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Atassi
Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Location: 평택
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 Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:10 am Post subject: |
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If you follow Islam as it is directed in the Qur'an, you are a barbarian. You beat your wife regularly and confine her to the kitchen. You feel it ok to cut the heads off of infidels (though you may not do it yourself, you certainly don't protest when one of your peers does it) and indoctrinate your kids to behave the same way.
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You proclaim to blame culture, yet you keep attacking religion. Don't confuse the two, and stop misrepresenting the faith. And stop promoting stereotypes. If you want to help, start by learning about the faith so you can help Muslims follow it. Your ignorance of the faith is surprising for someone so talkative. And you have yet to really listen to the others on this forum.
So long~ |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:20 am Post subject: |
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I think it is you who doesn't understand Islamic faith.
To be muslim, you must submit to the laws of allah (tweedle dee tweedle dum) as revealed to the pedophile mohamad. There is no debate, no discussion. The way to act is very clear-cut and straight forward. God talked and mo' wrote. And they must obey.
Islam is a total way of living. There is hardly a single aspect of life (clipping nails perhaps?) that is not strictly regulated. To separate islam from culture in islamic countries is like separating water from water. It just can't be done.
I attack islam because islam IS their culture. This is why, cross culturally, there are so very many point of contract in crazy between muzzies of different geographic location.
Muslims are only moderate, and can have a islamic-separate culture, only if they stop being muslim. Islam is extremism.
And just for giggles, what should I have 'listened to', or from whom, on this site? |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:23 am Post subject: |
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| Laigaiguk wrote: |
| That's just looking at it competely without any facts to back it up. |
indeed...
Luckily for muslims, there are many "laogaiguks" about in the west. ie, westerners who have completely lost knowledge of the christianity that is the foundation of western freedoms.
Westerners are mostly directionless, convictionless materialists now. Easy prey for an aggressively expanding islam. When Christianity was strong, Islam quaked. No longer.
[quote="Atassi"]
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| You may not believe in multiculturalism BJWD |
Like muslims do?
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| but your ethnocentrism borders on barbaric. |
Haha 
Not sure if you're muslim or not. You need to read This to realise how muslims have repaid the welcoming multiculturalism of Europe.
The struggle for the soul of Europe today is every bit as dire and consequential as it was in the 1930s. Then, in Weimar, Germany, the center did not hold, and the light of civilization nearly went out. Today, the continent has entered yet another �Weimar moment.� Will Europeans rise to the challenge posed by radical Islam, or will they cave in once again to the extremists?
As an American living in Europe since 1998, Bruce Bawer has seen this problem up close. Across the continent�in Amsterdam, Oslo, Copenhagen, Paris, Berlin, Madrid, and Stockholm�he encountered large, rapidly expanding Muslim enclaves in which women were oppressed and abused, homosexuals persecuted and killed, �infidels� threatened and vilified, Jews demonized and attacked, barbaric traditions (such as honor killing and forced marriage) widely practiced, and freedom of speech and religion firmly repudiated.
The European political and media establishment turned a blind eye to all this, selling out women, Jews, gays, and democratic principles generally�even criminalizing free speech�in order to pacify the radical Islamists and preserve the illusion of multicultural harmony. The few heroic figures who dared to criticize Muslim extremists and speak up for true liberal values were systematically slandered as fascist bigots. Witnessing the disgraceful reaction of Europe�s elites to 9/11, to the terrorist attacks on Madrid, Beslan, and London, and to the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, Bawer concluded that Europe was heading inexorably down a path to cultural suicide.
http://www.randomhouse.com/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=9780385514729
As for my "Muslims kill their own" comment earlier, you could begin by looking at this:
http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:33 am Post subject: |
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Considering the thread title is about honor killings, you could try reading this too.
Burned Alive: A Victim of the Law of Men
The first true account ever published by a victim of an "honor crime," Souad's testimony is a shocking, moving, and harrowing story of cruelty.
When Souad was seventeen she fell in love. In her Palestinian village, as in so many other villages, sex before marriage is considered a grave dishonor to one's family and is punishable by death. This was her crime. Her brother-in-law was given the task of meting out her punishment. One morning while Souad was washing the family's clothes, he poured gasoline over her and set her on fire.
More than five thousand honor killings are reported every year; many more go unreported.
http://www.twbookmark.com/books/89/0446533467/ |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:38 am Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
| Laigaiguk wrote: |
| That's just looking at it competely without any facts to back it up. |
indeed...
