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rocknrose
Joined: 19 May 2011
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 Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:20 am Post subject: Don't Go! |
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| I went to the Yeouido branch a few weeks ago with a friend, and we were the only native speakers. A few of the members have studied abroad for a year or two, and the rest have just taken the required English classes from the Korean school system. Koreans go there to practice English for free. By listening to their horrible grammar and pronunciation for hours with barely any breaks, we feared that we would start picking up their poor grammar if we go there regularly. My friend said it was like teaching one of those free-talking hakwon classes without getting paid shit. |
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nathanrutledge
Joined: 01 May 2008
Location: Marakesh
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| Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 6:42 pm Post subject: Re: Don't Go! |
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| rocknrose wrote: |
| I went to the Yeouido branch a few weeks ago with a friend, and we were the only native speakers. A few of the members have studied abroad for a year or two, and the rest have just taken the required English classes from the Korean school system. Koreans go there to practice English for free. By listening to their horrible grammar and pronunciation for hours with barely any breaks, we feared that we would start picking up their poor grammar if we go there regularly. My friend said it was like teaching one of those free-talking hakwon classes without getting paid shit. |
I find that surprising, considering the President of that club is Australian.
So, YTM is not for you - there are 30 other clubs in the area that may be of interest. I'm a member at Seoul TM, and we have a translator for the National Assembly, a lawyer from one of the top firms in Seoul, a couple of university professors, as well as a handful of Americans/Canadians.
If you'd like to see diversity, KHTM has an Indian president, a Mexican VP, a Polish (I think?) VP, as well as Americans, Canadians, and others.
The whole point of Toastmasters is to have a "mutually supportive, positive learning environment where every member has the opportunity to practice oral communication and leadership skills which in turn foster self confidence and personal growth." So yes, everyone is learning, INCLUDING you. |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 7:21 pm Post subject: Re: Don't Go! |
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| nathanrutledge wrote: |
| rocknrose wrote: |
| I went to the Yeouido branch a few weeks ago with a friend, and we were the only native speakers. A few of the members have studied abroad for a year or two, and the rest have just taken the required English classes from the Korean school system. Koreans go there to practice English for free. By listening to their horrible grammar and pronunciation for hours with barely any breaks, we feared that we would start picking up their poor grammar if we go there regularly. My friend said it was like teaching one of those free-talking hakwon classes without getting paid shit. |
I find that surprising, considering the President of that club is Australian.
So, YTM is not for you - there are 30 other clubs in the area that may be of interest. I'm a member at Seoul TM, and we have a translator for the National Assembly, a lawyer from one of the top firms in Seoul, a couple of university professors, as well as a handful of Americans/Canadians.
If you'd like to see diversity, KHTM has an Indian president, a Mexican VP, a Polish (I think?) VP, as well as Americans, Canadians, and others.
The whole point of Toastmasters is to have a "mutually supportive, positive learning environment where every member has the opportunity to practice oral communication and leadership skills which in turn foster self confidence and personal growth." So yes, everyone is learning, INCLUDING you. |
The new KHTM executive team has 2 Koreans, 2 Canadians, an American, a Mexican, a Brazilian, a Kenyan, and an Indian. About half of the attendees are foreign, if not more, and there aren't too many business speeches like you'll find at clubs in corporate neighborhoods. |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 7:22 pm Post subject: Re: Don't Go! |
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| rocknrose wrote: |
| My friend said it was like teaching one of those free-talking hakwon classes without getting paid shit. |
How often was your friend on stage? |
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rocknrose
Joined: 19 May 2011
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| Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:08 am Post subject: Re: Don't Go! |
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I was surprised to find that we were the only native speakers there too since the YTM Meetup page had Wisam Safi as the organizer, whom I assume is the Australian guy you were referring. He wasn't there, and the person leading the meeting was a Korean girl named Anna. Nathanrutledge and Trip, I'll definitely check out KHTM. Thanks for the info.  I'm looking forward to seeing a diverse group of English speakers.
| nathanrutledge wrote: |
I find that surprising, considering the President of that club is Australian.
So, YTM is not for you - there are 30 other clubs in the area that may be of interest. I'm a member at Seoul TM, and we have a translator for the National Assembly, a lawyer from one of the top firms in Seoul, a couple of university professors, as well as a handful of Americans/Canadians.
If you'd like to see diversity, KHTM has an Indian president, a Mexican VP, a Polish (I think?) VP, as well as Americans, Canadians, and others.
