Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Moldy Rutabaga]

[joe_doufu]

[Moldy Rutabaga]

I am not asking for more. In a way, I am asking for less. If there was an automatic mechanism of paycheque reductions for student loan repayments, all of the minions employed to hunt down graduates in default and all of the money lost by the government in contracting out to collection agencies would be saved. I would still pay every penny of the loan. And because my credit rating wouldn't be shot, I would be more likely to buy a house or car and participate in the local economy.

Student loans are not a gift from the Good Samaritans in Ottawa or Washington; they are an investment that benefits the country in most cases, as in our lifetimes graduates statistically pay more taxes and contribute back to the economy. They are also certainly not a gift if we pay them back with interest at prime plus five, as I am.

Ken:>

[joe_doufu]

[Dysupes]

Joe,

No offense meant here but are you actually reading what he's writing? I'm reading the same things you are and coming out with way less aggressive conclusions. I think that if you have a student loan you should be paying it back. I think that if there's interest to be paid, you should be paying it. Moldy isn't even trying to argue with you about that and yet you seem to be concentrated so doggedly on the idea of not paying what is owed that you don't seem to be listening to anything that he is saying.

If interest is being accrued on a loan, what changes are made when it comes to adjustment of the payment schedule? In truth, no change. So, if interest piles up while the bank is getting a cut of your paycheque then how is the bank eating the cost of the loan? Well, it's simple. They're not. You're still paying every month and hey, if the interest keeps building up the bank would probably be even happier. If you're paying every month, no matter how small an amount, that's still an indication to the bank that they have someone who WANTS to pay and is not going to run away. I think Moldy is simply saying that a bank asking for huge sums immediately after graduation is deluding itself and making more work in the long run while also destroying a potentially beneficial business relationship with that customer.

Now, about banks not "tracking you down" or putting collection agencies on the case for fun, that's not even the issue here. The idea is that if banks took a more well thought out approach to this issue they would realize that not only do they create more bureaucracy and red tape by demanding high sums from people who haven't yet gotten on their feet, they also lose future customers. Like any business, if a bank treats you badly then you move your banking elsewhere. The problem is that banks, and apparently you too, see a newly graduated student not being able to pay exorbitant sums immediately back to the bank as equivalent to a deadbeat borrower. This is aboslutely and unequivocally wrong and is a myth that should be dispelled. There is a mountain of difference between a poor student who can't find a well paying job right after graduation and can't make the big payments the bank is demanding (and therefore makes what smaller payments he can) and a guy who maxes out his credit cards and then refuses to pay back the money he's been loaned. If you can't see the difference then this discussion should perhaps end here.

[Moldy Rutabaga]

[joe_doufu]

You like to refer to your fellow countrymen as "the Government", I think, so you can avoid thinking of them as human beings. When you talk about all the money the government should spend on your behalf, you don't want to think that you're talking about other people's money. Other people who won't "benefit" from your getting a good job and paying them back eventually.

That loan is manna from heaven for you, my friend; you would not have gotten it without an income or collateral except through the benevolence of your nation's taxpayers. You're asking them to continue extending such credit to you at uneconomically-low rates of interest, and to set up a bureaucracy to track how much you (and all the other graduates world-wide) are earning every month and deduct a percentage according to some progressive scale according to "to each according to his need, from each according to his ability".

Now I am not Canadian and I don't speak for its taxpayers. But you ought to consider the possibility that the government has other priorities to spend its money on, and people have good things to spend theirmoney on. You're asking for some more of it to be directed to you, and I think you should come up with a more compelling reason than "it would benefit me".

[taobenli]

Joe doufu-

I think you've been beat...you just keep repeating the same lines, beating your head against the wall, even after the person (and now people) you're arguing against has made new and valid points. I find it odd that you continue in this line of argument, as I have liked most of your other posts and have found you witty and intelligent (not that you should care what I think of you, just saying).

I went to college in the U.S. and took out government Stafford and Perkins loans. I began paying them back but am now in grad school and in deferment. Are people who don't pay back their loans out of some misplaced sense of entitlement scum? Yes. Am I grateful for the opportunity to have received an education and gotten loans at low interest rates? Yes. Does that mean that I don't think the (U.S.) student loan system (or often, lack of a system) has major flaws, and could be improved. No!

I have friends that have been totally screwed over by the American financial aid industry. Yes, it's great that they're lending students money, but they ARE making money in the process, it's not just because they're nice folks. It's great that loans are available, but the bigger problem is that education in the U.S. is incredibly and prohibitively expensive. The fact that someone could incur $120k in four years actually doesn't surprise me that much- I know others who have (not that I'm saying that not paying it is a good option).

What do you think, Joe Dofu? I know nothing about finance, but to me it sounds like the other poster knows more about finance than you...

taobenli

[Dan The Chainsawman]

Yet even in the states you can apply for a variety of mechanisms to forbear payments, to get deferments, and consolidate your loans at a lower interest rate. It is also possible to get payment plans extending longer periods of time contingent on income. For the most part being in the hock to the US government is not all that bad as they have worked with me on more than one occasion when I had trouble meeting my full payment amount, or just could not do it at all.

In the end the loan is still paid for in full, one way or another.

[joe_doufu]

[Moldy Rutabaga]

[Dysupes]

Joe,

I really like the majority of your posts on here but I gotta say that you haven't got a leg left to stand on here. You keep repeating your line about "the principles of basic finance" and refuse to accept that these ARE the rules of basic finance! As a bank, I want my money. If I can pile interest on top of interest on top of interest on some poor schmo who's living from paycheque to paycheque anyway and yet still keeps paying as much as he can, I'm laughing! Banks want their money and as much interest as they can get. What moldy is talking falls entirely in line with this objective. C'mon, dude, grab a clue!

[Dysupes]

Joe,

I really like the majority of your posts on here but I gotta say that you haven't got a leg left to stand on here. You keep repeating your line about "the principles of basic finance" and refuse to accept that these ARE the rules of basic finance! As a bank, I want my money. If I can pile interest on top of interest on top of interest on some poor schmo who's living from paycheque to paycheque anyway and yet still keeps paying as much as he can, I'm laughing! Banks want their money and as much interest as they can get. What moldy is talking about falls entirely in line with this objective. C'mon, dude, grab a clue!