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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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| Which expats are the most unfriendly in Korea? |
| USA |
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17% |
[ 27 ] |
| Canada |
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47% |
[ 73 ] |
| UK |
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18% |
[ 29 ] |
| Australia |
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5% |
[ 8 ] |
| NZ |
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3% |
[ 6 ] |
| South Africa |
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7% |
[ 11 ] |
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| Total Votes : 154 |
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| Author |
Message |
IncognitoHFX
Joined: 06 May 2007
Location: Yeongtong, Suwon
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 Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
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No wonder the stereotype of foreign English teachers being overpaid and under-educated prevails. |
So, for example, you go your whole life without meeting people from a particular country. All you know is stereotypes, and what you see on television, but you don't know any people representative of that culture. You try to get them the benefit of the doubt and not assume "all of them" are "one way".
Then one day, you start meeting them regularly. Not all of them are "that way", but many of them are. So much in fact that the stereotype actually seems to have some truth to it.
We can talk about statistics or we can talk about personal experience, and I never aimed to be talking about the former. This thread was about your own individual experience and thus far has been my individual experience of Americans.
So yeah, thanks. |
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Maserial
Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Location: The Web
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
.
No wonder the stereotype of foreign English teachers being overpaid and under-educated prevails. |
So, for example, you go your whole life without meeting people from a particular country. All you know is stereotypes, and what you see on television, but you don't know any people representative of that culture. You try to get them the benefit of the doubt and not assume "all of them" are "one way".
Then one day, you start meeting them regularly. Not all of them are "that way", but many of them are. So much in fact that the stereotype actually seems to have some truth to it.
We can talk about statistics or we can talk about personal experience, and I never aimed to be talking about the former. This thread was about your own individual experience and thus far has been my individual experience of Americans.
So yeah, thanks. |
Perhaps you're merely experiencing what you wish to experience, or seeing what you want to see? |
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IncognitoHFX
Joined: 06 May 2007
Location: Yeongtong, Suwon
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Maserial wrote: |
| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
.
No wonder the stereotype of foreign English teachers being overpaid and under-educated prevails. |
So, for example, you go your whole life without meeting people from a particular country. All you know is stereotypes, and what you see on television, but you don't know any people representative of that culture. You try to get them the benefit of the doubt and not assume "all of them" are "one way".
Then one day, you start meeting them regularly. Not all of them are "that way", but many of them are. So much in fact that the stereotype actually seems to have some truth to it.
We can talk about statistics or we can talk about personal experience, and I never aimed to be talking about the former. This thread was about your own individual experience and thus far has been my individual experience of Americans.
So yeah, thanks. |
Perhaps you're merely experiencing what you wish to experience, or seeing what you want to see? |
Nah, it's not me it's them. |
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Hank the Iconoclast
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Location: Busan
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
.
No wonder the stereotype of foreign English teachers being overpaid and under-educated prevails. |
So, for example, you go your whole life without meeting people from a particular country. All you know is stereotypes, and what you see on television, but you don't know any people representative of that culture. You try to get them the benefit of the doubt and not assume "all of them" are "one way".
Then one day, you start meeting them regularly. Not all of them are "that way", but many of them are. So much in fact that the stereotype actually seems to have some truth to it.
We can talk about statistics or we can talk about personal experience, and I never aimed to be talking about the former. This thread was about your own individual experience and thus far has been my individual experience of Americans.
So yeah, thanks. |
Jop, All Americans are the same. Congrats. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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| nicholas_chiasson wrote: |
| why if this thread was about any other ethnic group, would everyone be yelling racist? |
What ethnic group are you talking about? This thread is about nationalities |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:56 am Post subject: |
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| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
Americans. They just seem to be more cliquish and loud mouthed than the other groups (if we're going to play the stereotyping game). If there is a big room of Americans, say a hundred, and a big room full of _______ next door, the Americans are guaranteed to be louder.
Also, to demonstrate this: a few weeks ago I was in a room full of people from most of the big seven E-2 countries, including South Africans, Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and Americans.
Something was said to the group and an American in the audience raised his hand and stood up. We thought it was a question. No, he stood up and said (on a completely unrelated note): "I just want to say two things, I love Jesus and I love America! AMEN!" and all the Americans in the room either murmured Amen, screamed "Yeah!" or sat in silence, embarrassed by their kind.
What other country feels the need to demonstrate their pride in public like this? It's revolting. Especially when you say "Jesus". That's doubly revolting and assuming.
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I'm not understanding how the ramblings of one religious nutbar prove your bias against 300 million people, does that make me the stereotypical dumb Newfie?
