that in the Arab World—until modern times—the Arabic numeral system was used only by mathematicians. Muslim scientists used the Babylonian numeral system, and merchants used a numeral system similar to the Greek numeral system and the Hebrew numeral system. Therefore, it was not until Fibonacci that the Arabic numeral system was used by a large population. |
Which part of India, I wonder? There was a Greek kingdom in northern India and Pakistan until when Jesus was a wee lad.
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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Ha, I just found something funny:
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| The term "Arabic numerals" is perhaps a misnomer, since what are known in English as "Arabic numerals" were initially developed in India by the Hindus around 400 BC. However, because it was Arabs who modified and simplified the symbols (for use on sand tables) and also transmitted this system to the West after the Hindu numerical system found its way to Persia, the numeral system became known as "Arabic". Arabs themselves call the numerals they use "Indian numerals", أرقام هندية, arqam hindiyyah). |
In other words, "Ha! You guys didn't invent Arabic numerals, they're not even Arabic!"
"Yeah thanks, um, we don't call them Arabic numerals, dumbass. You do." 
(imaginary conversation but I'm sure it's happened many times) |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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| And they're different as well. You can see where Koreans get their style of writing '9' from.... |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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| depends. North african countries use the same as we do, but in the eastern arab states they use different numbers. Don't know about Iran or Pakistan. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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ha ha, well yes, i suppose i'm somewhat ignorant myself.  |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: If this is what "nice" Muslims do in Britain.. |
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| Derrek wrote: |
Take a look at these comments flooding this article from the bbc:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4678837.stm
Are people from Britain incapable of saying anything bad about anyone, or are they afraid to say anything but "nice" about people responsible for murdering so many? Does the British press live in fear of offending Muslims?
It's almost as if the BBC is saying, "We love you bombers... oh, you're such NICE people... please know we love you... please... oh, NICE people would never do such a shocking thing!"
If this is what "nice" muslims do in Britain, I'd hate to see what the mean ones would do.
"He was a good man, quiet," said one parent, speaking outside the school. "
"He was really understanding and he did work for the children and parents."
"Neighbours told how he was not well-known in the Dewsbury Muslim community, but they believed he was a "very pleasant" person.
One neighbour said: "He didn't seem to be an extremist. He was not one to talk about religion. He was generally a very nice bloke."
"One neighbour described the family as "very nice people".
"He said: "We all knew them but I wouldn't say I knew them well. They were just a very nice family."
""He was a very kind and calm person. He was respected by everyone."
"Neighbours described the graduate, who studied at Leeds Metropolitan University, as a "good Muslim". Others said he was a "nice lad" who could "get on with anyone". |
I guess if you grow up with a press and president that calls anyone who doesn't 100% follow the American line "worse than Hilter" it seems a little funny.
Curiously those are the kinds of quotes people always give about the American guy who goes postal at work. "He was a quiet fellow. Hard worker." |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:48 am Post subject: |
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| bucheon bum wrote: |
| here's an idea: provide a source. |
No problem.
"Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri that during the battle with Bani Al-Mustaliq they (muslims) captured some females and intended to have sexual relations without impregnating them. So they asked the prophet about coitus interruptus. The prophet said, 'it is better that you should not do it, for Allah has written whom He is going to create till the Day of Resurrection.' "
Sahih Bukhari, vol. 1, bk. 8, no. 371.
When Mohammed says 'it is better that you should not do it', he is talking about coitus interruptus, and not rape, which was obviously taken for granted.
Granted that rape was pretty much universal during military conflict in those days. However, it is rather worrying when it is sanctioned by the prophet of God's last revelation (as muslims see it), and that such a man is held up as a role model for muslims everywhere.
This is just one verse of many whose legacy can be seen in places like Sudan and Mauritania, where slavery and rape are practised by Islamic militias, and across the Islamic world, where women are treated deplorably. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
This is just one verse of many whose legacy can be seen in places like Sudan and Mauritania, where slavery and rape are practised by Islamic militias, and across the Islamic world, where women are treated deplorably. |
Sudan: check out this report from aid workers there in 2002-
"In the Uduk tribe, Taib Musba drove three-inch nails into people's heads," he said. "In northeast Upper Nile, they are gang-raping women and cutting off their breasts; in western Bahr El Ghazal, they are capturing women and selling them as slaves."
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26672
But I guess all that is ok with Bucheon Bum. Tell me, are you fvcking happy to know that your grandchildren may quite likely be forced to convert to Islam in the same way as a Sudanese woman?No-matter which fvcking country they live in.
Every single Muslim country is brutal dictatorship. Islam is on the move and is prepared to extinguish any and all civilizations that get in its way. Muslims are fundamentally non-assimilatible. Many foot soldiers of Islam have been sent to the four corners of the globe to "blend in" as "sleepers" and form future terror cells to await the call for action. Islam stands out among "religions" for its murderous tendency wherever it builds up to "critical mass," typically 20% or more of a given population- (France, Belgium and the Balkins already have at least a 10% Muslim population.)
How many countries have been, or will be, partitioned or redrawn to accommodate Islamic constituencies?
With the world's Muslim population now doubling every 35 years, the trends are clear and these processes are irreversible. Unless the civilized world resists and fights back, Muslims will vanquish the planet within a few decades. Only then will the "civilized world" know what devilish barbarism and uncompromising rigidity constitutes Islam. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:31 am Post subject: |
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| Islam is on the move and is prepared to extinguish any and all civilizations that get in its way. |
My god, to hear you talk, you would think Atilla is at the gates with an army.
When's the last time a Moslem army beat anyone? It's been a while.
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| Many foot soldiers of Islam have been sent to the four corners of the globe to "blend in" as "sleepers" and form future terror cells to await the call for action. |
Since you can't come up with any victorious armies, let's switch it to a conspiracy theory. Let's disguise terrorists as economic refugees and infiltrate the West. You are a little closer to reality here. Some of the immigrants and/or their children have turned out to be terrorists.
That's quite a different thing than what you are saying.
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How many countries have been, or will be, partitioned or redrawn to accommodate Islamic constituencies?
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So far, zero.
Like I said before, you are an alarmist preaching chauvinism and hate. You sound exactly like the terrorists. |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:50 am Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
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How many countries have been, or will be, partitioned or redrawn to accommodate Islamic constituencies?
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So far, zero.
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So far, Cyprus.
Ya-ta, you just keep shooting your mouth off, don't you? |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:58 am Post subject: |
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| Not exactly. The Turks voted to join with the Greeks again, but the latter said no. |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:01 am Post subject: |
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| In '74 the Turks invaded. Who can blame the Greeks for not wanting to "reunify"? |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:06 am Post subject: |
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| Oh blah. The point is that it's certainly nothing to be afraid of. Not in Cyprus' case, that is. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:11 am Post subject: |
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| I should mention that I would have agreed with you two years ago before they had the referendum. |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:14 am Post subject: |
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| Because? I'm not being facetious. I recall the referendum and the results. But I'm not up on the details. |
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