The whole point of Toastmasters is to have a "mutually supportive, positive learning environment where every member has the opportunity to practice oral communication and leadership skills which in turn foster self confidence and personal growth." So yes, everyone is learning, INCLUDING you. |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 6:49 am Post subject: |
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This Saturday, at Roofers, a unique Toastmasters club named Roastmasters is having a 2 hour event from 5-7pm. Roastmasters allows controversial speech topics, heckling, and Q and A sessions during speeches. Plus folks are drinking and there'll be an after party.
www.roastmasters.org |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 12:35 am Post subject: |
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Bump.
To all newbies and veterans in Korea, if you are looking to network, improve your speaking skills on stage, and party with good people, visit a Toastmasters club. Some are business oriented, some are very diverse, and some push creativity and entertainment. Find a list of all clubs at toastmasters.org or www.koreatm.org. |
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DejaVu
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Location: Your dreams
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| Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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By the name of the group, I thought there would be joy involved (as well as alcohol). However, delving deeper into the specifics, I see that the meetings in my town are on a weekend morning. Who the hell would give a toast on a Saturday morning?
So, I guess Roastmasters is the only one held at night which allows free speech and eloquent word choices? Is there a Roastmasters in Busan?
I don't see this information on the website. |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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| DejaVu wrote: |
By the name of the group, I thought there would be joy involved (as well as alcohol). However, delving deeper into the specifics, I see that the meetings in my town are on a weekend morning. Who the hell would give a toast on a Saturday morning?
So, I guess Roastmasters is the only one held at night which allows free speech and eloquent word choices? Is there a Roastmasters in Busan?
I don't see this information on the website. |
Each TM club can name themselves whatever they want. Some examples are Seoul Toastmasters, KH Toastmasters, South River Toastmasters, Schoolmasters, Roastmasters, etc.
In Busan, your best bet is the Wed. night Busan Toastmasters.
To clarify TM clubs, they started in the 1920s to help people give after-dinner speeches and toasts. Now, you'll rarely find a "toast" in a Toastmasters club. Mostly you'll hear 5-10 minute prepared speeches, impromptu speech sessions, and evaluations. Many clubs are full of business people, other clubs are full of students (like PNU TM in Busan on Saturday), and other clubs are full of creative and diverse people giving storytelling and personal stories. Most go out afterwards for drinks, and toasting happens more then.
Roastmasters is the only club that specifically invites freedom of speech. The line is drawn at giving intentionally offensive speeches, over-stereotyping, and other derogatory things like racism and sexism. KH Toastmasters (Hyehwa every Tuesday) is one of the most diverse clubs in terms of kinds and cultures of people. KH is usually more accepting of colorful language and edgy topics. No topics are universally off-limits in Toastmasters clubs, but each club is unique and make their rules and bylaws for what is acceptable amongst their members. |
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DejaVu
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Location: Your dreams
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| Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Trip wrote: |
| DejaVu wrote: |
By the name of the group, I thought there would be joy involved (as well as alcohol). However, delving deeper into the specifics, I see that the meetings in my town are on a weekend morning. Who the hell would give a toast on a Saturday morning?
So, I guess Roastmasters is the only one held at night which allows free speech and eloquent word choices? Is there a Roastmasters in Busan?
I don't see this information on the website. |
Each TM club can name themselves whatever they want. Some examples are Seoul Toastmasters, KH Toastmasters, South River Toastmasters, Schoolmasters, Roastmasters, etc.
In Busan, your best bet is the Wed. night Busan Toastmasters.
To clarify TM clubs, they started in the 1920s to help people give after-dinner speeches and toasts. Now, you'll rarely find a "toast" in a Toastmasters club. Mostly you'll hear 5-10 minute prepared speeches, impromptu speech sessions, and evaluations. Many clubs are full of business people, other clubs are full of students (like PNU TM in Busan on Saturday), and other clubs are full of creative and diverse people giving storytelling and personal stories. Most go out afterwards for drinks, and toasting happens more then.
Roastmasters is the only club that specifically invites freedom of speech. The line is drawn at giving intentionally offensive speeches, over-stereotyping, and other derogatory things like racism and sexism. KH Toastmasters (Hyehwa every Tuesday) is one of the most diverse clubs in terms of kinds and cultures of people. KH is usually more accepting of colorful language and edgy topics. No topics are universally off-limits in Toastmasters clubs, but each club is unique and make their rules and bylaws for what is acceptable amongst their members. |
Ah, I was hoping to work on some racial rhetoric. It's not about what I believe but about how persuasive I can be (which is the point of public speaking).
So racism and sexism have been banned regardless of how logical an argument is made for them? I'll have to think twice about joining such a hypocritical society.
Thanks for the information, though! Maybe an evening gathering would be worth a shot to knock around some socks. |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 12:26 am Post subject: |
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| DejaVu wrote: |
| Trip wrote: |
| DejaVu wrote: |
By the name of the group, I thought there would be joy involved (as well as alcohol). However, delving deeper into the specifics, I see that the meetings in my town are on a weekend morning. Who the hell would give a toast on a Saturday morning?