Luckily for muslims, there are many "laogaiguks" about in the west. ie, westerners who have completely lost knowledge of the christianity that is the foundation of western freedoms.
Westerners are mostly directionless, convictionless materialists now. Easy prey for an aggressively expanding islam. When Christianity was strong, Islam quaked. No longer.
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What planet do you live on? Christianity = freedom??? Greece and Rome had the ideals of freedom before Christianity, and implemented them better (though not anything like now with slavery, etc) than Christianity did at that time. And not once in all of Christianity's history has it ever been about freedom, EVER! And I am not counting spiritual freedom, incase you are thinking that. It has been a constant struggle against Christianity to continue to get freedom. You err when you say it's Christianity that founded North America. People trying to get away from tyranny, etc founded North America (actually, at first it was just people). You show me one example of where Christianity afforded people freedom of choice without a fight.
Now, having said that, I HAVE SAID TWICE ISLAM IS SIGNIFICANTLY WORSE THAN CHRISTIANITY. We are talking by several exponent factors too. You are nothing but a fundamentalist Christian bigot so blinded by that 2000 year old story book you keep under your pillow that this is impossible. Have a great life with your Christian freedom (assuming you aren't gay, or a woman, or believe something a little different than the mainstream denominations, etc etc) and that lovely bigotry of yours. |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:46 am Post subject: |
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| laogaiguk wrote: |
Have a great life with your Christian freedom (assuming you aren't gay, or a woman, or believe something a little different than the mainstream denominations, etc etc) and that lovely bigotry of yours. |
A return to christianity is the only thing that can save the west from the advance of islam.
I think its time you dusted off your burkah. |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:34 am Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
| laogaiguk wrote: |
Have a great life with your Christian freedom (assuming you aren't gay, or a woman, or believe something a little different than the mainstream denominations, etc etc) and that lovely bigotry of yours. |
A return to christianity is the only thing that can save the west from the advance of islam.
I think its time you dusted off your burkah. |
Just to get this straight, you suggest that violence and bigotry is needed to defeat violence and bigotry in order to bring us back to the old times of violence and bigotry. |
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yawarakaijin
Joined: 08 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 6:01 am Post subject: |
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Laogaiguk don't you mean to bring us back to the GOOD old times of violence and bigotry? 
Last edited by yawarakaijin on Fri Sep 22, 2006 6:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 6:21 am Post subject: |
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| yawarakaijin wrote: |
| Laogaiguk don't you mean to brings us back to the GOOD old times of violence and bigotry? |
Yes, I did  |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 6:55 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/25/AR2006082501169.html
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America's Muslims Aren't as Assimilated as You Think
By Geneive Abdo
Sunday, August 27, 2006; Page B03
If only the Muslims in Europe -- with their hearts focused on the Islamic world and their carry-on liquids poised for destruction in the West -- could behave like the well-educated, secular and Americanizing Muslims in the United States, no one would have to worry.s
So runs the comforting media narrative that has developed around the approximately 6 million Muslims in the United States, who are often portrayed as well-assimilated and willing to leave their religion and culture behind in pursuit of American values and lifestyle. But over the past two years, I have traveled the country, visiting mosques, interviewing Muslim leaders and speaking to Muslim youths in universities and Islamic centers from New York to Michigan to California -- and I have encountered a different truth. I found few signs of London-style radicalism among Muslims in the United States. At the same time, the real story of American Muslims is one of accelerating alienation from the mainstream of U.S. life, with Muslims in this country choosing their Islamic identity over their American one. |
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Did you read the article?? It said more muslims have become a bit more religous (covering and whatnot). That's it. Oh no! How many americans have become born-again in the past few years? Pretty high # I'd say. Americans in general have become more religous in the past decade or so. Now if the writer had concrete examples, then I might actually be concerned...
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There are more Muslims living outside the Dar al-Islam [Islamic countries, or literally the House of Islam] than ever. So we have to be strategic in our thinking, because people who are our enemies are strategic in their thinking."
The "enemies" Yusuf referred to that day were not non-Muslims, but rather those who use Islam as a rationale for violence. |
Yeah, that doesn't sound like assimilation to me. Looks like sharia is on its way.