Seriously, I'd be cautious about voicing those opinions, when you so closely resemble every negative stereotype I've ever heard about earnest, liberal arts grad Canucks and their anti Americanism. I guess I'm a little "embarrassed by my kind", as you put it right now. |
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jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:53 am Post subject: |
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| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Maserial wrote: |
| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
.
No wonder the stereotype of foreign English teachers being overpaid and under-educated prevails. |
So, for example, you go your whole life without meeting people from a particular country. All you know is stereotypes, and what you see on television, but you don't know any people representative of that culture. You try to get them the benefit of the doubt and not assume "all of them" are "one way".
Then one day, you start meeting them regularly. Not all of them are "that way", but many of them are. So much in fact that the stereotype actually seems to have some truth to it.
We can talk about statistics or we can talk about personal experience, and I never aimed to be talking about the former. This thread was about your own individual experience and thus far has been my individual experience of Americans.
So yeah, thanks. |
Perhaps you're merely experiencing what you wish to experience, or seeing what you want to see? |
Nah, it's not me it's them. |
There is truth and falseness to both sides here. Think it through a little. We are given ideas by others. None of our ideas are truly new or original. We are programmed, though we love to view ourselves as clever and creative and inventive. Nonsense really. We are so conditioned to think what we do, it's sick. So, you always view things thing through a veil. That is a fact. There is nothing true in your thoughts. It's a goddamned stupid veil. You really have nothing to do with all this. You are just the product of what others have decided. Sad, I'm afraid, but true. So live with that.
At least all that is what I believe. I may be wrong. |
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IncognitoHFX
Joined: 06 May 2007
Location: Yeongtong, Suwon
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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| peppermint wrote: |
| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
Americans. They just seem to be more cliquish and loud mouthed than the other groups (if we're going to play the stereotyping game). If there is a big room of Americans, say a hundred, and a big room full of _______ next door, the Americans are guaranteed to be louder.
Also, to demonstrate this: a few weeks ago I was in a room full of people from most of the big seven E-2 countries, including South Africans, Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and Americans.
Something was said to the group and an American in the audience raised his hand and stood up. We thought it was a question. No, he stood up and said (on a completely unrelated note): "I just want to say two things, I love Jesus and I love America! AMEN!" and all the Americans in the room either murmured Amen, screamed "Yeah!" or sat in silence, embarrassed by their kind.
What other country feels the need to demonstrate their pride in public like this? It's revolting. Especially when you say "Jesus". That's doubly revolting and assuming.
|
I'm not understanding how the ramblings of one religious nutbar prove your bias against 300 million people, does that make me the stereotypical dumb Newfie?
Seriously, I'd be cautious about voicing those opinions, when you so closely resemble every negative stereotype I've ever heard about earnest, liberal arts grad Canucks and their anti Americanism. I guess I'm a little "embarrassed by my kind", as you put it right now. |
You're just afraid to be anti-PC.
Anyway, if you want to read into that and assume that I think %100 of Americans behave and think in that way, then be my guest. It was not my intent. My intent was to say: if there were a room full of Americans, then those kinds of people would characterize the room, regardless of the rest. This is a stereotype, yes, but it is an accurate one. It's more or less to say, "there are some in every crowd" (of Americans).
If you fill the room with... say, Japanese, this wouldn't happen nearly as much. If you fill it with Koreans, something different would happen.
Now you want to get on my case about stereotyping. Well, I don't think people are all special little butterflies. Most people aren't individualistic enough to break away from the molds they were raised in. These molds exist in every country.
I don't think everyone is the same either.
I'm not the first person in the world to think that large groups of Americans characterize themselves more negatively than other countries. Why do you think there are places in the world where Americans aren't allowed to drink, but Canadians are? Why do you think that American tourists are stereotyped very negatively?
To clarify. Not all Americans. SUBTEXT people! |
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Rob'sdad
Joined: 12 May 2008
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Me. I'm a super asshole. Just ask my wife....but she's a super bitch. So I quess we deserve each other. Fate, brothers, fate |
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Lunar Groove Gardener
Joined: 05 Jan 2005
Location: 1987 Subaru
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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I understand Halifax's *beep* envy.
He states that because he says that something is a fact, it is true.
While his opinion may make him seem like a fool, there
is not much use in attaching a nationality to it(contrary to his belief system).
.
It's easy to do, but it is moronic.
May as well say, "red-haired idiot", or "Mexican.." or "Fat..."
Then say the same thing in front of a friend who is obese, red-headed or Mexican...if you truly don't feel like changing your verbage then you really are an ass.
It simply represents really immature thinking and self-justification.
The kind of thing that others would try to "unteach" given the responsiblities of a teacher.
To say stupid things like this, makes you sound dumb.
To believe them proves you to be dumb.
The fact that you somehow think it is clearly true from your "proof" is
silliness.
I realize that you'll understand just how silly you are in about five years.