So, I guess Roastmasters is the only one held at night which allows free speech and eloquent word choices? Is there a Roastmasters in Busan?
I don't see this information on the website. |
Each TM club can name themselves whatever they want. Some examples are Seoul Toastmasters, KH Toastmasters, South River Toastmasters, Schoolmasters, Roastmasters, etc.
In Busan, your best bet is the Wed. night Busan Toastmasters.
To clarify TM clubs, they started in the 1920s to help people give after-dinner speeches and toasts. Now, you'll rarely find a "toast" in a Toastmasters club. Mostly you'll hear 5-10 minute prepared speeches, impromptu speech sessions, and evaluations. Many clubs are full of business people, other clubs are full of students (like PNU TM in Busan on Saturday), and other clubs are full of creative and diverse people giving storytelling and personal stories. Most go out afterwards for drinks, and toasting happens more then.
Roastmasters is the only club that specifically invites freedom of speech. The line is drawn at giving intentionally offensive speeches, over-stereotyping, and other derogatory things like racism and sexism. KH Toastmasters (Hyehwa every Tuesday) is one of the most diverse clubs in terms of kinds and cultures of people. KH is usually more accepting of colorful language and edgy topics. No topics are universally off-limits in Toastmasters clubs, but each club is unique and make their rules and bylaws for what is acceptable amongst their members. |
Ah, I was hoping to work on some racial rhetoric. It's not about what I believe but about how persuasive I can be (which is the point of public speaking).
So racism and sexism have been banned regardless of how logical an argument is made for them? I'll have to think twice about joining such a hypocritical society.
Thanks for the information, though! Maybe an evening gathering would be worth a shot to knock around some socks. |
Toastmasters International does not allow discrimination based on race, religion, sexual orientation, etc. The Roastmasters club has 4 rules for attendees:
1. 1. Attendees must be comfortable listening to all topics including controversial topics such as politics, sex, religion, curse words, etc. Speeches don�t have to be controversial, but they can be.
2. Free expression should be coupled with professionalism. Evidence and examples should back up opinions, and speakers should refrain from over-stereotyping or bashing.
3. What happens in Roastmasters stays in Roastmasters. Roastmasters is a safe haven for open-minded discussion. Speakers� topics, opinions, and actions should not be discussed outside the meeting unless the speaker gives direct approval.
4. Attendees must follow all South Korean laws including free speech laws.
These 4 rules are made to conform to the TM Intl. Constitution, and to keep things civil when controversial and opposing opinions are going back and forth in meetings.
If a speaker said, "I personally don't like green people and here is why," the audience would listen, and if the speaker chose to keep heckling allowed during the speech, I'm sure there might be a few questions or quips. If the speaker said, "All green people are scum," then the bylaws have been broken and the club officers would do their best to work with the speaker so future presentations are framed more professionally.
In one meeting, a foreign man stated that women in his country don't work and the society, both men and women, like it that way because it lets the women raise the kids personally as opposed to babysitters. Another person felt this was sexist, but the man wasn't stereotyping all women, just pointing out what the culture and he, individually, preferred.
I like to give this example when explaining these fine lines: If an ajumma shoves you on the subway, it's ok to say, "I hate that woman, she was an ass." It's not alright to say, "All ajummas are asses."
Quite honestly, in most meetings, most speeches are not controversial. Speakers enjoy giving presentations outside of business rooms, while drinking a beer, and having the chance to deal with a few interruptions and handle Q & A afterwards from the stage. The club was formed to allow people more freedom and interaction, not to create arguments. It has worked well and is balanced 99% of the time. |
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nathanrutledge
Joined: 01 May 2008
Location: Marakesh
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| Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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I'll just add that you are more then welcome to come to some of the more open clubs (KH, Yeouido, RM) and give a speech on pretty much any topic you want, but in all my time I've only heard ONE speech that discussed a controversial subject that actually came across well done. What I'm saying is that most people who decide to give a speech on an edgy topic usually suck at it and end up embarrassing and alienating themselves.
So feel free to come and give a speech, but more than likely you'll be criticized not for the content, but the delivery.
Good luck. |
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Trip
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:53 pm Post subject: |
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| nathanrutledge wrote: |
| I've only heard ONE speech that discussed a controversial subject that actually came across well done. |
Was it the one about guns? |
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nathanrutledge
Joined: 01 May 2008
Location: Marakesh
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| Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Trip wrote: |
| nathanrutledge wrote: |
| I've only heard ONE speech that discussed a controversial subject that actually came across well done. |
Was it the one about guns? |
It was about humping like monkeys without shoes on. Also fighting, I think. |
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