The author also blames US foreign policy:
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| It is too soon to say where the growing alienation of American Muslims will lead, but it seems clear that the factors contributing to it will endure. U.S. foreign policy persists in dividing Muslim and Western societies, making it harder still for Americans to realize that there is a difference between their Muslim neighbor and the plotter in London or the kidnapper in Baghdad. |
Eh yeah, sure.. As much as I can't stand Bush, I think this chick is going a little overboard. |
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Doutdes
Joined: 14 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 7:07 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| *the MUSLIM genocide in Sudan |
It's strange. Usually it's historically Christian and Communist countries that commit genocide. But it's good to see the Muslim world catching up.
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| *The enslaved children in Saudi and UAE (camel-jockeys) |
I'd be a camel jockey over a child sex-slave in Thailand any day. Do camels smell better or worse than pedophiles? Which have more back-hair?
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| *Islamic aggression towards anyone who criticise it (Dutch Cartoons, T.V.G., Pope, and headless Christians and Jews the world over). |
Headless Christians and Jews are criticizing Islam? Seriously, do you think it's because of Islam? Why aren't all Muslims killing Catholics because of this? I'm sure it must be hard for Muslims to keep from killing people with all that indroctrination.
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| *Islamic enslaved women |
What's the number one killer of pregnant women in the US? Here's a hint, it isn't Muslims.
They're called terrorists.
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| *The "muslim rape wave" in Sweden and France. |
Because only ethnic French and Swedes are allowed to rape their women.
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| *Suicide bombers who exclusively target civilians. |
Which do you have a problem with, suicide bombers or targetting civilans? Or is it only when the two are combined that it becomes a problem?
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| *Spreading of racist hate literature that calls for the genocide of Jews." |
So Hitler was a Muslim? Anti-semetism is a big deal, but converting Arabs to Christianity isn't going to do much to stop it.
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| And the muzzies did steal the histories of their assimilated masses. The best description I can think of is that they are like the Borg, for TNG fans. |
Um... are you taking crazy pills. How did Buddhists get to Japan or Christians to Korea?
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| Where the Assyrians at? Where did the advances of pre-Islamic Egypt go? All into thin air? |
Egypt was conqured by the Greeks. Then the Romans took it over. It was the Christians, under the Romans, who shut down the pagan temples and burned down the library of Alexandria, and a few hundred years later the Muslims kicked out most of the Christians. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 7:12 am Post subject: |
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I would say that them being more muslim isn't assimilating. Is that what you were suggesting? More head scarfs/veils/burkas etc aren't signs of assimilation. Are they?
What would be assimilation to you?
If I moved to Saudi and became more Christian, would that be a sign of me assimilating to Saudi society?
If I moved to Mexico and became a scientologist, would that be assimilating?
I'm not emotionally committed to my positions. If American muslims are actually assimilating to American society, or, if they aren't showing signs of increased radicalism, I'd like some evidence. If I see the evidence I'll agree with you and change my mind. How about you? |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 7:29 am Post subject: |
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| Doutdes wrote: |
| BJWD wrote: |
| *the MUSLIM genocide in Sudan |
It's strange. Usually it's historically Christian and Communist countries that commit genocide. But it's good to see the Muslim world catching up.
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| *The enslaved children in Saudi and UAE (camel-jockeys) |
I'd be a camel jockey over a child sex-slave in Thailand any day. Do camels smell better or worse than pedophiles? Which have more back-hair?
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| *Islamic aggression towards anyone who criticise it (Dutch Cartoons, T.V.G., Pope, and headless Christians and Jews the world over). |
Headless Christians and Jews are criticizing Islam? Seriously, do you think it's because of Islam? Why aren't all Muslims killing Catholics because of this? I'm sure it must be hard for Muslims to keep from killing people with all that indroctrination.
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| *Islamic enslaved women |
What's the number one killer of pregnant women in the US? Here's a hint, it isn't Muslims.
They're called terrorists.
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| *The "muslim rape wave" in Sweden and France. |
Because only ethnic French and Swedes are allowed to rape their women.
| Quote: |
| *Suicide bombers who exclusively target civilians. |
Which do you have a problem with, suicide bombers or targetting civilans? Or is it only when the two are combined that it becomes a problem?
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| *Spreading of racist hate literature that calls for the genocide of Jews." |
So Hitler was a Muslim? Anti-semetism is a big deal, but converting Arabs to Christianity isn't going to do much to stop it.
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| And the muzzies did steal the histories of their assimilated masses. The best description I can think of is that they are like the Borg, for TNG fans. |
Um... are you taking crazy pills. How did Buddhists get to Japan or Christians to Korea?