Play on.
But try not to teach this carp. |
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nateium
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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I've yet to meet an unfriendly Kiwi, Ozzie, or Irishman.
The last party I went to, this Canadian woman decided to tell me immediately about a youtube video she saw of American soldiers torturing puppies and teasing children in Iraq. This was about 30 seconds after I told her my nationality. That kind of socially retarted behavior is why Canadians are losing this poll. |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
You're just afraid to be anti-PC. |
Nope, just don't much like being tarred with stereotypes about being Canadian because of folks like you. |
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shifter2009
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Location: wisconsin
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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| nateium wrote: |
I've yet to meet an unfriendly Kiwi, Ozzie, or Irishman.
The last party I went to, this Canadian woman decided to tell me immediately about a youtube video she saw of American soldiers torturing puppies and teasing children in Iraq. This was about 30 seconds after I told her my nationality. That kind of socially retarted behavior is why Canadians are losing this poll. |
I've met some unfriendly Kiwis and Irishmen but by and large they've been mostly friendly.
I have a similiar experience being told by a Canadian aquitence about how Americans are so ignorant of Canada and history in general. He went on to tell me how had the South won our civil war that Robert E. Lee would have been president and freed the slaves. I have a ton of incredible cool Canadian friends but also have a lot of little stories like these that makes me wonder whats going on with our friends to the north. |
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IncognitoHFX
Joined: 06 May 2007
Location: Yeongtong, Suwon
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
I understand Halifax's *beep* envy.
He states that because he says that something is a fact, it is true.
While his opinion may make him seem like a fool, there
is not much use in attaching a nationality to it(contrary to his belief system).
.
It's easy to do, but it is moronic.
May as well say, "red-haired idiot", or "Mexican.." or "Fat..."
Then say the same thing in front of a friend who is obese, red-headed or Mexican...if you truly don't feel like changing your verbage then you really are an ass.
It simply represents really immature thinking and self-justification.
The kind of thing that others would try to "unteach" given the responsiblities of a teacher.
To say stupid things like this, makes you sound dumb.
To believe them proves you to be dumb.
The fact that you somehow think it is clearly true from your "proof" is
silliness.
I realize that you'll understand just how silly you are in about five years.
Play on.
But try not to teach this carp. |
Ah hah. So everything is relative, is it? Everyone is unique regardless of culture? All cultures are as equally as open, North Koreans are as open minded as the rest of us and purple is actually the colour blue, if you really think about it?
Cultures do have an affect on people. I wasn't saying that being of the "American race" makes one stupid. America has dozens of races and it has nothing to do with it. I am saying that culturally, as a whole, Americans are known to exhibit A, B, and C behaviour. Not individually, but in groups.
Now, how is that stupid? Many North Koreans are brainwashed. Is that a stupid thing to say? Many intelligent people would agree with me there. What about Christians? Nazis during World War II?
Obviously you don't realize the depth and affect of culture.
That, and I have a lot of experiences dealing with Americans. None of these experiences come from sitting in a dorm room full of beret-wearing-vegans making protest pickets.
Search my name (I don't feel like reposting) and look at my posts about when I worked for an American cellular company (Sprint / Nextel) and dealt exclusively with Americans via telephone. Of the Americans I dealt with, a significant percentage of them couldn't do simple math. It made me hate my job.
I had to explain to a third of my customers that if you only paid $20 towards a $500 bill from the month before, then $480 would be carried over. It was the most frequent issue when they called in. Sometimes it took two hours to explain these because the customers became so hot headed and emotional over it.
In situations where geography was involved (I said I was in Canada), around %30 (guesstimate: it was quite common) of them did not know where Canada was.
Now, considering I spoke to more than ten thousand different Americans at that job, from all different parts of the country, wouldn't it be semi-reasonable for me to make a conclusion based on Americans? Such as, many Americans are bad at Mathematics and Geography, moreso than other first world countries?
I can also say that many Americans are terrible with money and financial planning. Most of the callers were on credit card accounts, and the customers with the lowest levels of income made the worst decisions regarding plan options and generally had the highest bills. They'd pay $20 (for the cheapest plan) with a $0.60 per minute rate over 30 minutes of use, then use 300 minutes.
I tried to convince them to move up to the $60 plan, which had 300 minutes included and they would say: "no! That's too expensive!" and attack me for trying to "sell" to them. They would save hundreds of dollars a month, but they didn't understand the concept.
This was very, very common. I'm sincere, you have absolutely no idea how common this was coming from a diverse segment of the demographic. The high income bracket wasn't all that much better at these things, either.
Oh boy, oh boy can I ever draw conclusions about Americans from that. Not all Americans, mind you (I shouldn't have to say that).