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| Where the Assyrians at? Where did the advances of pre-Islamic Egypt go? All into thin air? |
Egypt was conqured by the Greeks. Then the Romans took it over. It was the Christians, under the Romans, who shut down the pagan temples and burned down the library of Alexandria, and a few hundred years later the Muslims kicked out most of the Christians. |
Alright, I was pointing out that perhaps muslims might be responsible for some bad things...
It is a muslim genocide. Where are the muslim protests? The West fought Hitler and stopped the genocide. When is saudi going to attack the Sudan?
Mohammad was a pedophile, but that not withstanding, yes, the world sucks. Muslims hold lots of slaves, today. You know that Phuket -- where most of the child abuse in Thailand happens, is a muslim majority area, yeah? Just sayin. Maybe it is the buddihts. Dunno.
Yes, I think it is because of Islam. The Qur'an clearly states (in the Spoils of war) that those who slam the prophet must be killed.
White men? KKK? Bush? Phizer? Interesting that you point to a country that isn't muslim to prove that muslims don't kill?
Hitler is pushing up flowers, along with most of his followers and a hell of a lot of other people. Remember the big war? He was stopped. The muslims are carrying on his tradition. So, you are saying that because some germans once tried to kill all the jews that today it is kosher for the muzzies to do it too?
I didn't say that Christians and others don't, clown. Christ you are a dumb one. I said that muzzies killed the cultures of the assimilated regions. I didn't say anyone else didn't do it. Do you deny that the muslims did this? Or you just apologize for everything.
Nobody is ever permitted to rape, but muslims seem quite good at it and many even claim that it is ok to rape an infidel.
Yep, the Christians were once the religious plague onto this world. The muslims have now taken the honourable place of #1. The JC crowd were once borg like, and in some places still are.
2 mil a month can buy you some books dude. Get thee to Kyobo. I don't think you are really ready to be in this discussion.
Just because some people did bad things in the past doesn't excuse the muzzies today. Got that? |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 9:13 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
I'm not emotionally committed to my positions. If American muslims are actually assimilating to American society, or, if they aren't showing signs of increased radicalism, I'd like some evidence. If I see the evidence I'll agree with you and change my mind. How about you? |
How can I show signs of radicalism NOT increasing? Let's see, there have been no home-grown terrorists (unlike in London).
I work in the city with the biggest afghan population in North America (fremont, CA). I have yet to see a woman wearing a burka or veil here. # of mosques I pass on the way to work? none that i'm aware of. The subway station I get off has an Afghan food stand. What does the dude sell? Freaking hot dogs (along with the usual snack fare). They might be 100% beef, but I doubt it is halal.
Anyway, show me signs where american muslims are becoming more radical. That article you posted didn't show any; it just showed them becoming more religous. |
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Atassi
Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Location: 평택
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| Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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Doutdes wrote:
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| Egypt was conqured by the Greeks. Then the Romans took it over. It was the Christians, under the Romans, who shut down the pagan temples and burned down the library of Alexandria, and a few hundred years later the Muslims kicked out most of the Christians. |
Small correction: the Muslims didn't kick the Christians out. Most stayed, and many accepted Islam. But there were always Jews and Christians living there.
Good post Doutdes.
BJWD wrote:
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yeah? Just sayin. Maybe it is the buddihts. Dunno.
Yes, I think it is because of Islam. The Qur'an clearly states (in the Spoils of war) that those who slam the prophet must be killed.
White men? KKK? Bush? Phizer? Interesting that you point to a country that isn't muslim to prove that muslims don't kill?
Hitler is pushing up flowers, along with most of his followers and a hell of a lot of other people. Remember the big war? He was stopped. The muslims are carrying on his tradition. So, you are saying that because some germans once tried to kill all the jews that today it is kosher for the muzzies to do it too?
I didn't say that Christians and others don't, clown. Christ you are a dumb one. I said that muzzies killed the cultures of the assimilated regions. I didn't say anyone else didn't do it. Do you deny that the muslims did this? Or you just apologize for everything.
Nobody is ever permitted to rape, but muslims seem quite good at it and many even claim that it is ok to rape an infidel.
Yep, the Christians were once the religious plague onto this world. The muslims have now taken the honourable place of #1. The JC crowd were once borg like, and in some places still are. |
Obviously still misses the whole point of those he responds to. Sounds hateful and irrational to me. |
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