I bet if I took Halifax out of my name you wouldn't have made any links there, too. There is a stereotype about Halifax. I agree with it. University students in Halifax are doubly as pretentious as their counterparts in other places because Halifax has major "culture envy" of places like Toronto. That's an observation.
Anyway, don't call me an idiot. Ad hominem attacks don't serve your purpose and since your argument was shit, you had no right to call me an idiot in the first place.
One last thing. If I'm wrong, why was Bush elected... twice?
| peppermint wrote: |
| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
You're just afraid to be anti-PC. |
Nope, just don't much like being tarred with stereotypes about being Canadian because of folks like you. |
Uh huh. You mean, you don't want to be "tarred" with being right?  |
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shifter2009
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Location: wisconsin
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Lunar Groove Gardener wrote: |
I understand Halifax's *beep* envy.
He states that because he says that something is a fact, it is true.
While his opinion may make him seem like a fool, there
is not much use in attaching a nationality to it(contrary to his belief system).
.
It's easy to do, but it is moronic.
May as well say, "red-haired idiot", or "Mexican.." or "Fat..."
Then say the same thing in front of a friend who is obese, red-headed or Mexican...if you truly don't feel like changing your verbage then you really are an ass.
It simply represents really immature thinking and self-justification.
The kind of thing that others would try to "unteach" given the responsiblities of a teacher.
To say stupid things like this, makes you sound dumb.
To believe them proves you to be dumb.
The fact that you somehow think it is clearly true from your "proof" is
silliness.
I realize that you'll understand just how silly you are in about five years.
Play on.
But try not to teach this carp. |
Ah hah. So everything is relative, is it? Everyone is unique regardless of culture? All cultures are as equally as open, North Koreans are as open minded as the rest of us and purple is actually the colour blue, if you really think about it?
Cultures do have an affect on people. I wasn't saying that being of the "American race" makes one stupid. America has dozens of races and it has nothing to do with it. I am saying that culturally, as a whole, Americans are known to exhibit A, B, and C behaviour. Not individually, but in groups.
Now, how is that stupid? Many North Koreans are brainwashed. Is that a stupid thing to say? Many intelligent people would agree with me there. What about Christians? Nazis during World War II?
Obviously you don't realize the depth and affect of culture.
That, and I have a lot of experiences dealing with Americans. None of these experiences come from sitting in a dorm room full of beret-wearing-vegans making protest pickets.
Search my name (I don't feel like reposting) and look at my posts about when I worked for an American cellular company (Sprint / Nextel) and dealt exclusively with Americans via telephone. Of the Americans I dealt with, a significant percentage of them couldn't do simple math. It made me hate my job.
I had to explain to a third of my customers that if you only paid $20 towards a $500 bill from the month before, then $480 would be carried over. It was the most frequent issue when they called in. Sometimes it took two hours to explain these because the customers became so hot headed and emotional over it.
In situations where geography was involved (I said I was in Canada), around %30 (guesstimate: it was quite common) of them did not know where Canada was.
Now, considering I spoke to more than ten thousand different Americans at that job, from all different parts of the country, wouldn't it be semi-reasonable for me to make a conclusion based on Americans? Such as, many Americans are bad at Mathematics and Geography, moreso than other first world countries?
I can also say that many Americans are terrible with money and financial planning. Most of the callers were on credit card accounts, and the customers with the lowest levels of income made the worst decisions regarding plan options and generally had the highest bills. They'd pay $20 (for the cheapest plan) with a $0.60 per minute rate over 30 minutes of use, then use 300 minutes.
I tried to convince them to move up to the $60 plan, which had 300 minutes included and they would say: "no! That's too expensive!" and attack me for trying to "sell" to them. They would save hundreds of dollars a month, but they didn't understand the concept.
This was very, very common. I'm sincere, you have absolutely no idea how common this was coming from a diverse segment of the demographic. The high income bracket wasn't all that much better at these things, either.
Oh boy, oh boy can I ever draw conclusions about Americans from that. Not all Americans, mind you (I shouldn't have to say that).
I bet if I took Halifax out of my name you wouldn't have made any links there, too. There is a stereotype about Halifax. I agree with it. University students in Halifax are doubly as pretentious as their counterparts in other places because Halifax has major "culture envy" of places like Toronto. That's an observation.
Anyway, don't call me an idiot. Ad hominem attacks don't serve your purpose and since your argument was shit, you had no right to call me an idiot in the first place.
One last thing. If I'm wrong, why was Bush elected... twice?
| peppermint wrote: |
| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
You're just afraid to be anti-PC. |
Nope, just don't much like being tarred with stereotypes about being Canadian because of folks like you. |
Uh huh. You mean, you don't want to be "tarred" with being right? |
Why were you asking them georgraphy questions as worker for sprint? |
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